Rail mounted guns

[Ken H]

Came across this today
'Boche-Buster', a 250-ton 18-inch railway gun, Catterick, 12th December 1940. The gun later travelled down to Kent to take up position at Bishopsbourne on the Elham to Canterbury Line, taken over by the Army for the duration." The gun was in fact an 18 inch howitzer. Image shows the gun with the barrel raised for firing

(Pic from Wiki) No copyright because its old

Wiki article - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BL_18-inch_railway_howitzer

Anyone know any more about this, or the ones made during WW1.

 

[Taunton]

That would be a challenge when derailed ...

Which I understand is just what would happen when the gun was fired, that the recoil action would lift the wheels from the line, which they then didn't quite come back down onto. So after firing once there was then a day's work with all the jacks that could be mustered getting it back on the tracks.

 

[Lucan]

Which I understand is just what would happen when the gun was fired, that the recoil action would lift the wheels from the line, which they then didn't quite come back down onto. So after firing once there was then a day's work with all the jacks that could be mustered getting it back on the tracks.

Obviously you have never heard of railway guns before. Quite a few were used in WW1 and 2, and smaller ones were being used as early as in the American Civil War. They do not derail whan fired, although because most were very large guns they took quite a while to reload. We are talking about 3 or 4 shots per hour, depending on the size. They could not in themselves traverse, but were typically fired from a specially built curved siding where they could be moved back and forth to obtain the traverse.

 

[ThameslinkUser]

Of course, you can't forget the Schwerer Gustav...

 

[Taunton]

Obviously you have never heard of railway guns before. Quite a few were used in WW1 and 2, and smaller ones were being used as early as in the American Civil War. They do not derail whan fired, although because most were very large guns they took quite a while to reload. We are talking about 3 or 4 shots per hour, depending on the size. They could not in themselves traverse, but were typically fired from a specially built curved siding where they could be moved back and forth to obtain the traverse.

Actually, I have ... which includes eye-witness accounts of them derailing when fired.

Here's one for example from my own photo collection, which, given this new-found expertise, you may like to identify for others.

 

[Matey]

Came across this today
'Boche-Buster', a 250-ton 18-inch railway gun, Catterick, 12th December 1940. The gun later travelled down to Kent to take up position at Bishopsbourne on the Elham to Canterbury Line, taken over by the Army for the duration." The gun was in fact an 18 inch howitzer. Image shows the gun with the barrel raised for firing

(Pic from Wiki) No copyright because its old

Wiki article - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BL_18-inch_railway_howitzer

Anyone know any more about this, or the ones made during WW1.

There is a published story of how this gun was "lost" between the wars and what lead to its discovery in 1940. I believe a sister gun "Scene Shifter" was part of the story too if I recall from memory correctly.

 

[randyrippley]

There is a published story of how this gun was "lost" between the wars and what lead to its discovery in 1940. I believe a sister gun "Scene Shifter" was part of the story too if I recall from memory correctly.

Lost?

I thought Churchill had managed to get most of the army heavy artillery hidden from the Treasury beancounters post WW1 by putting it in long term storage and pretending it was all scrapped. That's what he claimed in his memoirs

 

[Pinza-C55]

I heard a story that one was stationed on the disused rail deck of the Queen Alexandra Bridge in Sunderland but have never seen any proof.

 

[341o2]

there were three 13.5 inch rail mounted guns used during WW2 on the former East Kent light railway, and had a range capable of crossing the channel

 

[Trainlog]

there were three 13.5 inch rail mounted guns used during WW2 on the former East Kent light railway, and had a range capable of crossing the channel

Another Colonel stephens line, the K&ESR had a railgun placed at Wittersham road station and was hauled there by GWR Deans goods locos. The gun was only used once at Wittersham due to the fact the firing led to all the windows being shattered at the station. However, 2 guns where present on the line between 1941-44 along with 3 Deans goods to move them when required.

Source Middleton Press

 

[306024]

Spike Milligan refers to a rail mounted gun in one of his war memoirs, the only Internet reference I could find was from the Guardian:

Spike Milligan did indeed serve nobly in Bexhill-on-Sea, as his memoir Adolf Hitler: My Part in his Downfall records. Who could forget his account of their trips to the pub in their mobile anti-aircraft gun carriage mounted on a railway engine.

 

[Matey]

I thought Churchill had managed to get most of the army heavy artillery hidden from the Treasury beancounters post WW1 by putting it in long term storage and pretending it was all scrapped. That's what he claimed in his memoirs

Maybe he did, but nobody knew where some of the guns/gun carriages were stored! A gunner subaltern was charged with putting Boche-Buster into preservation condition before it was recovered back to the UK after WW1. In 1940, now a Major, he was personally charged by Churchill to find Boche-Buster. At the point of almost giving up he was told that the RAF had some large rail connected sheds sealed by the War Department. Hey presto" Boche-Buster was found. Winston went down to witness the first test firing of one of the Kent guns. He asked the gunner afterwards what did they hit. The laconic answer was "France". One of the guns was test fired near Halwill Junction onto the Okehampton Dartmoor range. The shell holes are still evident according to the range staff. Incidentally, there is a 1918 film which includes "Boche-Buster in action at [https://www.iwm.org.uk/collections/item/object/1060008215].

 

[dangerousdids2]

There's a vid on YouTube of the gun being moved along the line. They used to hide it in the tunnel under Bourne park. The tunnel is still there today, its a strange looking tunnel, as it was modified to house the gun.

 

[furnessvale]

Will this one do? Photo from Britmodeller.com

 

[yorksrob]

Spike Milligan refers to a rail mounted gun in one of his war memoirs, the only Internet reference I could find was from the Guardian:

There's a book I need to read !

 

[NortholtPark]

Youtube has an audio version, three and half hours long...here...

I would still recommend the book version, too!

 

[jp4712]

The memoirs of G G Hilditch, ‘Steel wheels and rubber tyres’ are neglected by rail enthusiasts because Geoff had a long and illustrious career in the bus industry. However the first volume is chiefly concerned with his time as a premium apprentice on the GC section of the LNER, mainly during the war years, and he records his surprise one day in Gorton Works (1941?) when the wooden boarding over a long pit was removed to reveal an extremely large gun barrel beneath which was removed for use ‘somewhere’.

 

[Ploughman]

A I right in thinking there is or was a Rail Gun in the Larkhill area kept as a museum piece?

 

[Trainlog]

A I right in thinking there is or was a Rail Gun in the Larkhill area kept as a museum piece?

Your half right. Though the carriage has long been scrapped, the gun itself survives a 'BL 18inch railway howitzer' type.

BL 18-inch railway howitzer - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[spyinthesky]

Rail guns just proved themselves very inefficient due to the poor rate of fire and limited mobility. Most were based from naval guns.
Of course the range was advantageous over a Heavy Field Gun but on larger calibres it required correct rail alignment due to such high muzzle velocity and recoil. It was rare that such weapons could achieve much more than 3 or 4 rounds before major repairs and of course a high priority target for the enemy.
Lots of (mainly American) attempts to improve the idea over the years have been overtaken by precision munitions.

Information taken from ‘Firepower’ Maj Gen Bailey RA, former Director Royal Artillery.

 

[AlistairCL]

A good introduction to this subject is "Rail Gun" by John Batchelor and Ian Hogg. This describes French, British, German and American guns, illustrated with photos and scale drawings (OO and HO). The book includes the largest gun ever used, the German 80cm Gustav that straddled two standard gauge tracks.

 

[MotCO]

My late father used to recount stories of a gun on the rails near Ongar - presumably the Underground lines to Epping. He said that because we kept moving it up and down the line, the German pilots had no idea where the gun was.

 

[dangerousdids2]

 

[Matey]

The Col Stevens style of station was a likely givaaway. Was that Golgotha tunnel?

 

[Gloster]

The Col Stevens style of station was a likely givaaway. Was that Golgotha tunnel?

I would think it was probably the Elham Valley line and the tunnel was the cut-and-cover one just north of Bishopsbourne station.