LNER launching a mascot

[DarloRich]

Ironically the kids love it, they've just produced a Christmas book and all sorts. I got my niece (age 5) a cuddly Miles from work and she won't put the thing down when she's out travelling around, he has to come with in his little bag.

agreed - my colleagues kids love it. I think they do a colouring book that was very popular - kept them entertained on a London > Derby journey.

 

[ExRes]

I didn't realise that Eleanor was a dual gender name, it surely must be otherwise the male, if I'm allowed to use that word, part of the population would be dreadfully offended

 

[QSK19]

this board is so utterly, utterly predictable! Po faced conservative responses to an, checks notes, advert. Interestingly there is less wailing about costs when trains are re liveried or when Branson rail did some PR stunt. Odd that.

It is a bit of PR fluff that will have zero impact on operations either practically or cost wise. You might as well complain about the free tea bags and milk in the office as this.

Not all of us. “Po faced” is defined as humourless and disapproving. You will see many examples in this thread alone of humour being used towards Miles and the other mascots; and some have approved of them. And like @LowLevel, I have bought Miles mascots for kids (my own son & daughter as opposed to niece) and they adore him.

As for costs, again, many of us have criticised TOCs for putting style over substance - e.g. why are DfT/EMR spending money on advertising when they need to be refurbishing the 170s and 360s.

Whilst I agree that a lot of responses are indeed po faced, there are many others which certainly are not.

 

[MarkyT]

Perhaps a new statue at Kings Cross will be unveiled..

I wonder what happened to the duck that, controversially, was going to form part of the Sir Nigel Gresley statue but was withdrawn following letters in The Times. If LNER wanted to change the mascot, maybe the sculptor would do a good deal. Maybe Eleanor could gain a duck sidekick to travel with (do LNER sell duck tickets?).

 

[DarloRich]

As for costs, again, many of us have criticised TOCs for putting style over substance - eg why are EMR spending money on advertising when they need to be refurbishing the 170s and 360s.

because the cost differential between an overhaul of a fleet and some advertising is like apples and potatoes! (Your advertising budget might get the cab front of one train repainted )

Also you if you are buying soft toys you might well fund the advertising campaign!

 

[LowLevel]

I didn't realise that Eleanor was a dual gender name, it surely must be otherwise the male, if I'm allowed to use that word, part of the population would be dreadfully offended

Bravo, in a thread of largely grumpy responses, yours is the winner, I particularly like the way you've managed to squeeze in a random moan about gender identity

 

[superalbs]

My god, it is so ugly.

 

[Purple Train]

(do LNER sell duck tickets?).

Definitely not first class ones, I'm told the inhabitants would think it rather fowl.

My god, it is so ugly.

Assuming you're not talking about Miles - for a puppet, it's definitely not bad.

 

[Bertie the bus]

As for costs, again, many of us have criticised TOCs for putting style over substance - e.g. why are DfT/EMR spending money on advertising when they need to be refurbishing the 170s and 360s.

To increase revenue and get the railway's finances in a healthier state to pay for things like refurbishments perhaps?

 

[DarloRich]

To increase revenue and get the railway's finances in a healthier state to pay for things like refurbishments perhaps?

absolutely - posters here cant have it both ways! Railways are overly expensive v we want nice/new trains.

EDIT - I might not spend the advertising budget on a mascot but I assume LNER have some data to suggest this will land best with thier target audience.

 

[Thirteen]

The moans about TOCs spending money on advertising is a bit odd.

 

[Mag_seven]

The moans about TOCs spending money on advertising is a bit odd.

Point is you get the product right first before you promote it - LNER have not got their product right yet.

 

[maniacmartin]

I clicked the link in the first post of this thread and saw a muppet hand giving the middle finger to LNER. The first thing that came to mind is that it was a fake X account made by a disgruntled passenger.

 

[LowLevel]

Point is you get the product right first before you promote it - LNER have not got their product right yet.

At what point will they have gotten it right so should be allowed to advertise it? They must be one of the best thought of train operators in the UK. OK, there's issues, things like the seating are subjective, but generally speaking they are what other operators aim for.

It can be summed up by a conversation I overheard a few weeks ago in a full and standing first class coach on my way to Birmingham on XC:

"Oh this really is awful. I like using the train from Newcastle to London, they're modern, quick and usually reliable. Then you get on here and you resent paying for it."

 

[RAPC]

As a former media and advertising agency person of many years, a thread like this always throws up some interesting opinions.

A lot depends on the original brief and the campaign objectives, as to what LNER are looking to achieve with this. Could be a mix of softer metrics, such as awareness of LNER, brand favourability, existing customer net promoter scores, consideration to purchase via LNER. Harder metrics could include measuring an increase in particular types of journeys, acquiring new customer segments, driving more sales via the LNER website at the expense of The Trainline and other 3rd parties.

Hard to second guess from afar, but there are lots of good reasons why they are investing in a new campaign. A lot of other TOCs invest in advertising, so they are in no way unique in doing this. As for the timing, it is the normal time of year for TOCs to be launching campaigns. It is also the time of year when the cost of media (especially TV) is often at a low point, so they will be getting more audience per £ invested.

As for the point about getting the product and service right before advertising it, I've seldom worked with any advertiser who has a product or service that is perfect. If they did, they normally wouldn't need some lovely creative work to help convince potential customers otherwise.

 

[ainsworth74]

this board is so utterly, utterly predictable! faced conservative responses to an, checks notes, advert.

There seems to me that there is a diversity of opinion. Some are opposed but seem like it. Which is what I expected to find when I opened the thread. It seems odd to pretend that criticism is uniform and broken when it isn't?

Interestingly there is less wailing about costs when trains are re liveried or when Branson rail did some PR stunt. Odd that.

Well now your memory is definetly going

I can remember plenty of wailing and gnashing of teeth whenever Virgin so much as breathed in the direction of PR.

You might as well complain about the free tea bags and milk in the office as this.

Let's not be giving people ideas eh?

 

[Horizon22]

Ironically the kids love it, they've just produced a Christmas book and all sorts. I got my niece (age 5) a cuddly Miles from work and she won't put the thing down when she's out travelling around, he has to come with in his little bag.

Which is proof to those naysayers in the thread that a) it has a place and b) EMR can even make some money out of it with the merchandise!

 

[TT-ONR-NRN]

this board is so utterly, utterly predictable! Po faced conservative responses to an, checks notes, advert. Interestingly there is less wailing about costs when trains are re liveried or when Branson rail did some PR stunt.

Virgin are a well-known international brand and its what they’re known for. That gives them some ethos to make a bit of a scene. LNER is quite literally the government’s last minute brand for a train company, and them making out like they’re a glitzy famous brand on the same level is weird. Especially as they haven’t even tried to establish a NEW identity, even riding on Virgin’s colour scheme.

It’s like Coca-Cola is an established brand that you see going round with the enormous red snow covered lorries in the Christmas ads. You don’t see big glorified adverts for Tesco Everyday Cola, and that’s because although it’s the same (well…) thing as Coke, it’d just be a bit weird, because there’s no global brand or identity to that, it’s just something that’s sold.

 

[MarkyT]

Some of my parents' generation, including staff somehow felt the railways 'shouldn't have to' advertise and therefore it was clearly only a cost and thus a waste of (government) money. All this set against elephantine post-war reductions in rail demand largely to the benefit of the heavily promoted motor trade! Ads were looked down on no doubt. While print ads in papers and journals are ancient, easily overlooked and tolerated, I think there was quite a shock at the new commercial TV ads in the 1960s, difficult to completely avoid once the new device became the centre of entertainment at home. Many resented that and professed to avoid the 'lowbrow' independent stations, which may explain a continued dogged attachment to at least the notion of the BBC by the moneyed establishment while they simultaneously proclaim it the socialist central committee of satan and fount of all 'wokeness'. There's probably an underlying class thing going on here too. Aristocrats considered it beneath them to engage in 'trade' and advertising is demonstrably business laid bare.

 

[Horizon22]

It’s like Coca-Cola is an established brand that you see going round with the enormous red snow covered lorries in the Christmas ads. You don’t see big glorified adverts for Tesco Everyday Cola, and that’s because although it’s the same (well…) thing as Coke, it’d just be a bit weird, because there’s no global brand or identity to that, it’s just something that’s sold.

That’s comparing apples and oranges; you do for example see plenty of adverts for Tesco overall.

A fair comparison would be seeing adverts for other train operators or airlines. You obviously won’t see many adverts for driving (other than public information adverts). Sometimes the competition is versus “won’t travel”.

 

[MarkyT]

Virgin are a well-known international brand and its what they’re known for. That gives them some ethos to make a bit of a scene. LNER is quite literally the government’s last minute brand for a train company, and them making out like they’re a glitzy famous brand on the same level is weird. Especially as they haven’t even tried to establish a NEW identity, even riding on Virgin’s colour scheme.

New brands have to start somewhere. They had little choice but to adopt the train colour scheme being delivered as they took over. Government didn't want much expenditure during a planned short directly operated tenure while DfT launched a swift competition for a new commercial franchise. Then came COVID, industry meltdown, and the rest is history.

It’s like Coca-Cola is an established brand that you see going round with the enormous red snow covered lorries in the Christmas ads. You don’t see big glorified adverts for Tesco Everyday Cola, and that’s because although it’s the same (well…) thing as Coke, it’d just be a bit weird, because there’s no global brand or identity to that, it’s just something that’s sold.

Virgin tried a heavily promoted cola product. Although big in UK initially, it didn't last long once they took on the USA where Coke brought out its big guns to freeze them out of stores and destroy them. Branson reflects that such a product was not differentiated enough to compete successfully against such a dominant market leader. Don't think cola has much to tell us about railways though. These type of ads are as much about trying to portray a friendly positive image to the public as they are about pushing any particular travel product, and as I said they have to start somewhere to build a brand. I'm hoping that a push for new business will be matched by increases in service, which can be paid for by the new sales.

 

[TT-ONR-NRN]

That’s comparing apples and oranges; you do for example see plenty of adverts for Tesco overall.

A fair comparison would be seeing adverts for other train operators or airlines. You obviously won’t see many adverts for driving (other than public information adverts). Sometimes the competition is versus “won’t travel”.

New brands have to start somewhere. They had little choice but to adopt the train colour scheme being delivered as they took over. Government didn't want much expenditure during a planned short directly operated tenure while DfT launched a swift competition for a new commercial franchise. Then came COVID, industry meltdown, and the rest is history.

Virgin tried a heavily promoted cola product. Although big in UK initially, it didn't last long once they took on the USA where Coke brought out its big guns to freeze them out of stores and destroy them. Branson reflects that such a product was not differentiated enough to compete successfully against such a dominant market leader. Don't think cola has much to tell us about railways though. These type of ads are as much about trying to portray a friendly positive image to the public as they are about pushing any particular travel product, and as I said they have to start somewhere to build a brand. I'm hoping that a push for new business will be matched by increases in service, which can be paid for by the new sales.

All I’m saying is, it’s not a fair comparison to suggest that Branson’s advertising antics and this are the same. The OP whom I quoted seemed to imply if Virgin can get away with cheesy PR, why can’t LNER? My answer in a nutshell was, that has always been Virgin’s thing. In the 40 year history of the £3B worth global business.

 

[D365]

Virgin are a well-known international brand and its what they’re known for. That gives them some ethos to make a bit of a scene. LNER is quite literally the government’s last minute brand for a train company, and them making out like they’re a glitzy famous brand on the same level is weird. Especially as they haven’t even tried to establish a NEW identity, even riding on Virgin’s colour scheme.

I’d argue that - between their marketing, mobile ticketing platform and substantial leisure travel - LNER is almost as ’known’ now as GNER was back in the day.

New brands have to start somewhere. They had little choice but to adopt the train colour scheme being delivered as they took over. Government didn't want much expenditure during a planned short directly operated tenure while DfT launched a swift competition for a new commercial franchise. Then came COVID, industry meltdown, and the rest is history..

A government changing tack? Well I never! Spot on.

 

[TT-ONR-NRN]

I’d argue that - between their marketing, mobile ticketing platform and substantial leisure travel - LNER is almost as ’known’ now as GNER was back in the day.

What with all the same copycat rebrands to names from the 19th century services these days, I’d honestly not be surprised if plenty of lay passengers get them all confused. How can a brand called LNER be truly distinctive when it’s rivals are called LNWR, EMR, GWR, WMR?

Anyway, I’m not saying there’s anything wrong with its branding or this mascot or whatever! I’m simply saying that DarloRich’s reference to Virgin is not a fair comparison, as Virgin was a rare example of a global superbrand running a rail service. A fairer comparison would probably be any other TOC.

 

[D365]

What with all the same copycat rebrands to names from the 19th century services these days, I’d honestly not be surprised if plenty of lay passengers get them all confused. How can a brand called LNER be truly distinctive when it’s rivals are called LNWR, EMR, GWR, WMR?

This is the railway industry; don’t be shocked by acronyms!

I suppose that’s where the colours [and, to a degree, mascots] serve as distinct brand identities.

 

[CaptainHaddock]

I just googled "LNER mascot" and it came up with this terrifying creature.

Given LNER's recent reliability issues, maybe a cuddly animal called Wires-Down The Walrus might have been more appropriate?

 

[RAPC]

It’s like Coca-Cola is an established brand that you see going round with the enormous red snow covered lorries in the Christmas ads. You don’t see big glorified adverts for Tesco Everyday Cola, and that’s because although it’s the same (well…) thing as Coke, it’d just be a bit weird, because there’s no global brand or identity to that, it’s just something that’s sold.

Not a particularly strong example. Coke is an established brand. Tesco is an established brand. Tesco wouldn't need or want to create and promote a brand identity specifically for a single an own brand product.

 

[midland1]

Looks like he is a Sunderland fan !

 

[CaptainHaddock]

Looks like he is a Sunderland fan !

No, Lincoln City apparently. I think LNER sponsor their ground - doesn't make the mascot any less scary though!

 

[Energy]

Here's the puppet. Looks alright, the ad is a green-screened puppet to some footage of people in a carriage along to the music. Shouldn't have cost the moon to produce and should help bring some income to LNER.

Less terrifying than EMR Miles though I still prefer GWR's Famous Five and Avanti's Tortoise.

It can be summed up by a conversation I overheard a few weeks ago in a full and standing first class coach on my way to Birmingham on XC:

"Oh this really is awful. I like using the train from Newcastle to London, they're modern, quick and usually reliable. Then you get on here and you resent paying for it."

This brings up an interesting question of whether advertising all the different brands is worth it. It costs more but keeping crap service (XC) disassociated with a good operator (LNER) is worthwhile.

We also don't know how much advertising costs but given that it isn't a lot at the moment its going to be a small amount in the context of the rest of LNER.