Merseyrail Class 777 introduction updates

[185]

Unexpected or not, it has been a poor start from the 777s considering the age it took to get them into service.

Have to agree. The new trains excuse is a nonsense. Unlike many arrivals these sets have had years to play with and try out real world scenarios to see if they break.

I do wonder if sitting there all day dressed in orange with a laptop plugged into the trains TMS should be allowed to pass for 'testing'.

 

[Meerkat]

No. It's our local rail system and cheap 1990s horrid Fainsa type bus seats which aren't wide enough for two people belong on the 10A to Kensington, not our train system with journeys of 25-35 mins for most.

If most journeys are only half an hour then it sounds a lot like a metro!

 

[ExRes]

Schedule on RTT and Rail Record for tomorrow, 2218 6Q78 Crewe Down Refuge Siding to Kirkdale CS, could be a 777 move I suppose or possibly some freightliner boxes loaded with new seats

 

[yorkie]

This thread is for progress updates regarding delivery & implementation of the new trains.

For diagrams, please use:

Merseyrail Class 777 diagrams

Could Someone please help me with Class 777 diagrams please, as Merseyrail services are not RealTimeTrains yet.

www.railforums.co.uk

For seat discussion, please use:

Merseyrail Class 777 seating

I went for a short ride today. Very impressed. Lots of airline seats which I prefer. Lots of knee room. Nice height - much higher than the class 319 I went into Liverpool on. Firm but not uncomfortable. The exit to platform are much better than on the 331s. On my trip from Liverpool Central the...

www.railforums.co.uk

For reviews of the new trains and to post your views on riding them, please use:

Merseyrail Class 777 review

I said I'd post more details on my observations and opinions from a ride on Friday, so here they are. If you're a real fan of these units you may not wish to read on, but if you are interested in a bit of a critique here goes. First impressions from outside good - they look properly slick...

www.railforums.co.uk

Many thanks

 

[Liverpool 507]

Can't see it mentioned on this particular thread but 777008 had its first revenue earning passenger journeys yesterday.

 

[prod_pep]

More cancellations due to 777s misbehaving this morning have led to 507009 ably deputising on the 1750 Central - Kirkby tonight.

 

[Liverpool 507]

More cancellations due to 777s misbehaving this morning have led to 507009 ably deputising on the 1750 Central - Kirkby tonight.

507010 has been covering the Kirkby line today as well. I noted 777049 at Fazakerley earlier.

 

[Sam 76]

More cancellations due to 777s misbehaving this morning have led to 507009 ably deputising on the 1750 Central - Kirkby tonight.

I can see the 777s being withdrawn totally for a period of updates and testing at this rate.

 

[DJH1971]

I can see the 777s being withdrawn totally for a period of updates and testing at this rate.

With the service suffering even more as more 507/508's get withdrawn.

507019 & 508122 are apparently going to the breakers this weekend.

 

[OL-3944]

My contact at MR says they are cannibalising a 777 to keep the others going on the Kirkby line. Namely headlights and windscreen wipers. They can’t get the replacement parts quick enough from Stadler.

 

[DJH1971]

My contact at MR says they are cannibalising a 777 to keep the others going on the Kirkby line. Namely headlights and windscreen wipers. They can’t get the replacement parts quick enough from Stadler.

Clearly doesn't sound good

 

[Nottingham59]

My contact at MR says they are cannibalising a 777 to keep the others going on the Kirkby line. Namely headlights and windscreen wipers. They can’t get the replacement parts quick enough from Stadler.

Does Liverpool have the wrong sort of rain?

 

[DJH1971]

If this is true, which 777 has been selected for cannibalisation?

 

[OL-3944]

If this is true, which 777 has been selected for cannibalisation?

I’m unsure of the unit no, however the unit in question is clearly visible from Kirkdale platform as it has plastic sheeting covering up it’s missing headlights.

 

[Sam 76]

My contact at MR says they are cannibalising a 777 to keep the others going on the Kirkby line. Namely headlights and windscreen wipers. They can’t get the replacement parts quick enough from Stadler.

That’s honestly crazy and such a shame at this early stage. Such smart units with so much promise and it’s sad to see them having the start they are. I hope it gets better soon as I’m sure it will as the rollout continues

 

[D821]

Things like headlights and wipers must be common parts used across other ranges, why the high failure rates, I wonder?

 

[Wezz]

Unexpected or not, it has been a poor start from the 777s considering the age it took to get them into service.

An amazing stat: it took just 33 days from the first delivery to Merseyside to get the first 507 into revenue-earning service back in 1978. The 777s? 1,103 days. Times have changed and there was a pandemic, but there's much more to it than that.

The 507s might not have been a new design entirely, but they certainly were new to Merseyside staff. Even the 313s, which pioneered this design, the first second-generation EMU and novel in many ways, took less than six months from first delivery to service introduction. The PEPs (i.e. the actual PEPs, the 445/6s) were substantially different from the production-run design as well.

Despite the advancements in technology, it still shouldn't be the case that the 777s are as unreliable as this over three years since the first was delivered.

We've always said that the 777's will be unreliable at first, they're so full of technology that glitches and issues were bound to pop up.

We've also had the 507/508 fleet for over 40 years, we know literally everything about them so if something fails then we know exactly what needs replacing and how to do it. the team are working hard to improve reliability but this will take some time whilst they iron out the teething problems.

 

[Vespa]

If this is true, which 777 has been selected for cannibalisation?

Already usually you hear about cannibalisation of parts toward the end of train classes, not at the start.

 

[8A Rail]

I know it may sound extremely silly, why cannibalise one when simply put another one in traffic! You only need three on the Kirkby line but you have 18 in total. No one is going to tell me not one of those is not fit for traffic as I assume some of those Units have already put in the mileage already. A very sad state of affairs already in the early days of entering traffic.

 

[ExRes]

Already usually you hear about cannibalisation of parts toward the end of train classes, not at the start.

Although, to be fair, that's when the entire class has been delivered and used, with the 777s the majority of the fleet are still to be delivered and then accepted, I'm not well enough up with things to know if they've all been built yet, if not are the 'spare parts' still actually being used for new builds?

 

[Statto]

I know it may sound extremely silly, why cannibalise one when simply put another one in traffic! You only need three on the Kirkby line but you have 18 in total. No one is going to tell me not one of those is not fit for traffic as I assume some of those Units have already put in the mileage already. A very sad state of affairs already in the early days of entering traffic.

All very well saying their's 18, but how many have them done fault free testing & been cleared for passenger service?

The 777s need at least 500 miles of fault free testing, before being cleared for passenger service.

 

[karlbbb]

If this is true, which 777 has been selected for cannibalisation?

Looked like 777015 when I went past Kirkdale this morning. Had plastic sheeting covering the hole from one of the main head/tail lamp sections.

 

[Meerkat]

Although, to be fair, that's when the entire class has been delivered and used, with the 777s the majority of the fleet are still to be delivered and then accepted, I'm not well enough up with things to know if they've all been built yet, if not are the 'spare parts' still actually being used for new builds?

I would have thought a build up of spare parts would be well ahead of the units bearing in mind how late they are to service entry!

 

[ExRes]

I would have thought a build up of spare parts would be well ahead of the units bearing in mind how late they are to service entry!

Quite so, you are falling into the old logic trap though ......

 

[8A Rail]

All very well saying their's 18, but how many have them done fault free testing & been cleared for passenger service?

The 777s need at least 500 miles of fault free testing, before being cleared for passenger service.

Yes very true but they have more than four that have done the required mileage as otherwise they would not be traffic and they have had time to do it too. Also if Merseyrail are suggesting Class 777 introduction on the Ormskirk line in April then they bet get a BIG move on racking up the mileage. I think personally Merseyrail and Steve Rotheram (& co) better off keeping a very low profile on the introduction of the Class 777's, let them bed in slowly without making bold annoucements of this and that is all going to happen, as it will end up in tears and egg on their faces.

 

[Mollman]

Things like headlights and wipers must be common parts used across other ranges, why the high failure rates, I wonder?

Depends if it is failure of parts or incedients caused by external issues (branches caught in blades or stones cracking headlight covers)

 

[Pacef8]

Still you would think a few consumer parts would be chucked in the cab pre delivery along with a few chocolates for the technicians.

 

[61653 HTAFC]

Some people have short memories. Remember 333009(?) anyone? Or 141001 which never worked in service until after refurbishment?

 

[Skie]

Some people have short memories. Remember 333009(?) anyone? Or 141001 which never worked in service until after refurbishment?

Indeed. Taking spares from anything available is common if you don’t have them in the stores or on hand if you need them asap. And don’t forget the stores will be 507/8 focused currently, so probably not a huge amount of space for new kit just yet.

Stadler are responsible for maintenance, if they want to strip a train down to its frame they can as long as Merseyrail have the trains available for the service they need to run.

 

[Meerkat]

Depends if it is failure of parts or incedients caused by external issues (branches caught in blades or stones cracking headlight covers)

They surely have years of data on how often that happens, and wouldnt they have produced spares assuming that a lot more 777s would be in service by now?