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URGENT - Med student in need of advice for TFL verification letter

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dw1222

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12 Oct 2024
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Greenwich
Hi all,
Just to quickly introduce my case, roughly a week ago, I was journeying from Plumstead to Gillingham to stay with my girlfriend for the night (through Thameslink I think). I had bought a weekly pass on my Oyster, which covers zones 1-6. Therefore, I was okay travelling from Plumstead all the way to Dartford.
However, on the train, I heard that Oysters were not valid past Dartford, as I would be travelling outside zone 6. I was aware of this, but it had completely slipped my mind to buy the ticket from Dartford to Gillingham as well. This is usually because I do not travel outside of zone 6. The only times I do so are when I am travelling with my girlfriend to Gillingham, and she normally sorts out buying the tickets and stuff, because I'm not great with technology.
As such, I attempted to buy a ticket on the train, by using the Trainline app, but remembered that I had just enough on my bank account for the £10 ticket from Dartford to Gillingham. However, as I was staying the night, I would also need to buy food and groceries as well. Therefore, I chose to buy the £3 ticket from Chatham to Gillingham so that I could have some money to buy some food that night.
With my horrible luck, I was caught by an inspector at Gillingham station, who scanned my ticket and told me that I had not used the ticket at Chatham and that the barriers there were closed. He took my name, address, etc. (I also explained my situation honestly to him) and told me that I should expect a £100 fine that would go down to £50 if paid early. I asked if my provided information would be used by any third parties and he explicitly told me NO.
Today, I've just received the attached letter in the post.

I know the right thing to do is to plead guilty, but I've also read online that settling out of court is very possible. I am a medicine student and this is a first time offence for me (except when I was 12 or something I bumped a bus once and got caught, but that was because I had lost my oyster). I honestly don't mind the fine, I'll pay whatever is asked of me. I just really don't want this to affect my criminal record/DBS checks as it is really important in medicine to keep that relatively clean.
I'm asking for advice on what I should do next to ensure that my record stays clean. I would like to settle out of court, but how do I go about doing that? If that's not possible, if I plead guilty, would turning up to court work for me or against me?
Please let me know and any advice is appreciated.
P.S. In addition, just for further context, the name my parents gave me at birth is a spelling mistake of a popular name. It's always been an insecurity of mine, and as of late, I've been trying to change my name use to the correct version of the name, as well as have it legally changed. When I gave my details to the inspector, I gave the name that would not be present on my driving license or passport (my new name), but it's only a one letter difference (and it's not the first letter) from my 'real name', and the address and everything was accurate. Would this be used against me?
 

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MikeWh

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Others will be along to help, but to correct your misunderstanding about Oyster: Dartford is in zone 8. You are able to travel via Dartford at no charge with a zone 1-6 travelcard because there are trains between the three lines which run direct as opposed to changing at Dartford. However, if you exit at Dartford you will be charged for a zone 6-8 single, and if you have a ticket from Dartford onwards to Kent then you are actually ticketless between Barnehurst/Crayford/Slade Green and Dartford.
 

skyhigh

Established Member
Joined
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Messages
6,392
You haven't received a "TFL verification letter", you have got a letter from Southeastern asking for your side of the story.

This is very good news for you, as TfL almost always prosecute, whereas Southeastern will usually settle without going to court for the fare due plus £150 or so in fees.
 

dw1222

Member
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Messages
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Location
Greenwich
I've also heard that, as I am being prosecuted by SouthEastern, I'm likely to be prosecuted (if I plead guilty) under the Regulation of Railway Act, which means it will be on my record.
 

skyhigh

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Messages
6,392
I've also heard that, as I am being prosecuted by SouthEastern, I'm likely to be prosecuted (if I plead guilty) under the Regulation of Railway Act, which means it will be on my record.
As long as you engage with them you're unlikely to be prosecuted.
 

dw1222

Member
Joined
12 Oct 2024
Messages
8
Location
Greenwich
You haven't received a "TFL verification letter", you have got a letter from Southeastern asking for your side of the story.

This is very good news for you, as TfL almost always prosecute, whereas Southeastern will usually settle without going to court for the fare due plus £150 or so in fees.
Thank you so much, this is great news. Do I just email or fill out the letter and explain my side of the story to settle?
 

signed

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I'm likely to be prosecuted (if I plead guilty) under the Regulation of Railway Act, which means it will be on my record.
You don't plead now, you are very unlikely to be prosecuted at all. Please look at other threads for the appropriate answer and please post your draft here before sending so that we can check it
 

dw1222

Member
Joined
12 Oct 2024
Messages
8
Location
Greenwich
Others will be along to help, but to correct your misunderstanding about Oyster: Dartford is in zone 8. You are able to travel via Dartford at no charge with a zone 1-6 travelcard because there are trains between the three lines which run direct as opposed to changing at Dartford. However, if you exit at Dartford you will be charged for a zone 6-8 single, and if you have a ticket from Dartford onwards to Kent then you are actually ticketless between Barnehurst/Crayford/Slade Green and Dartford.
So, my usual route of buying a zone 1-6 oyster weekly travel card and the ticket from Dartford to Gillingham doesn't cover my overall travel from Plumstead to Gillingham? Should I start getting a ticket from before Dartford, or is this a 'loophole' that isn't technically against the law?
 

signed

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Dartford is not in Zone 1-6, you either need what's called a boundary zone 6 ticket, or a ticket from Barnehurst/Crayford/Slade Green to your final destination, not a ticket from Dartford.

Your travelcard only authorizes travel to Barnehurst/Crayford/Slade Green
 

dw1222

Member
Joined
12 Oct 2024
Messages
8
Location
Greenwich
You don't plead now, you are very unlikely to be prosecuted at all. Please look at other threads for the appropriate answer and please post your draft here before sending so that we can check it
Don't worry if it's too much trouble, but would it be possible for you to link some? This is my first time on the forum (in fact my first time on any forum) so I'm having a bit of a trouble finding stuff (I'm not joking when I say I'm not great with technology).

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==

Dartford is not in Zone 1-6, you either need what's called a boundary zone 6 ticket, or a ticket from Barnehurst/Crayford/Slade Green.

Your travelcard only authorizes travel to Barnehurst/Crayford/Slade Green
Alright, I'll buy a ticket from Slade Green in the future, thank you for letting me know.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==

Also, any ideas on the name thing? Should I just put my original 'legal' forename there or should I leave it blank and let them carry on using my new, (personally) preferred name?

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==

This is my draft:

Dear Sir/Madam,

I’m writing to you today regarding a ticket evasion case under my name, XXXX XX, reference number: XXXXXX

On the 4th of October, I attempted to exit Gillingham Station using a ‘short-ticket’. Instead of buying a full-priced ticket from Dartford to Gillingham, I bought a ticket from Chatham to Gillingham. After being checked by a ticket inspector, I admitted to my wrongdoings and provided my details.

First, I would like to sincerely apologise for my behaviour. I acknowledge that, not only were my actions foolish, but they negatively impact a vital service that other fare-paying users rely on. As such, I deeply regret my actions and will never even think of attempting this again in the future. Needless to say, I have not done this again after the incident.

The reasons behind my actions were due to my recent financial struggles, which, at the time, I felt pressured me into taking these horrible measures. I now understand that, no matter my circumstances, they do not erase or excuse my wrongdoings and I, like any other passenger, should pay my full fare regardless.

Once again, I cannot stress how deeply sorry and embarrassed I am about this. I would be extremely grateful and remorseful if you could offer to settle my case on payments of the fares and any administrative costs I have incurred due to this case.

Sincerely and with kind regards,

XXX

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==

Questions
I would like any future correspondence for this letter to be sent to an another address (my friend's) as I would rather not have my parents find out. Should I just throw that request in at the end of the letter, like this?
P.S. As I am likely to be in a new location for the near foreseeable future, if you could please send any replies to this address, it would be greatly appreciated:
XXXXX
 
Last edited:

signed

Established Member
Joined
13 May 2024
Messages
1,539
Location
Paris, France
Alright, I'll buy a ticket from Slade Green in the future, thank you for letting me know.
You can save £2 per return by buying a Boundary Zone 6 ticket. And save a lot more on singles

You can get one on the forum ticketing website (helps running the forum as well)


Put your whole trip (from your initial origin) and then click on the cog-wheel, here you can select that you hold a 1-6 Anytime travelcard, it will factor it and make sure you always hold the correct ticket.
 

dw1222

Member
Joined
12 Oct 2024
Messages
8
Location
Greenwich
You can save £2 per return by buying a Boundary Zone 6 ticket. And save a lot more on singles

You can get one on the forum ticketing website (helps running the forum as well)


Put your whole trip (from your initial origin) and then click on the cog-wheel, here you can select that you hold a 1-6 Anytime travelcard, it will factor it and make sure you always hold the correct ticket.
Thanks! I'll go ahead and get it the next time I'm on my way there.
 

signed

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Messages
1,539
Location
Paris, France
Is my draft okay to send?
By all means wait for others, but I would remove all the reason part, while keeping the apology bit.

When you send it, do send it both via email and via Signed For 1st class paper as well
 

WesternLancer

Established Member
Joined
12 Apr 2019
Messages
10,726
Is my draft okay to send?
Just pause for 24 to 48 hours before sending anything if you can. So you can learn about the process and get your draft as good as it can be to secure an out of court settlement which is your most important objective.
 

MikeWh

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8,096
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So, my usual route of buying a zone 1-6 oyster weekly travel card and the ticket from Dartford to Gillingham doesn't cover my overall travel from Plumstead to Gillingham? Should I start getting a ticket from before Dartford, or is this a 'loophole' that isn't technically against the law?
Correct. There is a hole in the middle. If you were inspected and asked to show both tickets you could be in trouble. Fortunately for you:
You can save £2 per return by buying a Boundary Zone 6 ticket. And save a lot more on singles
The huge advantage of the BZ ticket is that you can use any route, so if you needed to get to Gillingham straight from zone 1 you wouldn't have to take a Woolwich line train, and could even go from Victoria via Swanley.
 

WesternLancer

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Joined
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Messages
10,726
Don't worry if it's too much trouble, but would it be possible for you to link some? This is my first time on the forum (in fact my first time on any forum) so I'm having a bit of a trouble finding stuff (I'm not joking when I say I'm not great with technology).

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==


Alright, I'll buy a ticket from Slade Green in the future, thank you for letting me know.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==

Also, any ideas on the name thing? Should I just put my original 'legal' forename there or should I leave it blank and let them carry on using my new, (personally) preferred name?

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==

This is my draft:

Dear Sir/Madam,

I’m writing to you today regarding a ticket evasion case under my name, XXXX XX, reference number: XXXXXX

On the 4th of October, I attempted to exit Gillingham Station using a ‘short-ticket’. Instead of buying a full-priced ticket from Dartford to Gillingham, I bought a ticket from Chatham to Gillingham. After being checked by a ticket inspector, I admitted to my wrongdoings and provided my details.

First, I would like to sincerely apologise for my behaviour. I acknowledge that, not only were my actions foolish, but they negatively impact a vital service that other fare-paying users rely on. As such, I deeply regret my actions and will never even think of attempting this again in the future. Needless to say, I have not done this again after the incident.

The reasons behind my actions were due to my recent financial struggles, which, at the time, I felt pressured me into taking these horrible measures. I now understand that, no matter my circumstances, they do not erase or excuse my wrongdoings and I, like any other passenger, should pay my full fare regardless.

Once again, I cannot stress how deeply sorry and embarrassed I am about this. I would be extremely grateful and remorseful if you could offer to settle my case on payments of the fares and any administrative costs I have incurred due to this case.

Sincerely and with kind regards,

XXX

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==

Questions
I would like any future correspondence for this letter to be sent to an another address (my friend's) as I would rather not have my parents find out. Should I just throw that request in at the end of the letter, like this?
P.S. As I am likely to be in a new location for the near foreseeable future, if you could please send any replies to this address, it would be greatly appreciated:
XXXXX
They aren’t really going to want to deal with ‘care of’ addresses via your friend I suspect. They will want your permanent contact address (don’t want to scare you but it would be so court papers/summonses can be sent- but with help from here hopefully this can be avoided).

It’s vital you get post they send you too, so avoiding changing address is probably for the best, unless the consequences of parents knowing is severe.
 

Hadders

Veteran Member
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Messages
16,485
I think your letter is fime to send.

Without going back over everything again, Southeastern are normally prepared to offer an out of court settlement to people who co-operate with them. Expect this to cost the fare avoided at ful anytime rate plus an admin fee, typically £150. It's good that you're dealing with Southeastern because if it were Transport for London you'd be looking at a trip to the Magistrates Court.

I'd try to avoid changing adderess, as it just complicates things.
 

Haywain

Veteran Member
Joined
3 Feb 2013
Messages
20,447
I would be extremely grateful and remorseful if you could offer to settle my case on payments of the fares and any administrative costs I have incurred due to this case.
I would suggest just changing this sentence a little. I think you are trying to say that your are remorseful and would be grateful for a settlement, but it sounds odd suggesting that only a settlement would cause you to be remorseful.
 
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