M5 closed after major accident

[90019]

Lots of superb points made there mate, I totally agree about the scrappage scheme, it might have made a short term boost to the new car market, but it took far too many usable cheap cars off of our roads

There used to be a Mk2 Polo that lived a couple of miles from me, it was immaculate, I think they'd had it from new and it wasn't massively high milage but it had been well kept and the bodywork and interior looked almost new. The only thing that was wrong with it was a single missing wheeltrim.
It was heartbreaking to see it turn up at the breakers as a scrappage car, with it's wheels removed and just dumped in the middle of a load of other cars, still mostly intact and in really good condition, but the grill had been partially ripped off when someone had taken a headlight
There are still scrappage scheme cars there waiting to go into the main yard, and it's so disappointing to see all these perfectly roadworthy cars just being scrapped.

and you do about 6500 miles per annum

In a full year driving, I think I'd put nearly 20000 miles on a car

a 1998 BMW 523i at 28 mpg

My Dad has a '99 523i Auto, and I believe the current figure is 19mpg

 

[Temple Meads]

My Dad has a '99 523i Auto, and I believe the current figure is 19mpg

Bloody hell, my mates 535i does 24.

 

[90019]

Bloody hell, my mates 535i does 24.

It's mostly driven in and around Edinburgh, and being an auto as well, the figures were never going to be particularly impressive

I don't think the fact it's only done 47000 miles helps either, mind.

 

[richw]

Yet again we have a topic that involves driving and yet again Zoe pipes up about how driver-less cars are our saviour and reducing national speed to that of HGVs is the way foward:roll:

I may assume she is away with the fairys on this idea. It is still one of the most stupidest ideas i've ever heard. Not quite sure she is on the same planet as the rest of us with a majority of her posts. Her ideas look like stuff my mate comes up with when hes been on a session of his illegal substances.

 

[Temple Meads]

I feel this thread should be about the dreadful loss of life in the crash, rather than badmouthing our fellow members.
I've been to blame for some of the off topic posts, for that I apologise.

 

[richw]

The cleanest possible car you can run is an old diesel running on used veg oil.

I had a p reg 306 diesel that up till it was written off by some idiot side swiping me, had done 395000 miles, of which the previous owner had done 100000 miles solely on veg oil, he told me where to source it from, and i did another 50000 miles on the stuff, never had a problem with the car at all.

Old cars are just as safe as they were when new (dependant on maintainance and things), they don't get more dangerous as they age, it's just that newer cars tend to be safer. That's always been the case, and always will be.

There are plenty of 80s and 90s cars I'd rather have than newer ones

The only thing that may weaken them is rust in the structure.

 

[Zoe]

I may assume she is away with the fairys on this idea. It is still one of the most stupidest ideas i've ever heard. Not quite sure she is on the same planet as the rest of us with a majority of her posts. Her ideas look like stuff my mate comes up with when hes been on a session of his illegal substances.

The majority of my posts (this would require at least 1700 of them) are not on a different planet, you may well not agree with some of them but that doesn't make the ideas stupid. Clearly Google do not consider the idea of driverless cars to be stupid and even GM plan to be testing driverless cars by 2015 and they could be on the road by 2018. http://www.wired.com/autopia/2008/01/gm-says-driverl/

 

[Kernowfem]

I'd like to know how many of us on the forum have had the misfortune to be involved in a serious RTA, and as a result changed their driving standards and their vehicle to something more "safer".

I was in a vauxhall Astra. I was hit head on by a drunk driver who was heading north in a south bound carriageway. It was early morning, still dark and all i remember is seeing what i thought was the rear of a car with his tail light lenses put through. What i was seeing was his front end coming straight at me.

I was cut out of the vehicle after suffering a shattered pelvis, a trauma amputated limb, a smashed knee cap and fractured arm. I consider myself lucky. At a combined speed of 120 MPH i really should be dead.

These events change peoples lives. It wrecked my career, my self confidence and my ability to walk. I spent six weeks in hospital. The man who caused my accident got a three year suspended sentence, a three year ban and a fine.

And so...i learned to walk again, got used to the fact i'll never have children and have slowly recovered to the point where i'm living a healthy happy life. However, i invested in a larger car, with euro encap rating. I also drive 4x4's some for the safety element, some for the love of the vehicle itself.

I have to drive, and so i try and make myself as safe as possible while doing so. Even though i was not responsible for my accident, i have become a much more careful driver. Some people believe they are immortal, and the whole "it will never happen to me attitude" will always be a problem.

Harsher punishments for those who drive dangerously and endanger life/and/or take a life should be introduced. Stronger deterents may help. Some pass their test at 17 and within minutes can be on a motorway doing 70+ MPH, having had no experience. Surely some things need to change??

 

[Zoe]

However, i invested in a larger car, with euro encap rating. I also drive 4x4's some for the safety element, some for the love of the vehicle itself.

Considering your injuries though would it have cost considerably more to have the automatic transmission version that you'd need and also hand controls fitted?

I have to drive, and so i try and make myself as safe as possible while doing so.

The issue here is that people feel they have to drive due to the lack of public transport in many areas. One good point though is that many buses have full disabled access these days.

Harsher punishments for those who drive dangerously and endanger life/and/or take a life should be introduced. Stronger deterents may help. Some pass their test at 17 and within minutes can be on a motorway doing 70+ MPH, having had no experience. Surely some things need to change??

This is where there may well be a case for graduated licencing. Learners are not allowed on motorways and when the question is asked as to why this is the case the answer is often that it is simply too dangerous to allow them. Once they have passed the test though they can drive on a motorway which it was considered would have been too dangerous for them to train on before their test even though they still haven't had any training.

 

[Kernowfem]

Considering your injuries though would it have cost considerably more to have the automatic transmission version that you'd need and also hand controls fitted?

My Landrovers and my insignia are all automatic, and to be honest i havent really noticed a difference in price. I don't need hand controls at all, just a bog standard auto is excellent for me...because i lost my left leg using the clutch with a prosthetic would be very stupid of me, and likely to cause minor bumps etc.

The issue here is that people feel they have to drive due to the lack of public transport in many areas. One good point though is that many buses have full disabled access these days.

Indeed, i fully agree. However having to carry a spare limb over your shoulder on a bus is not my idea of fun...they are heavy and can upset certain members of the public

This is where there may well be a case for graduated licencing. Learners are not allowed on motorways and when the question is asked as to why this is the case the answer is often that it is simply too dangerous to allow them. Once they have passed the test though they can drive on a motorway which it was considered would have been too dangerous for them to train on before their test even though they still haven't had any training.

I agree with you. I appreciate not ALL 17 year olds will cause accidents etc. Even some older new drivers would be in the same risk bracket. I think that changes need to be made.

 

[Zoe]

because i lost my left leg using the clutch with a prosthetic would be very stupid of me, and likely to cause minor bumps etc.

Would the DVLA actually allow that?

 

[Kernowfem]

Would the DVLA actually allow that?

Please forgive my cock up in replying to your post above Zoe....my brain hasn't started working yet

I believe the DVLA recommend that amputees do drive vehicles that better suit their needs. However, i'm not sure if we, by law are not permitted to drive a manual. I know amputees who do. I simply find it easier to drive an Auto.

 

[Zoe]

On the subject of motorways, I was a passenger on he M5 in 2009 and the vehicle was in lane 3 when the driver decided to move into lane 2 but forgot to check their mirrors. They had to make a last minute swerve to avoid a collision. It could be argued that anyone that makes a mistake like that shouldn't be driving at all but I doubt anyone is a perfect driver that never makes a mistake.

 

[Kernowfem]

On the subject of motorways, I was a passenger on he M5 in 2009 and the vehicle was in lane 3 when the driver decided to move into lane 2 but forgot to check their mirrors. They had to make a last minute swerve to avoid a collision. It could be argued that anyone that makes a mistake like that shouldn't be driving at all but I doubt anyone is a perfect driver that never makes a mistake.

I think as drivers we ALL make the odd mistake. However i constantly remind myself that i do not want to be responsible for putting anyone where i am right now. And that thought makes me a more careful, considerate driver.

 

[Zoe]

I believe the DVLA recommend that amputees do drive vehicles that better suit their needs. However, i'm not sure if we, by law are not permitted to drive a manual. I know amputees who do. I simply find it easier to drive an Auto.

So when you declared your injury to the DVLA they didn't restrict your licence to automatic transmission only then or require you to have a hand clutch fitted?

 

[Kernowfem]

So when you declared your injury to the DVLA they didn't restrict your licence to automatic transmission only then or require you to have a hand clutch fitted?

I had to fill in a questionaire to determine whether my license should be restricted, along with a report from my GP. However it hasn't been.

There are many levels of amputation, upper body, lower body full length, or below knee...My level meant that i could still drive a manual if i chose to do so in the opinion of the DVLA. However, i couldn't get the hang of clutch control with my prosthetic, so common sense prevailed and i now drive a simple auto. Accelerator and break, you just point it in the right direction and away you go, there was no need for any modifcations at all.

 

[Zoe]

Accelerator and break, you just point it in the right direction and away you go, there was no need for any modifcations at all.

And with cruise control all you have to do on the motorway is steer it although one person I was talking to actually said they wouldn't want cruise control as it would reduce their concentration.

 

[Kernowfem]

And with cruise control all you have to do on the motorway is steer it although one person I was talking to actually said they wouldn't want cruise control as it would reduce their concentration.

Not all automatics are fitted with cruise control. My car is, but i dont use it. Even though the slightest touch on the break cancels it out, i dont feel in control of the car when its engaged.

Automatics are so easy to drive i refer to it as "lazy driving"

 

[Zoe]

i dont feel in control of the car when its engaged.

What about radar cruise control though?

 

[Kernowfem]

What about radar cruise control though?

I couldnt afford the radar version!!! lol. Even so, its still run by the car's computer and things can malfunction and go wrong.

While im not seriously up on these things i still wouldn't choose to use it, its just a personal preference. I like to feel in control of the vehicle. I don't see the point in allowing the vehicle to maintain a certain speed through its own steam, While its good for sticking to speed limits, its still simple enough to maintain a speed via your right foot.

 

[Zoe]

I couldnt afford the radar version!!! lol. Even so, its still run by the car's computer and things can malfunction and go wrong.

While im not seriously up on these things i still wouldn't choose to use it, its just a personal preference. I like to feel in control of the vehicle. I don't see the point in allowing the vehicle to maintain a certain speed through its own steam, While its good for sticking to speed limits, its still simple enough to maintain a speed via your right foot.

Doubt you are looking forward to driverless cars then.

 

[Kernowfem]

Doubt you are looking forward to driverless cars then.

Purely and simply no. I wouldn't like to see them introduced. While they could potentialy lower driver related errors, a computer is no more or less complex than the human brain and will in my opinion, be just as vulnerable to cock ups.

There are numerous factors as to what causes road traffic accidents. Every incident is unique. While ever vehicles are on roads, they will continue to happen, its inevitable.

In the mean time every driver is responsible for themselves, and thier actions will always have consequences. I would like to see the driving age lifted, certain restrictions on engine sizes for younger drivers, mandotary test resits every two or three years for every driver, and those found guilty of driving dangerously/drunk etc etc banned for life, i would like to add though that in my opinion sometimes age can bare little difference to how much of a risk drivers are (regardless of certain satistics) Some people are born to drive, others should simply give up and never take to the wheel!

Cost, red tape and many other factors would make the above very difficult to enforce. Death and injury free roads will sadly never happen.

 

[Zoe]

I would like to see the driving age lifted

18 would put the UK in line with most of the rest of the EU but I doubt it would be raised beyond that. I doubt raising the age to 25 for example would be very popular.

 

[Kernowfem]

18 would put the UK in line with most of the rest of the EU but I doubt it would be raised beyond that. I doubt raising the age to 25 for example would be very popular.

At 18 you can vote, you are classed as an adult. 25, i think would be extreme. There are some very good drivers much younger than that. This is where the problems would begin. We cant stereo type and claim that ALL 17/18+ year olds are bad drivers, that would be wrong.

So where does one draw the line? Impossible task.

 

[Zoe]

At 18 you can vote, you are classed as an adult. 25, i think would be extreme.

To work in a safety critical position on the railways you have to be 18. There is certainly a case for raising the car driving age to 18.

 

[jon0844]

On the subject of motorways, I was a passenger on he M5 in 2009 and the vehicle was in lane 3 when the driver decided to move into lane 2 but forgot to check their mirrors. They had to make a last minute swerve to avoid a collision. It could be argued that anyone that makes a mistake like that shouldn't be driving at all but I doubt anyone is a perfect driver that never makes a mistake.

The driver in lane 3 is overtaking and entitled to pull back in. Doesn't that mean the idiot in lane 2 was undertaking if there was a chance of a collision?

If the cars were doing equal speed, then the driver in lane 3 would surely have noticed them. If the car was slower, no problem. If the car was going faster (undertaking) then it was surely at fault - although obviously the driver in lane 3 should have made a quick check in the mirror and over the shoulder.

 

[Zoe]

The driver in lane 3 is overtaking and entitled to pull back in. Doesn't that mean the idiot in lane 2 was undertaking if there was a chance of a collision?

If the cars were doing equal speed, then the driver in lane 3 would surely have noticed them. If the car was slower, no problem. If the car was going faster (undertaking) then it was surely at fault - although obviously the driver in lane 3 should have made a quick check in the mirror and over the shoulder.

I don't remember all the details but regardless of that, isn't it still a good idea to check mirrors just in case? It may be that the driver didn't realize that they hadn't fully overtaken the vehicle in lane 2, we did spend a fair bit of the journey sitting in lane 3. In one case on the same journey we were in lane 3 and had to leave the motorway to go to the services but the car in lane 2 decided to match our speed and not let us fully overtake so in order to leave the motorway the driver had to slow down and let it pass in lane 2.

 

[richw]

And with cruise control all you have to do on the motorway is steer it although one person I was talking to actually said they wouldn't want cruise control as it would reduce their concentration.

Cruise control is boring, I try to use it because it improves fuel consumption, but it is so boring I lose concentration very quickly. I actually try to avoid motorways where possible as i find driving constantly in 6th gear, very little gear changing very tiring, yet I don't find the same on A roads where you have bends roindabouts etc to think about

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[Zoe]

I actually try to avoid motorways where possible as i find driving constantly in 6th gear, very little gear changing very tiring, yet I don't find the same on A roads where you have bends roindabouts etc to think about

So it will be the A303(T) then for you if you go to London? Can get a bit frustrating getting stuck behind a truck through the Blackdown Hills.

 

[richw]

So it will be the A303(T) then for you if you go to London? Can get a bit frustrating getting stuck behind a truck through the Blackdown Hills.

Always a303 without fail for me, trying to work out getting to Manchester airport on Saturday with as little motoway usage as possible.

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