PRIV Oyster

[CyrusWuff]

I don't get why they don't just let Underground staff apply the discount. The option is right there on the machines! It's a completely bonkers. TfL are making it very clear how reluctant they are to honour the discount.

The logic, such as it is, is that it doesn't give a discount on LU so their staff aren't allowed to apply it. Suppressing it on LU machines but not EL/LO machines apparently isn't an option either.

 

[Haywain]

Agreed there was no choice overall with a new TIS, but perhaps provisioning a separate Oyster Ticket Stop style machine could have been the solution, accounting issues aside. But we know the overall higher-up view of ticket offices and adding even more equipment was unlikely to go.

The requirements for providing and maintaining Oyster equipment would almost certainly have been seen as uneconomic, especially with increasing use of contactless payment for travel in the TfL area.

 

[Watershed]

The logic, such as it is, is that it doesn't give a discount on LU so their staff aren't allowed to apply it. Suppressing it on LU machines but not EL/LO machines apparently isn't an option either.

Indeed but that seems a complete irrelevance to me. It's just the sort of high handed attitude I'd expect from TfL.

 

[Haywain]

Imagine if LU staff were told they could only buy Priv tickets at a handful of stations in Somerset, but had to work out which they ones!

 

[trek]

I don't get why they don't just let Underground staff apply the discount. The option is right there on the machines! It's a completely bonkers. TfL are making it very clear how reluctant they are to honour the discount.

At this point I agree.

I understood originally because the discount wasn't for use on LU. But that was back when lots of ticket offices had Oyster capability (all of Thameslink, LO, TfL Rail as it was, and in years prior to that several more TOCs offices too), and the number of shared LU/NR stations only staffed by LU was very small.

But since then, Thameslink ticket offices cannot do it, plus the Elizabeth line has opened with several LU stations where NR services call, particularly in central London. In theory now LU staff at these mixed stations now have to have a greater ticket understanding anyway (there is a whole section of their Ticket & Revenue guides dedicated to a specific set of stations where NR services call, it has information on things like Interrail passes and e-tickets). On top of this you can't get the PRIV discount set at any London termini except Paddington (current issues aside) which would require many non-Londoners to make a specific journey just to have their discount set.

And then on top of all this, because E-Tickets aren't avaliable on many London routes (I can't remember if you can do ToD on the central area machines either), Rail Staff Travel online is not a viable alternative either (plus it would also be significantly more expensive). And on top of that PRIV discounted paper fares are not avaliable to/from the central stations on the Elizabeth line, at least via RST online. And beyond all that, good luck trying to get let in by quoting the National Rail Conditions or Carriage that you should be able to travel due to be unable to purchase an appropriate ticket (some stations are far more freindly about this than others, mind).

The logic, such as it is, is that it doesn't give a discount on LU so their staff aren't allowed to apply it. Suppressing it on LU machines but not EL/LO machines apparently isn't an option either.

I thought the black older style POMs didn't have it, but the silver, tall, large screened ones (which are present at all the EL stations plus an increasing number of LU stations) were the ones that couldn't be set differently depending on which location they were at, and therefore the function exists on all of them? I may be wrong.

Does anyone know whether this is the same union you all belong to, or a different one? If its different, is it worth raising as a dispute against the other union with your union? Its a pretty sad state of affairs when two railway unions conspire to cost each others members money.

It's being raised. Most of the staff would be under the same union, the RMT, but on top of all this a wider set of issues I won't get into here.

 

[WarJan]

I don't get why they don't just let Underground staff apply the discount. The option is right there on the machines! It's a completely bonkers. TfL are making it very clear how reluctant they are to honour the discount.

Exactly! The option is right there. Silly, there is a tfl staff email that is publicly available on Tfl.gov but I was going to email to ask about this.

Note since then a brief has apparently gone round to many staff (apparently during the second half of the week) NOT to issue the discount.

Do you know why this was sent. We are perfectly entitled to this discount.

 

[trek]

Do you know why this was sent. We are perfectly entitled to this discount.

Officially, no. Unofficially, yes but because it's unofficial I don't want to add to spectulation, but because it's already been said by others here, I will say that the union issue mentioned partly (only partly mind) comes in to it.

 

[WarJan]

At this point I agree.

I understood originally because the discount wasn't for use on LU. But that was back when lots of ticket offices had Oyster capability (all of Thameslink, LO, TfL Rail as it was, and in years prior to that several more TOCs offices too), and the number of shared LU/NR stations only staffed by LU was very small.

But since then, Thameslink ticket offices cannot do it, plus the Elizabeth line has opened with several LU stations where NR services call, particularly in central London. In theory now LU staff at these mixed stations now have to have a greater ticket understanding anyway (there is a whole section of their Ticket & Revenue guides dedicated to a specific set of stations where NR services call, it has information on things like Interrail passes and e-tickets). On top of this you can't get the PRIV discount set at any London termini except Paddington (current issues aside) which would require many non-Londoners to make a specific journey just to have their discount set.

And then on top of all this, because E-Tickets aren't avaliable on many London routes (I can't remember if you can do ToD on the central area machines either), Rail Staff Travel online is not a viable alternative either (plus it would also be significantly more expensive). And on top of that PRIV discounted paper fares are not avaliable to/from the central stations on the Elizabeth line, at least via RST online. And beyond all that, good luck trying to get let in by quoting the National Rail Conditions or Carriage that you should be able to travel due to be unable to purchase an appropriate ticket (some stations are far more freindly about this than others, mind).


I thought the black older style POMs didn't have it, but the silver, tall, large screened ones (which are present at all the EL stations plus an increasing number of LU stations) were the ones that couldn't be set differently depending on which location they were at, and therefore the function exists on all of them? I may be wrong.

It's being raised. Most of the staff would be under the same union, the RMT, but on top of all this a wider set of issues I won't get into here.

That's very true.
What tfl should do is issue oyster cards preloaded with the discount via a form to be filled via RST

Also RST online , you can buy tickets thankfully via London but it's about getting it as cheap as if it were to be made on oyster with the discount.

For example Watford Junction to Euston is more expensive than Watford North to Euston as the latter fare is set by WMT and the former is set by LO/Tfl.

You can do say Watford North to Ealing B, which would include tube / access to Paddington.

It's frustrating to have to pay more to enter London but RST ONLINE is a life saver as I will make sure now I buy more tickets including the Cross London tube travel until they come to a solution on this matter

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 5 Nov 2022 ==

Officially, no. Unofficially, yes but because it's unofficial I don't want to add to spectulation, but because it's already been said by others here, I will say that the union issue mentioned partly (only partly mind) comes in to it.

LO , MTR staff are entitled to a Priv card.
They also get a Oyster card thrown in, which includes free travel anywhere with an oyster reader including NR stations.

We are entitled to the same equivalent via oyster.

Maybe RDG should withdraw their Priv cards. However safeguarded staff would highly likely lose their Priv all rail oyster

 

[TFN]

I haven't been able to get mine done at Canary Wharf EL, Woolwich EL or Custom House EL. The staff also won’t do railcard Discounts either. It’s becoming ridiculous. It is because of some dispute unfortunately.

I do receive both a TfL Staff oyster and a PRIV but unfortunately live in Southeastern land. RST online is a lifesaver in that aspect.

 

[Watershed]

The requirements for providing and maintaining Oyster equipment would almost certainly have been seen as uneconomic, especially with increasing use of contactless payment for travel in the TfL area.

...and yet they haven't made any public progress (or even made a commitment) towards enabling discounts to be applied to contactless.

For example Watford Junction to Euston is more expensive than Watford North to Euston as the latter fare is set by WMT and the former is set by LO/Tfl.

It's actually cheaper, and set by WMT (at least in terms of paper fares).

 

[AndrewE]

Maybe RDG should withdraw their Priv cards. However safeguarded staff would highly likely lose their Priv all rail oyster

Don't forget it is a contractual obligation, with no excuses for "forgetting" to continue to make it available. Doesn't matter if it is inconvenient, or a new machine has to have a special bit programmed in. There is no excuse at all for inventing rules (or removing staff( which make it impossible to
get the concession. I would be tempted to vault a barrier and invite them to prosecute me as they had made the concession impsiible to claim>

Every rail travel provider has to honour the contract as concessions in retirement are effectively delayed remuneration.

 

[trek]

They also get a Oyster card thrown in, which includes free travel anywhere with an oyster reader including NR stations.

This isn't true. They get a TfL Staff Oyster (plus a nominee card, which is more generous than the PRIV spouse/dependant cards in that you don't have to get a solicitor declaration for a relationship, you merely have to live at the same address, plus it can be used by the nominee for commuting).

It can however only be used on TfL sevices, plus a small handful of specific NR services (if you are interested I can dig out exactly which, but you might be able to find the document online anyway). It is certainly not all, and there are a few examples of where staff passes, especially nominees have been reported for incorrectly using these over in the Disputes and Prosecutions section.

LO , MTR staff are entitled to a Priv card.

This is true. But they are also entitled and could very well need the Oyster NR PRIV discount themselves. I know several MTR and LO staff who make use of it, particularly for example if travelling in South London.

What tfl should do is issue oyster cards preloaded with the discount via a form to be filled via RST

Perhaps, I've noticed Rail Staff Travel now do their own smartcard for seasons. (As a somewhat off-topic aside, on top of this I also have a 16-25 railcard for discounts on the tube. That often requires further explaination when having discounts set to make sure I don't have the wrong one updated/removed. So I would personally need a way of setting both on one card...)

Also RST online , you can buy tickets thankfully via London but it's about getting it as cheap as if it were to be made on oyster with the discount.

For example Watford Junction to Euston is more expensive than Watford North to Euston as the latter fare is set by WMT and the former is set by LO/Tfl.

You can do say Watford North to Ealing B, which would include tube / access to Paddington.

It's frustrating to have to pay more to enter London but RST ONLINE is a life saver as I will make sure now I buy more tickets including the Cross London tube travel until they come to a solution on this matter

I am well aware. I live inside the zones, but I used to buy a particular out of area zonal area ticket regularly and ditch part of the journey. It saves a significant amount especially over a day return Oyster tube journey, and even more so at peak times, if I am travelling to tube stations where the + Cross London marker is allowed.

However since the Elizabeth Line I can now make the vast majority of my journeys into Central London by only using NR services, I rarely use the tube in Zone 1. It generally costs me no more than 90p each way. A paper ticket would cost me upwards of £2 (particularly expensive if I'm only making a single day journey), and also be useless to go somewhere like Tottenham Court Road, as break of journey is not permitted in the central section and there are no paper fares avaliable. Hence the Oyster discount is very important for me.

Don't forget it is a contractual obligation, with no excuses for "forgetting" to continue to make it available. Doesn't matter if it is inconvenient, or a new machine has to have a special bit programmed in. There is no excuse at all for inventing rules (or removing staff( which make it impossible to
get the concession. I would be tempted to vault a barrier and invite them to prosecute me as they had made the concession impsiible to claim>

Every rail travel provider has to honour the contract as concessions in retirement are effectively delayed remuneration.

Indeed it would be hugely toxic and impossible to remove any safeguarded concessions without legal ramifications. There are still plenty of ex-BR safeguarded staff working at firms like Siemens, Alstom and others who have travel facilities still, along with lots of long serving TfL/LU staff with NR validity on their PTACs.

Argueably TfL could take their NR services out of the PRIV scheme for non-safeguarded staff, however it would create its own issues and almost certainly result in disputes for LO and MTR staff as whilst these facilities are non-contractual many of them will have had them for years. It also doesn't solve the situation at all as there are lots of London area services where Oyster is the de-facto standard (and cheapest) payment mechanism where TfL does not manage the service, plus lots of examples of inter-avaliable routes, such as GWR (for now) and GA on XR and Chiltern with the Met Line. Indeed the upcoming RST Online Leisure Card for certain Network Rail staff will not be valid on the Elizabeth Line and London Overground (except, by my reading, and confusingly, where the ticket has a + cross London validity on the Elizabeth Line central area due to how that service is treated paper ticket wise in that regard).

 

[WarJan]

Don't forget it is a contractual obligation, with no excuses for "forgetting" to continue to make it available. Doesn't matter if it is inconvenient, or a new machine has to have a special bit programmed in. There is no excuse at all for inventing rules (or removing staff( which make it impossible to
get the concession. I would be tempted to vault a barrier and invite them to prosecute me as they had made the concession impsiible to claim>

Every rail travel provider has to honour the contract as concessions in retirement are effectively delayed remuneration.

LOL. That made me chuckle. You're right we should, I might vault a barrier tomorrow and say 'prosecute me', technically that would be allowed and we are within our right to explain that we don't have the correct concession available to us, maybe not vaulting the barrier XD but having free journeys until this is sorted.

This isn't true. They get a TfL Staff Oyster (plus a nominee card, which is more generous than the PRIV spouse/dependant cards in that you don't have to get a solicitor declaration for a relationship, you merely have to live at the same address, plus it can be used by the nominee for commuting).

It can however only be used on TfL sevices, plus a small handful of specific NR services (if you are interested I can dig out exactly which, but you might be able to find the document online anyway). It is certainly not all, and there are a few examples of where staff passes, especially nominees have been reported for incorrectly using these over in the Disputes and Prosecutions section.


This is true. But they are also entitled and could very well need the Oyster NR PRIV discount themselves. I know several MTR and LO staff who make use of it, particularly for example if travelling in South London.


Perhaps, I've noticed Rail Staff Travel now do their own smartcard for seasons. (As a somewhat off-topic aside, on top of this I also have a 16-25 railcard for discounts on the tube. That often requires further explaination when having discounts set to make sure I don't have the wrong one updated/removed. So I would personally need a way of setting both on one card...)


I am well aware. I live inside the zones, but I used to buy a particular out of area zonal area ticket regularly and ditch part of the journey. It saves a significant amount especially over a day return Oyster tube journey, and even more so at peak times, if I am travelling to tube stations where the + Cross London marker is allowed.

However since the Elizabeth Line I can now make the vast majority of my journeys into Central London by only using NR services, I rarely use the tube in Zone 1. It generally costs me no more than 90p each way. A paper ticket would cost me upwards of £2 (particularly expensive if I'm only making a single day journey), and also be useless to go somewhere like Tottenham Court Road, as break of journey is not permitted in the central section and there are no paper fares avaliable. Hence the Oyster discount is very important for me.


Indeed it would be hugely toxic and impossible to remove any safeguarded concessions without legal ramifications. There are still plenty of ex-BR safeguarded staff working at firms like Siemens, Alstom and others who have travel facilities still, along with lots of long serving TfL/LU staff with NR validity on their PTACs.

Argueably TfL could take their NR services out of the PRIV scheme for non-safeguarded staff, however it would create its own issues and almost certainly result in disputes for LO and MTR staff as whilst these facilities are non-contractual many of them will have had them for years. It also doesn't solve the situation at all as there are lots of London area services where Oyster is the de-facto standard (and cheapest) payment mechanism where TfL does not manage the service, plus lots of examples of inter-avaliable routes, such as GWR (for now) and GA on XR and Chiltern with the Met Line. Indeed the upcoming RST Online Leisure Card for certain Network Rail staff will not be valid on the Elizabeth Line and London Overground (except, by my reading, and confusingly, where the ticket has a + cross London validity on the Elizabeth Line central area due to how that service is treated paper ticket wise in that regard).

Very interesting read Trek.

I firstly would advise two separate oyster cards.

I use one for Tube with a Railcard as I travel a lot of peak.

The NR oyster was very useful for the years I had it , I use to do padd to lst 65p obviously paper ticket now it is over £2 I think for a return but still thats over £1 each way

You now have to buy a ticket from Acton Main - Stratford to benefit from using the EL from say Pad to Lst which is a massive pain but a temporary workaround.

I hope this gets sorted. I do hold the toc smartcard season from RST very handy to have avoids having to go to ticket offices although I have no active season.

 

[trek]

LOL. That made me chuckle. You're right we should, I might vault a barrier tomorrow and say 'prosecute me', technically that would be allowed and we are within our right to explain that we don't have the correct concession available to us, maybe not vaulting the barrier XD but having free journeys until this is sorted.

At the end of the day at most stations we should be allowed to be let through under National Rail Conditions of Carriage as there are no appropriate ticket purchasing facilities. But good luck with most LU gates...

I firstly would advise two separate oyster cards.

I use one for Tube with a Railcard as I travel a lot of peak.

Is that just because it could be cheaper to "split" when doing a through TfL/NR journey, as the whole journey would be charged at railcard/peak rate if all on one card?

In that case it may be true but to be honest it's extremely rare for me to make a through mixed-mode TfL/NR journey, and the NR line I live on uses the LU fare scale anyway, so if I do go into London by train, then connect to the tube to my destination, its generally just cheaper to pay railcard/peak rate for the whole journey - especially if I'm ending my journey in Zone 1 in the evening peak as the whole lot is charged at off peak rates (whereas a Zone 1 only tube journey would be charged at £2.50).

If I'm crossing London by tube to/from home I usually go for a paper + cross London ticket anyway as it's usually cheaper overall to do that, often even if I'm not using part of the ticket. Or sometimes it's cheaper to buy an off peak ticket to the first stop outside the zones and break my journey at the station where I'm actually going. Lots of tricks about, I could go on all day about them.

The NR oyster was very useful for the years I had it , I use to do padd to lst 65p obviously paper ticket now it is over £2 I think for a return but still thats over £1 each way

You now have to buy a ticket from Acton Main - Stratford to benefit from using the EL from say Pad to Lst which is a massive pain but a temporary workaround.

Well indeed, but that Acton Main Line to Stratford ticket on paper is £3.45 return or £2.10 single, vs a Zone 1 only Oyster priv fare of 65p, which is a pretty big difference. Plus I have heard Paddington ticket office is often reluctant to sell such tickets for arbitrary reasons.

But overall I'm feeling lucky I managed to get the discount on my card already as I do make use of it regularly!

 

[WarJan]

At the end of the day at most stations we should be allowed to be let through under National Rail Conditions of Carriage as there are no appropriate ticket purchasing facilities. But good luck with most LU gates...


Is that just because it could be cheaper to "split" when doing a through TfL/NR journey, as the whole journey would be charged at railcard/peak rate if all on one card?

In that case it may be true but to be honest it's extremely rare for me to make a through mixed-mode TfL/NR journey, and the NR line I live on uses the LU fare scale anyway, so if I do go into London by train, then connect to the tube to my destination, its generally just cheaper to pay railcard/peak rate for the whole journey - especially if I'm ending my journey in Zone 1 in the evening peak as the whole lot is charged at off peak rates (whereas a Zone 1 only tube journey would be charged at £2.50).

If I'm crossing London by tube to/from home I usually go for a paper + cross London ticket anyway as it's usually cheaper overall to do that, often even if I'm not using part of the ticket. Or sometimes it's cheaper to buy an off peak ticket to the first stop outside the zones and break my journey at the station where I'm actually going. Lots of tricks about, I could go on all day about them.



Well indeed, but that Acton Main Line to Stratford ticket on paper is £3.45 return or £2.10 single, vs a Zone 1 only Oyster priv fare of 65p, which is a pretty big difference. Plus I have heard Paddington ticket office is often reluctant to sell such tickets for arbitrary reasons.

But overall I'm feeling lucky I managed to get the discount on my card already as I do make use of it regularly!

That's right 3.45 is the cheapest I believe possible Priv journey to cross London. Still £1.75 each way as you said compared to 65p. Plus in ticket form. I would also break the ticket if it's cheaper too.

If RST pull me up on this purchasing habit I will explain the issues we have been having.

Can you remind me where you got the NR only discount again, your previous post stating this will be lost in the posts .

Regarding splitting the oyster cards.
Avoid any tube journey with the NR only card as you'll be charged a flat Adult fare .

Example Shenfield - Pad - Maida Vale. NR only Oyster would cost you the Adult Fare .

Instead you'd tap out at Paddington and switch to your Second Railcard oyster card and use that to go to maida vale to avoid being charged a full fare.
Although sometimes it can be cheaper to use the Railcard oyster for the whole journey.

 

[Sleepy]

A special paper PRIV single for use on Elisabeth line only is available for £1.55 (LST to 0792 route Elisabeth line)

 

[trek]

Can you remind me where you got the NR only discount again, your previous post stating this will be lost in the posts .

Ealing Broadway but this was I believe prior to the some staff being briefed not to do it (and having gone the evening before and no one being there who was able to). Current advice is to go to in office hours so a manager is hopefully present who can do it if anything.

Regarding splitting the oyster cards.
Avoid any tube journey with the NR only card as you'll be charged a flat Adult fare .

Example Shenfield - Pad - Maida Vale. NR only Oyster would cost you the Adult Fare .

Instead you'd tap out at Paddington and switch to your Second Railcard oyster card and use that to go to maida vale to avoid being charged a full fare.
Although sometimes it can be cheaper to use the Railcard oyster for the whole journey.

Fair enough, I get what you mean. It's rare for me to make journeys like that but I've been meaning to switch over to my new Elizabeth Line design Oyster so I may leave one of my two with only one discount set on it.

A special paper PRIV single for use on Elisabeth line only is available for £1.55 (LST to 0792 route Elisabeth line)

Excellent info.

 

[MikeWh]

I haven't been able to get mine done at Canary Wharf EL, Woolwich EL or Custom House EL. The staff also won’t do railcard Discounts either.

Can you just confirm; are you saying that staff at EL stations refuse to add normal NR Railcard discounts?

I will be getting a railcard in 6 weeks so I will mystery shop this and kick up serious stink if this turns out to be true.

 

[WarJan]

Can you just confirm; are you saying that staff at EL stations refuse to add normal NR Railcard discounts?

I will be getting a railcard in 6 weeks so I will mystery shop this and kick up serious stink if this turns out to be true.

Yes I have asked a mixture of LO and EL, they wouldn't even get up of the chair in the ticket office. They said speak to underground. This was when I just asked about a discount before saying it was a staff card. So I don't think they would even bother to add a Railcard. you may have more luck in an underground ticket hall who are much more cooperative in adding Railcards. Although the smaller stations you'll have to ask them to go over to the

Large terminal tube stations will have tube staff probably helping people at the ticket machines anyway.

Ealing Broadway but this was I believe prior to the some staff being briefed not to do it (and having gone the evening before and no one being there who was able to). Current advice is to go to in office hours so a manager is hopefully present who can do it if anything.


Fair enough, I get what you mean. It's rare for me to make journeys like that but I've been meaning to switch over to my new Elizabeth Line design Oyster so I may leave one of my two with only one discount set on it.



Excellent info.

In this case I may give it a miss until I'm next in Ealing instead of purposely going there. That's if what the fellow user said that a brief was sent out.

I think I went to all the stops that I did, after this brief was circulated. I think if I went a week or 2 ago, I'd have had more luck

 

[TFN]

Can you just confirm; are you saying that staff at EL stations refuse to add normal NR Railcard discounts?

Yes they all say go to an LU staffed station to do Railcard discounts as well.

 

[RJ]

Can you just confirm; are you saying that staff at EL stations refuse to add normal NR Railcard discounts?

I will be getting a railcard in 6 weeks so I will mystery shop this and kick up serious stink if this turns out to be true.

Something doesn’t seem right - a situation where there are new stations with no ticket office which don’t have any staff available to help customers with these TVM functions seems a bit off!

 

[virgintrain1]

This all seems ridiculous. Having started the thread with my success. I'm not looking forward to my trip to London tomorrow to attempt to renew my Oyster. Will try Paddington Elizabeth line again. So am I best asking to speak to the supervisor?

If that doesn't work then RSTL need to send out an urgent email regarding what they expect us to actually do! Common sense would be to allow temporary free travel until this is resolved but I won't hold my breath.

Just feels such a ridiculous situation. I will making a lot of travel over the next few months. Not sure what I can do. Pay full price and try and claim back? Or argue on the gate lines each time?

 

[CyrusWuff]

This all seems ridiculous. Having started the thread with my success. I'm not looking forward to my trip to London tomorrow to attempt to renew my Oyster. Will try Paddington Elizabeth line again. So am I best asking to speak to the supervisor?

As far as I'm aware, stations in the "Crossrail Central Operating Section" (i.e. Paddington - Whitechapel/Abbey Wood, inclusive) are unable to set the "Priv NR Only" discount for non-safeguarded staff (i.e. those who started on or after 1st April 1996), even where EL staff are present, as they are mostly managed by London Underground so don't have EL TVMs.

Conversely, Safeguarded staff should be able to get the "Priv All" discount set at most London Underground stations, though they need to get a form authorised by Rail Staff Travel if it's the first time or their discount has expired and "dropped off" of the card.

 

[virgintrain1]

As far as I'm aware, stations in the "Crossrail Central Operating Section" (i.e. Paddington - Whitechapel/Abbey Wood, inclusive) are unable to set the "Priv NR Only" discount for non-safeguarded staff (i.e. those who started on or after 1st April 1996), even where EL staff are present, as they are mostly managed by London Underground so don't have EL TVMs.

The latest update from rail staff travel states:
Any Elizabeth line station can apply the discount and this is currently the only place the discount can be applied. If this is not the case we have a real brake down in communication between RST and TfL/MTR.

 

[CyrusWuff]

The latest update from rail staff travel states:
Any Elizabeth line station can apply the discount and this is currently the only place the discount can be applied. If this is not the case we have a real brake down in communication between RST and TfL/MTR.

I suspect the key words there are "Elizabeth Line station". Paddington, Bond Street, Tottenham Court Road, Farringdon, Liverpool Street and Whitechapel are all London Underground stations that also have Elizabeth Line platforms. Stratford is also managed by London Underground, though there's a National Rail ticket office, and Custom House is presumably still managed by DLR.

I'd hazard a guess that Canary Wharf and/or Woolwich may be able to set the NR only discount, as they're the only standalone stations on the core.

 

[PupCuff]

Rail Staff Travel seriously need to get a grip on this. It amounts to a de facto withdrawal of priv travel on these services by TfL. If their staff who qualify for priv travel on NR were limited to buying their priv tickets from a couple of suburban stations and only then if the right member of staff happened to be on shift that day, they'd rightly be kicking off.

It's particularly grating when there should be no technical reason that any station with a LU machine would be unable to set it, other than someone somewhere issuing staff an instruction that they mustn't do so.

 

[Ralph Ayres]

Priv travel arrangements were one of the things rather glossed over in TfL's eagerness to close ticket offices. Part of the resistance by station staff both formally in terms of union agreement and informal local reluctance or claimed lack of training is because staff are expected to carry out admin functions including juggling forms etc in mid-air while being distracted by questions from other passengers which would far better be done in a more controlled environment at a desk in some form of office.

 

[Haywain]

Priv travel arrangements were one of the things rather glossed over in TfL's eagerness to close ticket offices. Part of the resistance by station staff both formally in terms of union agreement and informal local reluctance or claimed lack of training is because staff are expected to carry out admin functions including juggling forms etc in mid-air while being distracted by questions from other passengers which would far better be done in a more controlled environment at a desk in some form of office.

So the people to take that out on are other railway staff? Nice.

 

[RJ]

Rail Staff Travel seriously need to get a grip on this. It amounts to a de facto withdrawal of priv travel on these services by TfL. If their staff who qualify for priv travel on NR were limited to buying their priv tickets from a couple of suburban stations and only then if the right member of staff happened to be on shift that day, they'd rightly be kicking off.

It's particularly grating when there should be no technical reason that any station with a LU machine would be unable to set it, other than someone somewhere issuing staff an instruction that they mustn't do so.

To be fair on RSTL, they’ve negotiated and set something up for us. Over the years circumstances beyond their control (obsolescent TIS, troublesome TVM updates) have meant an ever decreasing number of stations can load the discount.

With the current setup all the problems seem to on the side of the station operator. TfL don’t want the discount loaded on the Underground where it isn’t valid and they have good reasons for that. They even have a taskforce who continually removes discounts that are incorrectly loaded.

Hopefully RSTL don’t just chuck the agreement due to all the problems and the issues at Elizabeth Line stations can be resolved. I’ll make some enquiries within TfL to see if they can help us by revealing where the NR Only discounts are successfully being loaded.

 

[island]

I have to say all this sounds like utter childishness from numerous sides.