Projects you'd build but will (probably) never happen

[Northumbriana]

I don’t know how a Morpeth diversion hasn’t been mentioned !

I'll mention it, Cramlington & Morpeth bypass.

Not my idea obviously, but: a tunnel from Edinburgh via Leith to the north of Kircaldy (if Lego works, then that‘s fine with me), so as to accelerate journeys from Edinburgh to the north and release capacity for local services.

Isn't that a proposal by the Scottish Greens? But it would involve severe disruption in Leith. Could possibly build an artificial island half way for a new housing development with station.

My idea would be a high speed line from Dunfermline to Perth with a branch onto the Aberdeen line.

 

[takno]

Isn't that a proposal by the Scottish Greens? But it would involve severe disruption in Leith. Could possibly build an artificial island half way for a new housing development with station.

Can't remember the exact proposal, but I think it involved taking the old Leith central line as far as possible, and then cutting downwards, with an underground station in Leith. It's a great project for this thread.

 

[waverley47]

Can't remember the exact proposal, but I think it involved taking the old Leith central line as far as possible, and then cutting downwards, with an underground station in Leith. It's a great project for this thread.

There was a thread about this ages ago, I'll see if I can find it.

Edit: https://www.railforums.co.uk/thread...le-and-how-could-the-idea-be-improved.213067/

 

[Intercity110]

A line from northampton to Peterborough, branching off just south of the station with stops at: Wooton (underground near the CO-OP, rushden (with a freight terminal to serve the shopping centre), irthlingborough, near the A6, A14 south parkway, near junction 13 & thrapston,oundle, behind the waitrose,warmington, along the Peterborough road, oundle, along the oundle road, and then it dives south to join the east coast mainline at yaxley, with a new station. The line would be jointly served by thameslink and west midlands railway. There would also be an LNER/ avanti WC service (using a neutrally liveried pool of electric only 80X trains). The line would be bi-directionally signalled, with a fast slow and passing line (both lines had access to it). There would be an hourly service, alternating between the two operators. The thameslink services would terminate at a bay platform, south of the the leah viaduct. Some dedicated rolling stock would be a 2-car EMU, akin to th 2 car class 309's which worked through LNR services, coupling/ dividing at northampton (via a bay platform at yaxley south).

 

[Austriantrain]

I'll mention it, Cramlington & Morpeth bypass.

Isn't that a proposal by the Scottish Greens? But it would involve severe disruption in Leith. Could possibly build an artificial island half way for a new housing development with station.

My idea would be a high speed line from Dunfermline to Perth with a branch onto the Aberdeen line.

If the required capacity between Edinburgh and Dunfermline is there (significant acceleration usually leads to significant passenger growth, hence more trains - and if that doesn’t happen, the new line should in retrospect be judged useless), I would think your proposal is equally good and probably cheaper.

In the proposal I „borrowed“: you don’t really need to build a station in Leith - it looks useful, it might actually be, but it’s not necessary for such a line to achieve its aims. You could pass under it in the tunnel without expensive station there.

 

[Silenos]

Reopen the Midland and Great Northern Railway from Kings Lynn (or a new South Lynn station) via Wisbech to Peterborough in one direction, and via Fakenham, Melton Constable, Lenwade and Drayton into Norwich in the other direction. Maybe have the branch from Melton via Aylsham and North Walsham to Yarmouth, while we’re at it.

 

[MattRat]

The thread title is

Projects you'd build but will (probably) never happen​

That sounds like an ask for any suggestions whatsoever to me. Not every speculative thread has to be a full business plan for a realistic project

However, it is more interesting if the projects are sensible, to highlight the absurdity of the people in charge that they haven't done the blindingly obvious.

 

[Bartsimho]

How about restoring some curves to sort out routes to avoid reversal around Sheffield and Rotherham.
Either build a chord from Rotherham Woodburn to Mexborough East Junction Line to the Midland Main Line towards Canklow Freight Terminal (over a Nature Reserve) or Rebuild the Attercliffe Junction to Darnall West Junction Chord to allow access to the Manchester to Cleethorpes line without reversal.

Both would need to upgrade of the Sheffield Bypass of the Midland Main Line to be re-upgraded to passenger service.

Also upgrade Pye Bridge Junction to Kirkby Lane End Junction to passenger service again to allow better access to the Robin Hood Line as it skips the Single Track section.

 

[zwk500]

How about restoring some curves to sort out routes to avoid reversal around Sheffield and Rotherham.
Either build a chord from Rotherham Woodburn to Mexborough East Junction Line to the Midland Main Line towards Canklow Freight Terminal (over a Nature Reserve) or Rebuild the Attercliffe Junction to Darnall West Junction Chord to allow access to the Manchester to Cleethorpes line without reversal.

Both would need to upgrade of the Sheffield Bypass of the Midland Main Line to be re-upgraded to passenger service.

If you're talking about the Old Road via Barrow Hill it is a passenger rated line - in fact there's a proposal to reintroduce a stopper on it.I would personally only build the Attercliffe chord and the Treton/Catcliff connections to Tinsley yard. That allows flexibility of freight routing into and around Sheffield without going near the New Road via Sheffield Midland.

 

[Bevan Price]

Would that involve demolishing the guided busway or making a new line?

Parts would probably now need to be in tunnels at both St. Helens & Leigh. And too expensive to have a chance of being built.

 

[Mikey C]

However, it is more interesting if the projects are sensible, to highlight the absurdity of the people in charge that they haven't done the blindingly obvious.

But most of the suggestions, while desirable, aren't "blindingly obvious" as they'd cost a fortune.

 

[MattRat]

But most of the suggestions, while desirable, aren't "blindingly obvious" as they'd cost a fortune.

I didn't say desirable, I said sensible. As in using common sense, they'd get built. And that includes a sensible price.

 

[zwk500]

I didn't say desirable, I said sensible. As in using common sense, they'd get built. And that includes a sensible price.

And how do you achieve that? The prices aren't just made up, they're what it costs.

 

[MattRat]

And how do you achieve that? The prices aren't just made up, they're what it costs.

Let me put it this way, electric infill projects would fit the scenario.

 

[HSTEd]

Rail is an extremely expensive game to play.

Best you can do is come up with schemes that at least deliver benefits that can justify the costs.

Which is why every new project should be a Shinkansen, clearly.

 

[DerekC]

A few minor improvements to build a proper east to west main line in the southern coastal region; e.g:

1) Rebuild the S&D from Broadstone to Templecombe, with a grade separated west facing junction with a redoubled LSWR West of England Main Line

2) A proper Southampton Tunnel, from the west portal of the existing one, under the Itchen and coming up somewhere between Woolston and Sholing

3) Four tracks from the east portal of the new tunnel to Havant, with grade separated junctions at Cosham, Farlington and Havant. (New station at Havant as well, I dare say)

4) Some tactical four-tracking and/or station rebuilds with platform loops between Chichester and Brighton, with maybe a dash of grade separation at Ford and Arundel

Damn - my crayon's bust!

 

[HSTEd]

If you go beyond simple rail projects, although it would require substantial new rail infrastructure to support it.

Single London/South East Airport, either near Shivering Sands or off Brighton. Four runways, two (huge) terminals and designed to approach the throughput of Hartsfield-Jackson airport in the US.

Finally allow the woefully unsuitable Heathrow to be dispensed with and free a lot of very valuable land for redevelopment. Also concentrate the destinations from all London airports into a single hub for maximum connectivity.

 

[LUYMun]

If the idea is "probably never happen":

1. Electrify the entire railway network
2. Convert third rail networks to overhead wire
3. A link from the Ascot-Guildford line to the SWML heading westwards to Basingstoke near Farnborough
4. A western approach from Alton to a new station near Bordon
5. Build the Dawlish Avoiding Line
6. Four tracking the Brighton Main Line south of Three Bridges
7. Isle of Wight to Portsmouth tunnel
8. Woolston to Southampton Central tunnel
9. Extend the Northern line to Epsom, Watford and Alexandra Palace
10. A new tunnel from Balham to Putney that eventually links with the West London Orbital to create a second "Overground Circle"
11. Extend the Hammersmith & City to demolish as much of Hammersmith as possible

 

[zwk500]

@DerekC your point no.4 is not as far off as you imagine. I have definitely seen proposals for grade separating the triangle, although not sure what recent development in the area has done to the viability. Grade-separation is recognised to be likely necessary to meet the future needs as the current layout is 1. limited capacity and 2 limited linespeed.

@HSTEd My preference for a new London Airport would be North-West of the conurbation between the M40 and M1, as I feel the flattening a Chiltern is no less unlikely than raising the English Channel seabed.

 

[stuu]

Calvert would be the ideal location for a replacement airport. Shame it didn't happen in the 1970s... Now the Eastern side of HS2 has been cancelled there would be capacity to serve it too.

 

[HSTEd]

Calvert would be the ideal location for a replacement airport. Shame it didn't happen in the 1970s... Now the Eastern side of HS2 has been cancelled there would be capacity to serve it too.

I honestly don't think anyone will ever get permission for an inland airport to be built ever again. Indeed, even any significant expansion is going to be extremely challenging in political terms.

Offshore locations have the advantage of many fewer people around to complain - and they are unlikely to get swamped by increasing urbanisation in the way that Heathrow has.

Engineering problems are expensive but easier to solve in many ways than political ones.

 

[zwk500]

I honestly don't think anyone will ever get permission for an inland airport to be built ever again. Indeed, even any significant expansion is going to be extremely challenging in political terms.

Offshore locations have the advantage of many fewer people around to complain - and they are unlikely to get swamped by increasing urbanisation in the way that Heathrow has.

Engineering problems are expensive but easier to solve in many ways than political ones.

I don't believe a major new airport will be approved in the UK. Development of Gatwick and Stansted to 2-runway operation and Heathrow squeezed for it's life's worth even with a 3rd will be the path taken.

 

[YourMum666]

There will probably be a Chilterns Airport at some point

 

[Railguy1]

It really bothers me that Park Royal and Hanger Lane were never properly linked in London. I know you can walk it, I know the stations are a little too far away, but still...

 

[NorwichRailFan]

Norwich Trams Linking the Station,City,University,and Hospital. Was suggested by the council a few years ago but believe me, it will never happen

 

[Aviator88]

A gravity train - in essence, a train that costs nothing to run, because gravity does all the acceleration and deceleration. If you pick two points on the surface of the Earth, say, London and Edinburgh, and join them with a straight line, it will start off downhill due to the curvature of the Earth, accelerating until the midpoint before running uphill and decelerating back to zero at (theoretically) the precise moment it reaches the destination. Obviously this will need to take place in a vacuum tube (a la 'hyperloop') and be run on some kind of levitation to eliminate friction, but I find it an exciting concept!

Incidentally, the maths works out so that regardless of which two points on the Earth you pick (London to Reading or Glasgow to Sydney), the journey time will always take the same amount of time, roughly 40 minutes.

I'd love to see one of these things link London and Paris, for example!

 

[Bald Rick]

I don't believe a major new airport will be approved in the UK. Development of Gatwick and Stansted to 2-runway operation and Heathrow squeezed for its life's worth even with a 3rd will be the path taken.

I’d be surprised even if these happen. Gatwick will get its “second runway” (kind of), but the rest is unlikely. Certainly there wont be a new airport, offshore or not.

 

[YourMum666]

Full reinstatement of the Waverley Line, along with electrification and 125mph trains, which would work as a carstaors bypass

 

[Austriantrain]

Rail is an extremely expensive game to play.

Best you can do is come up with schemes that at least deliver benefits that can justify the costs.

Rail is indeed expensive, but also, UK politics (and apparently with approval from the electorate) is not prepared to invest a particularly large amount of money into it. By Continental standards, there are plenty of suggestions here (by no means all, though) that would already be built or in the works, starting with all the electrification and grade-separation.

 

[zwk500]

Rail is indeed expensive, but also, UK politics (and apparently with approval from the electorate) is not prepared to invest a particularly large amount of money into it. By Continental standards, there are plenty of suggestions here (by no means all, though) that would already be built or in the works, starting with all the electrification and grade-separation.

Out of interest, when continental electrification projects happen how much rebuilding of the bridges etc has to take place?