Cheshire Bus News (was East Cheshire Bus News)

[6Gman]

What are shops though with no customers? You have to welcome in people so that the shops have customers. If you're so worried about shops being isolated, why not move the bus station out to the empty land off Dunwood Way near Mcdonalds and then dying retail can take all of the land and they can have the largest service road they want? Clearly shop deliveries are more important than the shops having customers.

Believe it or not a certain senior councillor (now retired) actually suggested something close to that some years ago!

When I saw the plans I too shared your concern that car parking seemed to be prioritised above bus passengers, but I wasn't surprised.

Really??? Double-deckers are only needed for the most intense bus services such as route 192 from Manchester to Hazel Grove, and even then not in the evenings.

I've seen standing passengers on double deckers on the 84.

 

[LOL The Irony]

Well, looking at their current timetable it's a pretty consistent hourly service - M-F from Altrincham leave at 7.03, 8.30, then 45 past the hour from 9-2, then 15.55 and xx.50 for the last 3 journeys.

On a Saturday it's a consistent xx.45 departure from Altrincham.

Going the other way from Knutsford it's 07.10, 08.20, 09.25 then xx.30 from 10 - 1, xx.35 from 2 - 5pm then 19.05. Saturday is a consistent xx.30 departure.

Their timetable seems pretty reasonable - the route isn't direct in that it goes via Wilmslow. Google Maps reckons a car journey from Altrincham to Wilmslow via Hale Barns is 25 mins, the bus timetable is about 30 mins - reasonable given that allows for 5 stops of 1 minute each.

From Wilmslow to Knutsford the car is about 25 mins, the bus is about 35 mins - again allowing for stops that's not unreasonable.

The old timings were perfectly achievable outside of peak hours and I don't think traffic conditions have worsened since then. Possibly even improved as more people work from home than before the pandemic. Whilst I admit 55 minutes was overly ambitious to the point of near impossible to keep during the peak, there was no need to change them off peak to what they are now. And you mention the timetable there, try getting a bus into Knutsford during the hour of 07:00. Go ahead, try it. We'll both be waiting for an eternity (or until D&G or Cheshire East decide that the town deserves a bus into town during the hour of 07:00) The timings are the second most obvious culprit of D&G malaise behind their undersized buses.

I assume some of the morning / afternoon timings are driven a bit by local school times - they don't want to be leaving a couple of minutes before the end of the school day for example. Whereas weekends are more consistent.

Yes, because instead of running the school contract separately, D&G try interworking it with the 88, which on a good day, results in this mess of a so called timetable and a bad day, cancelled journeys. Of course, this was all enabled by Cheshire East Council and their ridiculous plan to commercialise the town circular and combine the town's 3 main bus routes into 1, exacerbated by D&G's poisoned chalice in the form of the short lived 88A.

 

[A0]

The old timings were perfectly achievable outside of peak hours and I don't think traffic conditions have worsened since then. Possibly even improved as more people work from home than before the pandemic. Whilst I admit 55 minutes was overly ambitious to the point of near impossible to keep during the peak, there was no need to change them off peak to what they are now. And you mention the timetable there, try getting a bus into Knutsford during the hour of 07:00. Go ahead, try it. We'll both be waiting for an eternity (or until D&G or Cheshire East decide that the town deserves a bus into town during the hour of 07:00) The timings are the second most obvious culprit of D&G malaise behind their undersized buses.

Yes, because instead of running the school contract separately, D&G try interworking it with the 88, which on a good day, results in this mess of a so called timetable and a bad day, cancelled journeys. Of course, this was all enabled by Cheshire East Council and their ridiculous plan to commercialise the town circular and combine the town's 3 main bus routes into 1, exacerbated by D&G's poisoned chalice in the form of the short lived 88A.

Let's not lose sight of the fact that Knutsford has a population of less than 15,000 - it's a *very* small town. The furthest points of the town are 2 miles apart, virtually *all* of the town is less than a mile from its railway station.

 

[LOL The Irony]

Let's not lose sight of the fact that Knutsford has a population of less than 15,000 - it's a *very* small town. The furthest points of the town are 2 miles apart, virtually *all* of the town is less than a mile from its railway station.

Knutsford is just an example. If D&G take over, expect this to be the entirety of Cheshire outside of Warrington and Crewe.

 

[MotCO]

RouteOne reports that D&G has registered some of the cancelled services. https://www.route-one.net/news/dg-bus-registers-threatened-arriva-winsford-routes/

Centrebus subsidiary D&G Bus has wasted no time in signalling an intention to grow its network in Cheshire after Arriva North West announced proposals to close depots there at Macclesfield and Winsford.


D&G has registered what it says are replacements for Arriva’s 31, 37 and 84 services that currently operate from Winsford. Those routes are centred on Crewe, where D&G already has a depot. Commercial Director David Brookes adds that the operator intends “to step in and cover as much of the Arriva network as we can.” D&G already competes with Arriva North West on the Crewe to Macclesfield axis.


Mr Brookes adds that while other services currently operated by Arriva from Macclesfield and Winsford have not yet been registered by D&G Bus, it “will be speaking to local council officers to see what else we can do to help.”


He continues: “We can’t guarantee that we can cover all the Arriva routes, but we will make every effort to keep local buses moving in the area.” D&G is now seeking both drivers and engineers to resource the new services, for which it will soon hold recruitment events.


In addition to its Crewe depot and headquarters in Stoke-on-Trent, D&G has smaller premises near Northwich. Its existing presence in Cheshire has been built via a combination of contract wins and commercial services taken up from other operators and it already covers many areas served by Arriva from the under-threat depots.


Arriva North West announced the proposed closure of Macclesfield and Winsford depots on 27 February. It is currently consulting with employees, but staff at both locations have been told that the likely final day of operation will be 22 April.

 

[markymark2000]

Warrington's has been built on a corner at one end of its shopping centre - quite a trek to the other end, far more so than Crewe for example. Runcorn was built that way - it was built as a new town, but most of those designs have aged badly and are often replaced with something quite different, mainly because the users don't like them.

Hardly a trek in Warrington, Iceland is attached to the bus station, the shops are up the escalator and you're in the shopping centre. Some shops are further than others but that is the same for a car park or normal pedestrian entrance.

There are plenty of better designs that don't banish buses and their passengers to back side streets.

Let me switch this one to you, find me any bus station where the deliveries get more of a thought than bus passengers or motorists? The hierarchy should be access for walking, cycling, buses, cars and then worry about deliveries (still can be done using service yards. Car park above the service yard, absolutely anything. This is the worst option for land use but the people who come off worst, bus passengers.

I've seen standing passengers on double deckers on the 84.

You could avoid standing loads on the 84 if you run it half hourly to Chester. You'd still need deckers or a duplicate for Tarvin to Tarporley students as that is a busy bus.

The old timings were perfectly achievable outside of peak hours and I don't think traffic conditions have worsened since then. Possibly even improved as more people work from home than before the pandemic. Whilst I admit 55 minutes was overly ambitious to the point of near impossible to keep during the peak, there was no need to change them off peak to what they are now. And you mention the timetable there, try getting a bus into Knutsford during the hour of 07:00. Go ahead, try it. We'll both be waiting for an eternity (or until D&G or Cheshire East decide that the town deserves a bus into town during the hour of 07:00) The timings are the second most obvious culprit of D&G malaise behind their undersized buses.

It'd be so easy to cut some time off the 88. Easy take 5 minutes off Altrincham to Wilmslow.

 

[daodao]

You could avoid standing loads on the 84 if you run it half hourly to Chester. You'd still need deckers or a duplicate for Tarvin to Tarporley students as that is a busy bus. It'd be so easy to cut some time off the 88. Easy take 5 minutes off Altrincham to Wilmslow.

I can't believe that rural Cheshire merits double deck buses for regular bus services. For busy school runs, separate school buses should be run.

As someone who drives regularly from Altrincham to Macclesfield, it takes significantly longer nowadays on the Altrincham to Wilmslow segment because of traffic congestion due to:

• frequent road works with traffic lights
• narrow road with parking obstructions at the western end of Hale Road
• schools traffic e.g. outside St Ambrose College in Hale Barns and Gorsey Bank primary school in Wilmslow
• extra traffic lights and increased traffic in Hale Barns outside Booths
• increased traffic and extra traffic lights around junction 6 of the M56 and the warehouses/airport car parks just east of it
• reduced speed limits which need to be observed because of a fixed camera in Hale Barns and frequent mobile cameras

The congestion is such that on my morning commute, I often use the back roads via Mobberley and Great Warford and then go via Over Alderley. Congestion at Broken Cross and Monks Heath also adds to delays for the Knutsford-Macclesfield segment of route 88. D&G's timings seem reasonable to me.

 

[Robertj21a]

The 84 at least (Chester extension), needs double deckers, 31 and 37 at a push need them (D&G have none thought they could source from elsewhere in the Centrebus group )

With the actual Arriva Depots, they could be bought/leased afterwards (Stagecoach leased Arriva Guildford, after it closed, unless they wanted a different site

Where else does the Centrebus group have deckers? I can only think of a few already heavily used at Leicester and Grantham.

 

[markymark2000]

I can't believe that rural Cheshire merits double deck buses for regular bus services. For busy school runs, separate school buses should be run.

What an outdated view of how buses should run. Complete waste of resources while also killing off local buses. Well done!

Linking schools and local service is a great way to make routes more viable and help significantly towards keeping more buses on the road in peak times. The 84 is also not a 'rural route', it is a key interurban service linking up 2 rather large towns and 2 large villages and a city.

As someone who drives regularly from Altrincham to Macclesfield, it takes significantly longer nowadays on the Altrincham to Wilmslow segment because of traffic congestion due to:

• frequent road works with traffic lights
• narrow road with parking obstructions at the western end of Hale Road
• schools traffic e.g. outside St Ambrose College in Hale Barns and Gorsey Bank primary school in Wilmslow
• extra traffic lights and increased traffic in Hale Barns outside Booths
• increased traffic and extra traffic lights around junction 6 of the M56 and the warehouses/airport car parks just east of it
• reduced speed limits which need to be observed because of a fixed camera in Hale Barns and frequent mobile cameras

The congestion is such that on my morning commute, I often use the back roads via Mobberley and Great Warford and then go via Over Alderley. Congestion at Broken Cross and Monks Heath also adds to delays for the Knutsford-Macclesfield segment of route 88. D&G's timings seem reasonable to me.

Another typical response from another naysayer who prefers for buses to sit around all day and passengers not get anywhere! Go and look at all of D&Gs tracking. It's freely available on bustimes.org. You will see quite clearly that in the vast majority of cases, buses leaving Altrincham get to Hale Barns around a minute early and buses are getting to Wilmslow around 8 minutes before departure (granted there is 3 minutes recovery time in here but still, quite early). Cutting 5 minutes off the journey would be perfectly fine considering the amount the buses are sat around. Look at the evidence of regular tracking rather than making up reasons why buses will take longer and justifying the indefensible actions of a shambolic bus company which should have been shut down years ago!

 

[Snex]

I've seen a lot of discussion about bus stations. Personally I never get the obsession with them in smaller towns unless they're interchanging with rail or something where you might have a wait because of timings with other services.

Can't we just have a few bus stops around the whole town centre and have buses looping around serving them all instead even if they're padded out so they have some layover?

Personally I'd much rather be able to get on/off the bus next to where I want to be than have a fancy building but have to walk 20 minutes to get to it because it's in the complete wrong place but maybe that's me. It's not like I'm going to be there for longer than 5 minutes anyway and nor are most other people.

 

[sonic2009]

Really??? Double-deckers are only needed for the most intense bus services such as route 192 from Manchester to Hazel Grove, and even then not in the evenings.

Deckers will be needed on some services, the 37 in the morning 0655 Crewe - Northwich being one - picks up school and college pupils along the route - even the 0712 Crewe - Macclesfield is busy as far as Sandbach. This doesn't need a decker but needs a big bus - a Solo or similar wouldn't work. Although we don't know what D&G plan to do, we will await the timetables to come out.

I'm not certain on the fleet of D&G but i suspect they will have to source something.

 

[M803UYA]

Deckers will be needed on some services, the 37 in the morning 0655 Crewe - Northwich being one - picks up school and college pupils along the route - even the 0712 Crewe - Macclesfield is busy as far as Sandbach. This doesn't need a decker but needs a big bus - a Solo or similar wouldn't work. Although we don't know what D&G plan to do, we will await the timetables to come out.

I'm not certain on the fleet of D&G but i suspect they will have to source something.

There might be no need for D&G to source double deck vehicles. If long Enviro 200s or Dart SLFs were operated (or Optare Versas) they would have a seating capacity of around 38 passengers with standing capacity for another 20. You're then moving around 60 people in the peak hours - so a fully loaded bus twice a day. Uncomfortable but perfectly legal!

A double decker will shift around 85-90 passengers in the peak when the seating and standing capacity is taken into consideration. If you're clever you can target workings which will need them and bring them out solely for that working. Whilst they're excellent movers of people they're also quite thirsty on fuel. The larger Darts D&G operate will have better fuel consumption and might be the extent of what they provide for this new work they're taking on.

 

[Simon75]

There might be no need for D&G to source double deck vehicles. If long Enviro 200s or Dart SLFs were operated (or Optare Versas) they would have a seating capacity of around 38 passengers with standing capacity for another 20. You're then moving around 60 people in the peak hours - so a fully loaded bus twice a day. Uncomfortable but perfectly legal!

A double decker will shift around 85-90 passengers in the peak when the seating and standing capacity is taken into consideration. If you're clever you can target workings which will need them and bring them out solely for that working. Whilst they're excellent movers of people they're also quite thirsty on fuel. The larger Darts D&G operate will have better fuel consumption and might be the extent of what they provide for this new work they're taking on.

Off peak , especially school holidays both the 84 and 31 can be busy

 

[GusB]

Reported yesterday on the Route One website, D&G are registering replacements for routes 31, 37 and 84.

D&G Bus registers threatened Arriva Winsford routes - routeone

D&G Bus has signalled its intention to grow in Cheshire after Arriva North West announced plans to close depots in Winsford and Macclesfield.

www.route-one.net

Centrebus subsidiary D&G Bus has wasted no time in signalling an intention to grow its network in Cheshire after Arriva North West announced proposals to close depots there at Macclesfield and Winsford.

D&G has registered what it says are replacements for Arriva’s 31, 37 and 84 services that currently operate from Winsford. Those routes are centred on Crewe, where D&G already has a depot. Commercial Director David Brookes adds that the operator intends “to step in and cover as much of the Arriva network as we can.” D&G already competes with Arriva North West on the Crewe to Macclesfield axis.

Mr Brookes adds that while other services currently operated by Arriva from Macclesfield and Winsford have not yet been registered by D&G Bus, it “will be speaking to local council officers to see what else we can do to help.”

He continues: “We can’t guarantee that we can cover all the Arriva routes, but we will make every effort to keep local buses moving in the area.” D&G is now seeking both drivers and engineers to resource the new services, for which it will soon hold recruitment events.

In addition to its Crewe depot and headquarters in Stoke-on-Trent, D&G has smaller premises near Northwich. Its existing presence in Cheshire has been built via a combination of contract wins and commercial services taken up from other operators and it already covers many areas served by Arriva from the under-threat depots.

Arriva North West announced the proposed closure of Macclesfield and Winsford depots on 27 February. It is currently consulting with employees, but staff at both locations have been told that the likely final day of operation will be 22 April.

 

[M803UYA]

Off peak , especially school holidays both the 84 and 31 can be busy

It'll be interesting to see whether (or not) D&G acquires some double deck vehicles for the additional/expanded services.

 

[6Gman]

I've seen a lot of discussion about bus stations. Personally I never get the obsession with them in smaller towns unless they're interchanging with rail or something where you might have a wait because of timings with other services.

Can't we just have a few bus stops around the whole town centre and have buses looping around serving them all instead even if they're padded out so they have some layover?

Personally I'd much rather be able to get on/off the bus next to where I want to be than have a fancy building but have to walk 20 minutes to get to it because it's in the complete wrong place but maybe that's me. It's not like I'm going to be there for longer than 5 minutes anyway and nor are most other people.

I actually suggested that for Crewe when replacement of the c.1960 bus station was first suggested (I was a councillor at the time).

It was not a popular suggestion!

To be fair, it depends on the nature of the place. If most services are decent frequency urban routes on-street is more attractive than if there are a lot of longer distance services with thin frequencies.

 

[Simon75]

I actually suggested that for Crewe when replacement of the c.1960 bus station was first suggested (I was a councillor at the time).

It was not a popular suggestion!

To be fair, it depends on the nature of the place. If most services are decent frequency urban routes on-street is more attractive than if there are a lot of longer distance services with thin frequencies.

Though with Crewe, having street stops isn't really practical, plus no drivers rest area

 

[M60lad]

Regarding bigger buses I know High Peak have currently got the Citaroes in their fleet so I wonder whether these could transfer over to D&G to operate the former Winsford routes.

 

[darloscott]

Regarding bigger buses I know High Peak have currently got the Citaroes in their fleet so I wonder whether these could transfer over to D&G to operate the former Winsford routes.

They’ve just freed a handful up with the new E200s going in as well…

 

[sonic2009]

Cheshire West have published a statement on their website yesterday. I've also heard from a member of Northwich Town Council who attended a conference last night on other matters, that there are 3 potential operators interested in plugging gaps across the Arriva Network.

Update on replacement Arriva bus routes in the Borough | Cheshire West and Chester Council

In support of its efforts to protect local bus services across the borough, the Council has welcomed the news that registrations for the bus routes 31, 37 and 84 have now been submitted to the Traffic Commissioner from bus operator D&G.

www.cheshirewestandchester.gov.uk

In support of its efforts to protect local bus services across the borough, Cheshire West and Chester Council has welcomed the news that registrations for the bus routes 31, 37 and 84 have now been submitted to the Traffic Commissioner from bus operator D&G.
D&G has registered its interest in replacement services to cover the 31 Northwich to Winsford to Crewe, 37 Northwich to Winsford to Sandbach to Crewe and 84 Crewe to Nantwich/Chester.
This follows the news on Monday 27 February, that bus operator Arriva was planning to close its Winsford and Macclesfield depots.
The company operate local services including Northwich, Winsford, Chester, Rudheath, Weaverham, Barnton, Kingsmead, and to Leighton Hospital.
Councillor Karen Shore, Deputy Leader of the Council and Cabinet Member for Environment, Highways and Strategic Transport, said:
I am very concerned about the effect a potential closure of the Winsford depot and routes will have on many residents in west Cheshire who rely on their local bus services. Due to this threat, we are actively encouraging interest for these routes from alternative operators who can provide a reliable service.

We are working hard to seek alternative arrangements and the involvement of other operators. Since Arriva's announcement on Monday, one alternative provider has so far registered their interest in three of the key routes that are under threat.

I have asked for an urgent meeting with Arriva which is now being planned for next week

 

[RELL6L]

Regarding whether D & G will 'need' bigger buses, maybe deckers, for the 31, 37 and 84, their decision will be a financial one. Unless they are contracted to provide a vehicle carrying xx passengers - which on commercial service they are not - then they can do what they like. If this means leaving passengers behind on certain journeys then so be it - that may be preferable to bearing the cost of a larger vehicle. That might change some journey habits, passengers left behind a couple of times will take an earlier or later journey or drive / get a lift. Not an optimal solution but there is no obligation for a commercial route to run vehicles large enough for all potential passengers on every journey on every route. If they were really commercially justified then Arriva probably wouldn't be pulling out!

Good news to see that the 31, 37 and 84 are likely to be replaced but there are still local routes in Crewe, Northwich and Macclesfield seemingly maybe without a future. I can't see Arriva changing their minds now.

 

[SeanM1997]

The Crewe buses do seem to be picked up quickly by D&G which is logical given the location of their depot. However, what we haven't seen if they will maintain frequencies and service pattern. Crewe-Nantwich via Willaston is a key example of a service every 20 minutes but was once every 15 minutes.

There is some positives as having one company doing the bulk of services in and around Crewe should make ticketing easier as well as connections through Crewe Bus Station.

What will be interesting is if Stagecoach decide to pick up the hourly Chester-Crewe from the Chester end and where that would leave the Crewe-Nantwich route. They haven't stated that they've applied for it but doesn't mean they aren't looking.

Nobody taking on the 6 bus route also is concerning. This route serves some of the least car owned parts of Cheshire with Crewe South, Crewe Central and Crewe St Barnabas having low car ownership. Reducing bus services around these areas is concerning, but perhaps other routes can alter their routes to serve them too. No doubt a lot more changes to come.

 

[sonic2009]

Regarding whether D & G will 'need' bigger buses, maybe deckers, for the 31, 37 and 84, their decision will be a financial one. Unless they are contracted to provide a vehicle carrying xx passengers - which on commercial service they are not - then they can do what they like. If this means leaving passengers behind on certain journeys then so be it - that may be preferable to bearing the cost of a larger vehicle. That might change some journey habits, passengers left behind a couple of times will take an earlier or later journey or drive / get a lift. Not an optimal solution but there is no obligation for a commercial route to run vehicles large enough for all potential passengers on every journey on every route. If they were really commercially justified then Arriva probably wouldn't be pulling out!

Good news to see that the 31, 37 and 84 are likely to be replaced but there are still local routes in Crewe, Northwich and Macclesfield seemingly maybe without a future. I can't see Arriva changing their minds now.

The latest from a driver i spoke to on the bus this morning, she is from Winsford Depot was that if a rescue package or a buyer isn't found by the 28th March, then the depots will close on the 22nd April - make of that what you will. But it will be interesting to see what happens in the next few weeks, it was mentioned in Parliament by Mike Amesbury Labour MP for Weaver Vale :

https://twitter.com/MikeAmesburyMP/status/1631317340372586499

Today, in the Chamber, I raised Arriva North West's worrying plans to scrap vital bus service serving my constituents, while closing bus depots in Winsford and Macclesfield. You can sign my petition against these proposals here: https://change.org/p/stop-arriva-s-plans-to-cut-buses-from-winsford-northwich?recruiter=1296933105&recruited_by_id=90d776d0-b6e1-11ed-94ee-37590eb48ab6&utm_source=share_petition&utm_campaign=share_for_starters_page&utm_medium=copylink

 

[markymark2000]

Cheshire West have published a statement on their website yesterday.

Look at Cheshire West running to Arriva begging. Councillors really are clueless aren't they. Winsford has been being ran down for years, there's no chance of them changing their minds. They have kept it going purely because of the Govt funding and now that funding is running down slowly, they are closing it. Embrace the future, stop begging for same old, same old.

I've also heard from a member of Northwich Town Council who attended a conference last night on other matters, that there are 3 potential operators interested in plugging gaps across the Arriva Network.

As many as 3? That is surprising. I wonder who they are. Of course 1 is D&G but I didn't think anyone else would want the work, less so now D&G has taken the 84 as I did think Stagecoach may have tried the 84.

Regarding whether D & G will 'need' bigger buses, maybe deckers, for the 31, 37 and 84, their decision will be a financial one. Unless they are contracted to provide a vehicle carrying xx passengers - which on commercial service they are not - then they can do what they like. If this means leaving passengers behind on certain journeys then so be it - that may be preferable to bearing the cost of a larger vehicle. That might change some journey habits, passengers left behind a couple of times will take an earlier or later journey or drive / get a lift. Not an optimal solution but there is no obligation for a commercial route to run vehicles large enough for all potential passengers on every journey on every route. If they were really commercially justified then Arriva probably wouldn't be pulling out!

Sadly I believe this is what D&G will do. From experience, they don't accommodate for crowds and don't check existing loadings to judge what sized buses they need. When they started the 82, they started it in the school holidays and were told on the Friday that they would need a bigger bus for Monday when the schools go back. D&G didn't believe Arriva and they had an almighty shock on the Monday when the first 82 ran from Chester to the college. Only got to Littleton and the full size E200 had only 10 standing spaces left. Ran over capacity and ended up leaving students in Kelsall.

The Crewe buses do seem to be picked up quickly by D&G which is logical given the location of their depot. However, what we haven't seen if they will maintain frequencies and service pattern. Crewe-Nantwich via Willaston is a key example of a service every 20 minutes but was once every 15 minutes.

Chester to Nantwich was also half hourly.

What will be interesting is if Stagecoach decide to pick up the hourly Chester-Crewe from the Chester end and where that would leave the Crewe-Nantwich route. They haven't stated that they've applied for it but doesn't mean they aren't looking.

Why would Stagecoach take it on when D&G are taking on the 84. Stagecoach aren't going to compete for anything.

Nobody taking on the 6 bus route also is concerning. This route serves some of the least car owned parts of Cheshire with Crewe South, Crewe Central and Crewe St Barnabas having low car ownership. Reducing bus services around these areas is concerning, but perhaps other routes can alter their routes to serve them too. No doubt a lot more changes to come.

Much of the 6 is covered, albeit by routes on lower frequencies. South of Crewe is mostly covered by the half hourly 12. North of Crewe is covered by the 31 (and links from Crewe to Leighton Hospital also covered by the 12)

The latest from a driver i spoke to on the bus this morning, she is from Winsford Depot was that if a rescue package or a buyer isn't found by the 28th March

Except for D&G, who is going to buy a depot now that the 3 of the core routes are going to be taken on by another firm and 1 of the routes is ran in competition with another firm.

 

[SeanM1997]

Look at Cheshire West running to Arriva begging. Councillors really are clueless aren't they. Winsford has been being ran down for years, there's no chance of them changing their minds. They have kept it going purely because of the Govt funding and now that funding is running down slowly, they are closing it. Embrace the future, stop begging for same old, same old.


Sadly I believe this is what D&G will do. From experience, they don't accommodate for crowds and don't check existing loadings to judge what sized buses they need. When they started the 82, they started it in the school holidays and were told on the Friday that they would need a bigger bus for Monday when the schools go back. D&G didn't believe Arriva and they had an almighty shock on the Monday when the first 82 ran from Chester to the college. Only got to Littleton and the full size E200 had only 10 standing spaces left. Ran over capacity and ended up leaving students in Kelsall.


Chester to Nantwich was also half hourly.


Why would Stagecoach take it on when D&G are taking on the 84. Stagecoach aren't going to compete for anything.


Much of the 6 is covered, albeit by routes on lower frequencies. South of Crewe is mostly covered by the half hourly 12. North of Crewe is covered by the 31 (and links from Crewe to Leighton Hospital also covered by the 12)


Except for D&G, who is going to buy a depot now that the 3 of the core routes are going to be taken on by another firm and 1 of the routes is ran in competition with another firm.

You say Stagecoach won't compete on the 84 but is unclear what D&G are planning - they could just be doing the Crewe-Nantwich section since that is much more urban. All I can tell you is that discussions are ongoing and I suspect more will become apparent in due course for numerous operators to extend their reach across Cheshire.

 

[markymark2000]

All I can tell you is that discussions are ongoing and I suspect more will become apparent in due course for numerous operators to extend their reach across Cheshire.

Oh of course, it's not all complete, plenty more to happen in the coming weeks. Hopefully we will have concrete information within the next week or two so that we know what is going on commercially and what will be tendered. I can't see D&Gs registrations on the Govt portal yet and so when they appear, it will be much more clear what is going on. For once, I think I may buy the registrations just to see what does get taken on.


Some D&G news for everyone though.
3 Cheshire East tenders are being reduced from 1st April. Route 316 (Sandbach Circ) and 319 (Sandbach to Homles Chapel and Goostry) will now run Monday and Thursday only (down from Monday-Friday) and route 318 (Congleton to Alsager) will now only run on Tuesday, Wednesday and Friday (down from Monday-Friday) meaning overall D&G will be down PVR 1 bus. Not sure why it's being cut back but either way, it's confirmed on D&Gs website.

 

[sonic2009]

We don't know what Stagecoach or any other operator might be thinking about - i know Stagecoach hold a couple of school contracts around Winsford - possibly could be contacted by Cheshire West to run any that Arriva have - i know of a few that i believe run to Tarporley school that Arriva currently operate.

 

[markymark2000]

We don't know what Stagecoach or any other operator might be thinking about - i know Stagecoach hold a couple of school contracts around Winsford - possibly could be contacted by Cheshire West to run any that Arriva have - i know of a few that i believe run to Tarporley school that Arriva currently operate.

The school service which Stagecoach hold is Over (Winsford) to Tarporley High. I don't believe they have anything else Winsford way.

I didn't think Arriva ran any Tarporley High services. I know they have 3 routes to St Nicholas Catholic High School

 

[sonic2009]

The school service which Stagecoach hold is Over (Winsford) to Tarporley High. I don't believe they have anything else Winsford way.

I didn't think Arriva ran any Tarporley High services. I know they have 3 routes to St Nicholas Catholic High School

TP1 and TP2 i think? Sure i've seen them going round correct me if i'm wrong.

 

[markymark2000]

TP1 and TP2 i think? Sure i've seen them going round correct me if i'm wrong.

You may be right, I just hadn't heard anything about them doing that run. The only run on record that they did to Tarporley was to Kelsall which now seems to be ran by Stagecoach (based off tracking)