• Our new ticketing site is now live! Using either this or the original site (both powered by TrainSplit) helps support the running of the forum with every ticket purchase! Find out more and ask any questions/give us feedback in this thread!

Lothian Group discussion (Lothian City, Lothian Country Bus and East Coast Buses)

VioletEclipse

Member
Joined
10 Nov 2018
Messages
889
Location
Dùn Èideann
I seem to remember that years back it wasn't too uncommon on night buses to have the upper deck closed off by a wooden door at the base of the stair.
However, I have few memories of stair doors being used and am unable to find any photos of them. Does anyone know when they stopped being used?
 
Sponsor Post - registered members do not see these adverts; click here to register, or click here to log in
R

RailUK Forums

Lothian285

Member
Joined
26 Aug 2018
Messages
122
Location
Edinburgh
I seem to remember that years back it wasn't too uncommon on night buses to have the upper deck closed off by a wooden door at the base of the stair.
However, I have few memories of stair doors being used and am unable to find any photos of them. Does anyone know when they stopped being used?
I think the Gemini 2s were the last to have stair doors fitted, the 2014 and 2015 Gemini 3s possibly have them too but I'm not sure, definitely from 2016 onwards there haven't been stair doors fitted. I've attached a photo I took in 2013 showing a stair door in use.
 

Attachments

  • P7300044 Large.jpeg
    P7300044 Large.jpeg
    194.7 KB · Views: 150

90019

Established Member
Joined
29 May 2008
Messages
6,842
Location
Featherstone, West Yorkshire
I think the 2009 Geminis were the last buses to have a night door fitted.
The 2011 batch were definitely specced without and I'm fairly sure the 2010 Airlink ones didn't have it either.
 

Lothian285

Member
Joined
26 Aug 2018
Messages
122
Location
Edinburgh
I think the 2009 Geminis were the last buses to have a night door fitted.
The 2011 batch were definitely specced without and I'm fairly sure the 2010 Airlink ones didn't have it either.
Yes you are correct, having checked a few photos it does seem the 2009 Gemini 2s were the last with stair doors.
 

DGP

Member
Joined
31 Mar 2024
Messages
56
Location
London
Could anyone enlighten a non-Edinburgh resident like me in what circumstances the stair doors were used?
 

CSB0241

Member
Joined
22 Apr 2023
Messages
264
Location
Edinburgh, Scotland
There’s a tri axle Yutong electric coach in the yard at Seafield today. 24 plate. Expect this will join motorcoaches soon
I was unaware of this too, I thought they just had the U11DD.

9 or 23 probably. Been the homes of the majority of the demos.
I thought the U11DD was stationed at Longstone currently, have they moved it to Central? It’d be nice to see it on the 23, even if it is pretty egregious, it’d be cool to give it a go just to see how it holds up (I haven’t heard the greatest about Yutong’s low-floor buses so it’d be cool to test how much I agree with that on their double decker front). 9 would also be cool, it’s probably more much more likely than the 23, but I digress.

Much like the e-Citaro, no chance of an order for a Yutong product. But useful for comparing data.
I will be absolutely astonished if Lothian actually do buy any products from Yutong. it’d just be yet another fleet oddity like the E400 CityEVs or Streetairs, & I think the only chance of Lothian actually getting Yutongs is if they get outside funding (like SPEN with 291-294). I am aware of the phrase “never count your chickens before they hatch,” but the chances of this happening are extremely slim.

Guessing the Decker is YD73FTP. The coach might be its first demonstration.
It is indeed, yes.

The Yutong decker would make a wonderful product on the airlink
It would what?

What planet are you on?
It just wouldn’t.
I think these are valid responses. They’d need a much bigger order to cope with U11s on the 100 (probably around 15-20), with buses at a frequency of every 7-8min at least (more likely every 6min).

However, I have few memories of stair doors being used and am unable to find any photos of them. Does anyone know when they stopped being used?
Feel free to correct me if I’m wrong, but I believe the only buses on the Lothian fleet with these stair doors are 905/6 (if I can get a photo, I’ll share it).

Could anyone enlighten a non-Edinburgh resident like me in what circumstances the stair doors were used?
I’m not fully certain, but my guess is for on the nightbuses to keep everyone downstairs so that the driver can more easily keep an eye on everyone to make sure nothing happens.
 

Lx008

Member
Joined
16 Jul 2023
Messages
86
Location
Edinburgh
Photos of 932 online of its rebuild, looks very bizarre with 405s front
Safe to say it is slightly odd.

On the note of open deckers are tridents 219 and 220 still part of the fleet?
They don’t show up anywhere as an active part but still seem to be housed at marine with all the other open tops
 

Tayway

Member
Joined
17 May 2021
Messages
196
Location
Scotland
Why were they removed/no longer specced, as it seems like a fairly sensible idea. Rendered pointless by CCTV?
 
Joined
29 Nov 2018
Messages
703
Why were they removed/no longer specced, as it seems like a fairly sensible idea. Rendered pointless by CCTV?
Probably, although I imagine some vehicles fitted with stair doors also had decent CCTV.

Maybe it's better to give troublemakers and revellers somewhere to go by leaving the top deck available to them, rather than inflicting their antisocial behaviour on lower deck passengers (or driver) who may not have a choice where to sit.

Although I've known a few revelling drivers too....
 
Joined
15 Jul 2019
Messages
354
Location
Inverness
There is a photo of 932 floating about with the top front deck windscreen from 405 kinda looks weird first open top I've seen with full front deck windscreen on a Gemini.
 
Joined
25 Jan 2022
Messages
1,044
Location
Edinburgh
There is a photo of 932 floating about with the top front deck windscreen from 405 kinda looks weird first open top I've seen with full front deck windscreen on a Gemini.
251-255 had them, now with Bright Bus.

Yes you are correct, having checked a few photos it does seem the 2009 Gemini 2s were the last with stair doors.
I had a look to confirm, 930 looks like it had one which has since been removed as you can see where it was, and 11 plates don’t have those details.
 
Joined
25 Jan 2022
Messages
1,044
Location
Edinburgh
Yesterday at the Royal Infirmary I witnessed youths breaking into bus 400, opening the engine hatch. Afterwards they ran away and when the bus pulled away they ram and blocked it getting out of the Royal Infirmary.

Shocking, truly shocking. It’s not news anymore, it’s just a common occurrence. I will note that bus 400 did sound odd but I don’t know if it was like that prior.
 

computerSaysNo

Established Member
Joined
14 Dec 2018
Messages
1,450
Yesterday at the Royal Infirmary I witnessed youths breaking into bus 400, opening the engine hatch. Afterwards they ran away and when the bus pulled away they ram and blocked it getting out of the Royal Infirmary.

Shocking, truly shocking. It’s not news anymore, it’s just a common occurrence. I will note that bus 400 did sound odd but I don’t know if it was like that prior.
I was talking to a friend about bus driving and they asked me the following question which I couldn't answer: if people are trying to force their way into the bus at the front door, can the driver hold the door closed?

I know that there's a "door open" button on the outside of the bus: I would assume that this is setup in an OR gate with the button in the driver's cab, and I would assume that pressing it does the following:
  1. Vent the air pressure in the "door close" air line/cylinder (so that the door is no longer held closed).
  2. Increase air pressure in the "door open" air line/cylinder (so that the door is automatically opened).
My question, and I understand if nobody wants to answer it for security reasons, is, can the driver hold down their "door close" button in the cab to prevent the "door open" button outside from opening the door? And would this present enough air pressure to prevent someone from forcing the door open from the outside?
 
Joined
8 Feb 2021
Messages
765
Location
York
I was talking to a friend about bus driving and they asked me the following question which I couldn't answer: if people are trying to force their way into the bus at the front door, can the driver hold the door closed?

I know that there's a "door open" button on the outside of the bus: I would assume that this is setup in an OR gate with the button in the driver's cab, and I would assume that pressing it does the following:
  1. Vent the air pressure in the "door close" air line/cylinder (so that the door is no longer held closed).
  2. Increase air pressure in the "door open" air line/cylinder (so that the door is automatically opened).
My question, and I understand if nobody wants to answer it for security reasons, is, can the driver hold down their "door close" button in the cab to prevent the "door open" button outside from opening the door? And would this present enough air pressure to prevent someone from forcing the door open from the outside?
No. Not a chance. Doors have to be made to open regardless for evacuation reasons
 

Baileygirl

Member
Joined
31 Oct 2019
Messages
253
Location
livingston
On some buses holding the door closed button will keep them closed and make them harder to push open But unfortunately if someone is pushing the door open button from outside the bus won't move.
 

stevenedin

Established Member
Joined
26 Jul 2021
Messages
1,556
Location
Edinburgh
I’ve noticed that the old Lothian app is no longer available from the Apple App Store and there is now a message stating the the app is moving on the actual app itself.
 

CN04NRJ

Established Member
Joined
28 Nov 2019
Messages
1,853
Location
UK
On some buses holding the door closed button will keep them closed and make them harder to push open But unfortunately if someone is pushing the door open button from outside the bus won't move.

Yes, unfortunately there's not much we can do other than keep pressing shut if someone is trying to force their way on. Of course, that brings the risk of trapping them in the doors (be it hands, body or whatever) that opens the door for other issues.
 

Top