Driver Earning Potential

TOCDriver · 9 Jan 2014

Silv1983 said:
Is there a simple answer? I really don't think "I've heard some drivers earn 60-75k - is this true?" Can have a simple answer - i.e. yes or no.
If discussion, debate and differing opinions bother you so much I think you'd better delete your account for the sake of your blood pressure

To the OP:

If you meant can a driver earn 60-75k as a pre-tax salary: then Yes, probably.

If you meant (as I did so impertinently like spawn of satan - judging from my rebukes) 60 - 75k take home pay per annum: very difficult.

Hope this unruffles a few feathers...

Agree 100%. When you get into the high tax paying bracket, take home pay significantly drops. You would have to have a gross income of 100K plus to take home that amount of money, which would mean virtually working 18+ hours a day.

RailUK Forums

A-driver · 9 Jan 2014

JAMBO said:
Simple answer to that then is to recruit more qualified drivers!

Well yea, that's hardly a revolutionary new argument is it?! Problem is that it works out far, far cheaper for them to pay overtime and, when desperate, authorise the big deals (12+hours pay for a snip turn) with divers as is explained in other posts.

westbrom · 10 Jan 2014

Its the way some people are,they could work in a job doing 7 days a week to earn 40k.
They could then get a job 47k Monday to Friday and still work the weekends,its as if they not happy unless they are living beyond their means and need to work all hours god sends to keep ahead of the bills.

A-driver · 10 Jan 2014

westbrom said:
Its the way some people are,they could work in a job doing 7 days a week to earn 40k.

They could then get a job 47k Monday to Friday and still work the weekends,its as if they not happy unless they are living beyond their means and need to work all hours god sends to keep ahead of the bills.

To be fair we are talking of a minority who have to work RDs to survive. Most people on RDW are using it to boost savings, put extra into their mortgage, re-decorate, upgrade their holiday, buy a new TV/computer etc and would be absolutely fine on basic if RDs dried up.

There is also a good argument that some drivers have family's where the kids are at school and their partner is at work mon-fri 9-5 so if they have mid-week rest days they may aswell work them and get a bit extra. These are the ones who never work extra Sundays or RDW on Saturdays when they want to spend time with family. Especially on earlies you will still be back when the kids get home from school etc.

TDK · 11 Jan 2014

western Champion said:
If those new recruits are existing drivers it can be up to twelve months before they have completed their traction and route learning and become productive,

I would say usually 3 - 4 months maximum depending on TOC and 9 - 12 months for off the street drivers.

JAMBO · 11 Jan 2014

So there are drivers earning 30k plus in overtime, so which TOCS/FOCS don't have a rest day agreement in place, or is such that no rest days are available to make some extra pocket money as they have a full compliment of drivers. Do northern still have no RDW, is this a union matter?

A-driver · 11 Jan 2014

TDK said:
I would say usually 3 - 4 months maximum depending on TOC and 9 - 12 months for off the street drivers.

Depends on how complex the depots routes are. I was about 4-5months when I moved company to sign 4 traction units, do an OHLE course, 40 hours with a minder and learn the 3 routes we have. Equally I know a qualified who joined southern when I was there and wasn't fully productive in the roster for about a year as he had a almost a dozen routes to sign.

scotraildriver · 12 Jan 2014

JAMBO said:
So there are drivers earning 30k plus in overtime, so which TOCS/FOCS don't have a rest day agreement in place, or is such that no rest days are available to make some extra pocket money as they have a full compliment of drivers. Do northern still have no RDW, is this a union matter?

No rest day working at Scotrail as I said, company claim to have a full complement although trains are being cancelled sometimes if people sick etc. The union agreed to it although it has caused considerable displeasure, as many drivers felt it was their choice to do overtime or not and not the unions job to decide.

TDK · 13 Jan 2014

A-driver said:
Depends on how complex the depots routes are. I was about 4-5months when I moved company to sign 4 traction units, do an OHLE course, 40 hours with a minder and learn the 3 routes we have. Equally I know a qualified who joined southern when I was there and wasn't fully productive in the roster for about a year as he had a almost a dozen routes to sign.

I think the governing factor is how the company are at training and also their recourses. If they had good recourses, for example, plenty of trainers, managers and instructors available the times would be consistently as I quoted. The delay in completion is usually down to recourses where sometimes it takes a lot longer than it should.

Sir Topham Hat · 13 Jan 2014

the sniper said:
All Sundays are rest days for LM drivers, as their Sundays are uncommitted/outside the working week.

If their Sunday pay is worked out the same as the Guards,, which I think it is, with their new pay deal I believe they'd be on more than £400 for a Sunday.

EDIT: As for the original question, there's a driver instructor at our place, who has effectively lived in our depot, who said he'd done over £100k (pre-tax...) the other year. I can believe it. £60k is easily achievable.

LM drivers get time and a half for Sundays so approximately £38.70 an hour. Therefore a minimum 8 hour turn pays £309 gross and a 10 hour turn £387.

western Champion · 13 Jan 2014

TDK said:
I would say usually 3 - 4 months maximum depending on TOC and 9 - 12 months for off the street drivers.

TDK, a new existing driver to VT at Wolves gets 4 months to learn Wolves to Euston via Weedon and Northampton inc via Bescot and Aston to Stetchford. Then there's the Trent Valley (3 weeks), Wolves to Crewe (3 weeks), Crewe to Preston (3 weeks), Crewe to Colwich and Norton Bridge via Stoke (3 weeks), Central Rivers all routes (3 weeks), a Pendo course (3 weeks), Voyager course (3 weeks).

All BTW are based on a five day week.

Hardly the 3 - 4 months you quote above. Also it's worth noting that the route leaning norms above stand even if you already signed some or all of the routes at your previous employer. VT makes you learn them all over again.
We've recently had a driver move from Freightliner Intermodal at Crewe who has had to learn London etc all over again.

There are two reasons for this :-

1) Wherever you've moved from you won't have been driving these routes at EPS speeds.

2) When you sign your routes with Virgin it is to Virgins standards so there is no come back to Virgin if you screw up on a route you previously signed else where.

Hence why new recruitment takes a long time to have any effect on rest day working.

I hope this helps clarify for you why the 'up to 12 months' is relevant at VT.

A-driver · 13 Jan 2014

western Champion said:
TDK, a new existing driver to VT at Wolves gets 4 months to learn Wolves to Euston via Weedon and Northampton inc via Bescot and Aston to Stetchford. Then there's the Trent Valley (3 weeks), Wolves to Crewe (3 weeks), Crewe to Preston (3 weeks), Crewe to Colwich and Norton Bridge via Stoke (3 weeks), Central Rivers all routes (3 weeks), a Pendo course (3 weeks), Voyager course (3 weeks).

All BTW are based on a five day week.

Hardly the 3 - 4 months you quote above. Also it's worth noting that the route leaning norms above stand even if you already signed some or all of the routes at your previous employer. VT makes you learn them all over again.
We've recently had a driver move from Freightliner Intermodal at Crewe who has had to learn London etc all over again.

There are two reasons for this :-

1) Wherever you've moved from you won't have been driving these routes at EPS speeds.

2) When you sign your routes with Virgin it is to Virgins standards so there is no come back to Virgin if you screw up on a route you previously signed else where.

Hence why new recruitment takes a long time to have any effect on rest day working.

I hope this helps clarify for you why the 'up to 12 months' is relevant at VT.

Many companies now get you to re-lean & sign existing routes for those reasons to. Many GA drivers based at Cambridge flock to FCC and they all have to learn kings Lynn like anyone else. Same with southern drivers going to FCC. It didn't matter that they have driven Brighton-London bridge etc for 20 years, they still learn it like anyone else simply to prevent incidents being blamed on lack of training or 'we were always taught to do it like that at xyz TOC' etc.

ultra4 · 22 Jan 2014

Any idea how much shunters earn with FGW?

Legzr1 · 23 Jan 2014

Beveridges said:
The term "living at work" is hard to define. Some may work 35 hrs per week but spend another 10 hrs commuting to/from work. Someone else who may do 45 hrs may be seen as someone who "lives there" but if he has no commute - like a short walk to work like some people have - then he is really not "living at work" any more than the former example who does no overtime at all!!

Good point and one that reflects my recent circumstances - I moved from one FOC paying £X for an average 8 hour shift to another FOC paying £X + £9K basic for an average 10 hour shift - I cut my commute from 80 miles to 13 so I'm actually 'out of the house' for less time (or at worst around the same time) for quite a bit more basic (plus all the extras and lump for the extra 2 hours every shift).

Driver Earning Potential

TOCDriver

Member

RailUK Forums

A-driver

Established Member

westbrom

Member

A-driver

Established Member

TDK

Established Member

JAMBO

Member

A-driver

Established Member

scotraildriver

Established Member

TDK

Established Member

Sir Topham Hat

Member

western Champion

Member

A-driver

Established Member

ultra4

Member

Legzr1

Member