Euston overcrowding

[Horizon22]

So the Platform Closed ‘crosses’ are ‘interlocked’ with the visual display on the indicators but not the ‘press to talk’ Tannoy? Are the two means of communication operated by different people/ organisations?

You would have thought they were both managed locally by Euston’s control room however it’s a unique setup which to me sounds like a separate system which also needs to be updated alongside the software for the CIS for the platform. Which would be totally ridiculous, but this is Euston so nothing surprises me…

 

[londonmidland]

To make things even more ridiculous, it seems the automated P.A, the screens in the concourse AND the screens above the platform entrances are all individually controlled and aren’t linked to each other.

I’ve seen it where only the screen above the platform entrance will advertise a service, but the main station concourse will still say ‘please wait’, as well as the announcement not yet advertising it.

Other times you’ll have it where the screens in the concourse will advertise services, but there’s no announcement until a couple of minutes later, or vice versa so the announcement comes first and then the screens will follow a few minutes later.

There’s no consistency or syncing with the way these systems are set up it seems.

 

[Bletchleyite]

"Platform closed" is just the default display on the screens if no train is up, it's nothing magic.

 

[Oxfordblues]

Instead of milling around the concourse gawping at the screens why don't people scrutinise realtimetrains to obtain the unit number for their departure, cross-reference it with the unit number of the inbound train, then check with opentraintimes or traksy for the platform number?

 

[Benjwri]

Instead of milling around the concourse gawping at the screens why don't people scrutinise realtimetrains to obtain the unit number for their departure, cross-reference it with the unit number of the inbound train, then check with opentraintimes or traksy for the platform number?

Because the vast majority of people don't know about any of those, or how to use them, it's a lot of effort and they'll get shouted at by the staff.

Not to mention if everyone did it in cases of dangerous overcrowding you bring that onto the platform instead, and then introduce a full and standing train arriving and suddenly you've got far bigger issues as people try to rush off the train and someone potentially gets pushed onto the track.

 

[Horizon22]

"Platform closed" is just the default display on the screens if no train is up, it's nothing magic.

Ah yes it does seem like they announced the platform manually but didn’t bother to post it, which is somewhat ridiculous (for a normal station). I’ve seen them do this before but only with a 15-30 second lag and even then, there’s radio comms between the control room and gateline staff so they have a heads up if there’s a particular reason.

 

[Mikey C]

On a general point here, I've noticed an article in today's Observer discussing Euston as London's worst rail terminus. It looks like the word is continuing to spread.

Big article in The Sunday Times too today.

Not that Euston's status as London's worst rail terminus has been in doubt for a long time, when you consider the improvements made elsewhere and contrast that with the mess that is Euston.

 

[Nippy]

Can't remember the head code but it was the Tring stopper I believe

It was a Tring train on the Up Slow. But it wasn’t at Bushey Station, it was near a bridge south of the station.

 

[Horizon22]

And now an Evening Standard article:

Euston is London's most hideous station, but it didn't have to be like this

If you have tears to shed, look up the photographs of the original entrance hall to Euston Station, and shed them right now. It was the creation of Philip Charles Hardwick, the son of the man who designed the original station building and the grand Euston Arch (the original Gateway to the North).

www.standard.co.uk

If you have tears to shed, look up the photographs of the original entrance hall to Euston Station, and shed them right now. It was the creation of Philip Charles Hardwick, the son of the man who designed the original station building and the grand Euston Arch (the original Gateway to the North).
It was an imposing classical space with a distinctive double flight of stairs and allegorical statues of the cities served by the station – wouldn’t you like to see what Birmingham looked like? Even if you don’t have a penchant for mid Victorian classicism, you would have to admit that the space presented rail travel as an honourable mode of transport to be housed in a dignified fashion rather than a disagreeable, unavoidable necessity reflected in a hideous, shambolic concourse.

 

[Class 170101]

I used RTT on Saturday to find my train before it was advertised as surprise surprise there were delays at Euston and crowding and no obvious plan in place for the fact St Pancras was closed (as well as Peterborough to Ely) and Derby were playing Norwich at Pride Park.

 

[ThameslinkUser]

And now an Evening Standard article:

Evening Standard no longer exists (thankfully)

 

[yorkie]

Experienced some new idiocy there yesterday.

Platform of a slightly late departure is announced via the tannoy, so people rush to the platform (I was already at the gate thanks to RTT). But the platform signs still say "closed" and lone Avanti worker refuses to let people through until the sign changes. 2 minutes later the ramp is crammed full of people waiting for the display to change, which it eventually does but now there is a mad rush to board with a significantly larger crowd packed into the same narrow and sloping space.

This demonstrates perfectly how a big chunk of the problems at Euston are down to the actions of staff and/or the policies the staff are told to implement. The poor attitude filters down from the very top at Euston. There is also a cultural problem within Avanti too. I've experienced poor attitudes in a range of roles at Euston going back many years. I can't see these attitudes changing any time soon, sadly.

 

[Horizon22]

This demonstrates perfectly how a big chunk of the problems at Euston are down to the actions of staff and/or the policies the staff are told to implement. The poor attitude filters down from the very top at Euston. There is also a cultural problem within Avanti too. I've experienced poor attitudes in a range of roles at Euston going back many years. I can't see these attitudes changing any time soon, sadly.

It's definitely a cultural problem. Yes, there are some layout and infrastructure issues which are extra things to deal with but other stations have their own unique issues too yet Euston seems to be far, far worse than any other major station.

 

[londonmidland]

I hope Euston is ready for all the additional passengers from other lines, during upcoming engineering works.

EMR are advising MML passengers travelling over the Christmas period, who are travelling to and from London, to use services towards Milton Keynes Central, from London Euston and vice versa. More info can be found here

• Customers travelling north from London will need to take a train from London Euston to Milton Keynes

• Customers travelling south to London St Pancras will transfer to rail replacement buses, which will operate between Bedford and Milton Keynes. From there, customers can continue their journey into London Euston via the West Coast Main Line

 

[matacaster]

Would covering the area outside at the front of the station with tent / awnings and relocating shops / cafes to that area be of benefit? This would be a temporary measure until a station redesign.

 

[Mikey C]

I hope Euston is ready for all the additional passengers from other lines, during upcoming engineering works.

EMR are advising MML passengers travelling over the Christmas period, who are travelling to and from London, to use services towards Milton Keynes Central, from London Euston and vice versa. More info can be found here

Plus a handful of GWR services as well!

 

[Bletchleyite]

I hope Euston is ready for all the additional passengers from other lines, during upcoming engineering works.

EMR are advising MML passengers travelling over the Christmas period, who are travelling to and from London, to use services towards Milton Keynes Central, from London Euston and vice versa. More info can be found here

Ouch. Just about the worst possible time for engineering works!

I hope they've funded WMT running more 12-cars otherwise it will be an absolute debacle.

 

[Mcr Warrior]

Just about the worst possible time for engineering works!

Which begs the question... When would be a better time?

 

[Bletchleyite]

Which begs the question... When would be a better time?

With a primarily leisure railway? Some random week in October or February I reckon.

 

[bramling]

This demonstrates perfectly how a big chunk of the problems at Euston are down to the actions of staff and/or the policies the staff are told to implement. The poor attitude filters down from the very top at Euston. There is also a cultural problem within Avanti too. I've experienced poor attitudes in a range of roles at Euston going back many years. I can't see these attitudes changing any time soon, sadly.

I agree there’s a cultural problem, though it isn’t Avanti such - it’s existed in all the West Coast franchises. It’s surprising this is something Virgin never addressed. Under Avanti things have certainly got worse.

 

[The Planner]

With a primarily leisure railway? Some random week in October or February I reckon.

Depends on the resources, and nothing runs Xmas Day or boxing day so no compensation paid to TOCs.

 

[crablab]

and nothing runs Xmas Day or boxing day so no compensation paid to TOCs.

Stuff definitely runs on Boxing Day. Not a lot, I grant you (a bugbear of mine) but there is a service

 

[John R]

Depends on the resources, and nothing runs Xmas Day or boxing day so no compensation paid to TOCs.

Is that still a thing? Government owned Network Rail paying compensation to TOCs who pass all the revenue received to the government?

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 1 Oct 2024 ==

I see that London TravelWatch has weighed in now, suggesting that Euston is unsafe. I expect Lord Hendy will now try and close down the body, if his past is anything to go by.

Euston station overcrowding - London TravelWatch

London TravelWatch statement on ongoing issues at Euston Station Even on good days, the passenger experience at London Euston fails to match its importance as the capital’s main rail gateway to four of the UK’s largest cities. But it is when train services are disrupted that the station really...

www.londontravelwatch.org.uk

London TravelWatch statement on ongoing issues at Euston Station
Even on good days, the passenger experience at London Euston fails to match its importance as the capital’s main rail gateway to four of the UK’s largest cities. But it is when train services are disrupted that the station really struggles to cope, with high levels of overcrowding putting passengers in danger.
London TravelWatch has met with Network Rail regarding these issues, yet passengers are still having to rush to platforms due to last minute announcements, staff appear overwhelmed by the sheer numbers of people involved and the recently-installed information screens seem to have done little if anything to make things better for passengers when services are disrupted.
It is almost a year since the Office of Rail and Road (ORR) issued an improvement notice to Network Rail regarding the station, but it seems little has changed. We are also very concerned that the situation will only worsen if new operators are successful in their recent applications to run additional services from the station, or if any of the current operators that run out of Euston increase their service frequency.
Incredibly, the ORR closed its improvement notice following actions taken and commitments made by Network Rail. In May, the Transport Select Committee asked Network Rail for further detail on these actions, which aim to improve the management of passenger flows at Euston. These details now need to be published and reviewed as a matter of urgency in the light of the latest events at the station.

 

[Bletchleyite]

I see that London TravelWatch has weighed in now, suggesting that Euston is unsafe. I expect Lord Hendy will now try and close down the body, if his past is anything to go by.

I'd like to see him resign, though I doubt we will - he clearly has the wrong attitude and isn't willing to invest in solving problems, he seems to just prioritise not looking bad.

 

[Kite159]

Just shows the ORR are pretty much like the other 'regulators' (Ofcom/Ofgem etc) in being complete & utter useless.

If they think the underlying issues at Euston can be resolved by deploying contractors to shout at customers when they dare hang around near the top of platform ramps before the platforms get announced, then they should simply get axed and replaced with a proper regulator. Euston is an accident waiting to happen.

Don't worry, I'm sure Lord Hendy is busy with his typewriter trying to shut down any critics.

 

[The Planner]

Is that still a thing? Government owned Network Rail paying compensation to TOCs who pass all the revenue received to the government?

Yep.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 1 Oct 2024 ==

Stuff definitely runs on Boxing Day. Not a lot, I grant you (a bugbear of mine) but there is a service

On the MML?

 

[Dr Hoo]

I had thought that the new Passenger Standards Authority was going to ‘roll up’ Transport Focus, the Rail Ombudsman and the ‘passenger rights’ functions of the ORR. Wouldn’t the National Rail responsibilities of London Travelwatch be included to ensure that there is no residual ‘fragmentation’ of passenger advocacy?

 

[Falcon1200]

And now an Evening Standard article:

Euston is London's most hideous station, but it didn't have to be like this

If you have tears to shed, look up the photographs of the original entrance hall to Euston Station, and shed them right now. It was the creation of Philip Charles Hardwick, the son of the man who designed the original station building and the grand Euston Arch (the original Gateway to the North).

www.standard.co.uk

I doubt anyone disagrees that Euston requires urgent improvement, but surely no-one thinks it should have been left as it was, complete with the Great Hall, and that it would have coped better with today's train and passenger numbers?!!

I have used Euston twice in the last two week, to catch 1S45 0830 to Glasgow, and on both days, while the station was busy, it was not uncomfortable or dangerous. It did seem however that separating arriving from departing passengers would be a major benefit, how this would be achieved is another thing. Improving access to the Underground would also help, although again easier said than done.

 

[Trainbike46]

I doubt anyone disagrees that Euston requires urgent improvement, but surely no-one thinks it should have been left as it was, complete with the Great Hall, and that it would have coped better with today's train and passenger numbers?!!

you forget, some people have such a strong dislike for architectural styles like those used in the current Euston, that they are, that they are at least hyptothetically, willing to accept any downside. People wanting to go back to the old Euston are never thinking functionally, but about (their) aesthetic preferences only.

 

[takno]

you forget, some people have such a strong dislike for architectural styles like those used in the current Euston, that they are, that they are at least hyptothetically, willing to accept any downside. People wanting to go back to the old Euston are never thinking functionally, but about (their) aesthetic preferences only.

It's weird. Architecturally I quite like Euston, and thought the old Euston looked like a rather poor cousin of King's Cross and St Pancras. That still doesn't make it pleasant to use with current passenger numbers of course.

Either way, there's no shortage of examples of Victorian train sheds in London, and while there is a shortage of fine brutalist examples, I'd happily see it knocked down if that was the best way to deliver a more workable station.