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Future scrapping of multiple units

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gc1982

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This is my first post, so please be gentle :D (Apologies if there is already a thread for this)

With all the new stock being introduced over the coming years, the delays in electrification etc, it got me thinking, what will be the class of the next multiple unit to be scrapped because it is deemed 'surplus to requirements? (Like the dozen or so class 508's a few years ago and not because of accidents or the odd carriage in a set like the 321's transferred to Scotland)

Will it be a 319? a 315? a 442? or will these units be kept in warm storage and it is a pacer that gets scrapped first? Also when do people think it will happen? I'm going to stick my neck out and say a Class 315 by Easter 2018 :)

(Just for clarity tube stock etc is excluded)
 
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D365

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Excluding the Class 442s, which are very much a niche design, Classes 313-317 (excluding the Southern 313s) are going to be the next complete batch of electric units to be scrapped. They're on their way to life-expired, if not there already.
 
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Deepgreen

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Welcome. Your mention of 442s will get many here twitching, as it has been one of the most speculated-about classes! Many are currently in warm storage amid rumours of a potential new operator, but nothing concrete has appeared yet.

It is also the subject of speculation how long the Island Line units will last, and what will replace them. It would be pleasing if they last until 2038, but that will be a stretch!
 
bramling

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gc1982 said:
This is my first post, so please be gentle :D (Apologies if there is already a thread for this)

With all the new stock being introduced over the coming years, the delays in electrification etc, it got me thinking, what will be the class of the next multiple unit to be scrapped because it is deemed 'surplus to requirements? (Like the dozen or so class 508's a few years ago and not because of accidents or the odd carriage in a set like the 321's transferred to Scotland)

Will it be a 319? a 315? a 442? or will these units be kept in warm storage and it is a pacer that gets scrapped first? Also when do people think it will happen? I'm going to stick my neck out and say a Class 315 by Easter 2018 :)

(Just for clarity tube stock etc is excluded)
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Watch out for the 7x class 321 trailers, these have been stored for some months now and there have been suggestions their owner is prepared to dispose of them.

Apart from that, I'd put money that the first to go could well be some (but probably not all, at least initially) 442s if no re-use plans are found within a reasonable timescale, or failing that probably the GN 313s. Purely a guess, but I'd suggest the 315s may be stored for a time before any decision is made.

Regarding Underground stock, once the last D stock is withdrawn, there won't be any large-scale scrapping of Underground trains for the forseeable future, apart from odd vehicles. One particularly sad example of the latter may well be the A stock rail adhesion trains, unfortunately.
 
rebmcr

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bramling said:
Regarding Underground stock, once the last D stock is withdrawn, there won't be any large-scale scrapping of Underground trains for the forseeable future.
Click to expand...

2022-2025ish is very much in the 'forseeable' part of the future!
 
Class377/5

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313 likely to be the next class that goes to the scrap pile. Just maybe noty all in the same cascade.
 
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AM9

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xotGD said:
Please let it be the Northern 142s!
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The fact is that Pacers are easily deployable on cleared routes when emergency capacity is needed so they will not be the first class to disappear. Stored EMUs are pretty useless when the OLE fails.
 
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physics34

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Alot of people have their nostalgia head on when it relates to scraping units but 40 years of tough outdoor work does wonders for corrosion and also structural integraty aswell as less supplies of spare parts and lower efficiencies. Its a shame but the PEP family is life expired.
 
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Townsend Hook

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physics34 said:
Alot of people have their nostalgia head on when it relates to scraping units but 40 years of tough outdoor work does wonders for corrosion and also structural integraty aswell as less supplies of spare parts and lower efficiencies. Its a shame but the PEP family is life expired.
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They could probably be retractioned and refurbished and hang on another decade or two, for a price, but to the ROSCOs it probably makes more sense to just replace them with new stock.
 
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SpacePhoenix

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SWT's 455s are a possibility with the dwell times specified for the next franchise tender, iirc 455s wouldn't be able to meet the required dwell times
 
trainmania100

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Class377/5 said:
313 likely to be the next class that goes to the scrap pile. Just maybe noty all in the same cascade.
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Must be quite a few years left for the southern ones? Their all being modified , what would be after them? 377s replacing their dutupies?
 
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sd0733

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SpacePhoenix said:
SWT's 455s are a possibility with the dwell times specified for the next franchise tender, iirc 455s wouldn't be able to meet the required dwell times
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As they have been retractioned and DDA mods completed if they are replaced, wonder if potentially some of the SWT 455s could switch over to Southern for a few years to replace their non modified ones.
 
61653 HTAFC

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xotGD said:
Please let it be the Northern 142s!
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The first fleet to be entirely withdrawn by Northern will likely be 144s (planned to be gone by summer 2019) as that's a smaller fleet than the 142s. Though on the other hand, the ability and willingness on behalf of Porterbrook to make them 2020-ready does mean they could end up going to Wales.

AM9 said:
The fact is that Pacers are easily deployable on cleared routes when emergency capacity is needed so they will not be the first class to disappear. Stored EMUs are pretty useless when the OLE fails.
Click to expand...

But they can't be used after NYE 2019, so they're unlikely to be kept "just in case". It's not beyond the realms of possibility that NR could turn a few into weedkilling or track-recording units though.
 
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SpacePhoenix

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Another "possibility" is that the 153s could disappear, being reformed permanently back into I iirc was class 155s
 
61653 HTAFC

61653 HTAFC

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SpacePhoenix said:
Another "possibility" is that the 153s could disappear, being reformed permanently back into I iirc was class 155s
Click to expand...

Certainly a possibility, though if they're mostly in as poor condition as the 155 that's been in Killie for months was reported to be, then it won't be quick, easy or cheap to do.
 
Fincra5

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I heard 442's have recently been cleared in/out of Euston. But not a clue why, unless there's an Open Access operator who's eyeing them up.
 
Kite159

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What no mention of the 373 yet? ;)

Once the 345s/385s start arriving on strength then the future of the 314s/315s look bleak, similarly when the new merseyrail stock starts arriving, those 507/508s will be having a one way trip to the razor factory, no doubt sooner they will be all be gone before the pacers eventually depart Wales
 
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Julia

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If appearances are anything to go by then it's the GN 313s - some of them look like they already have one wheel in the scrapyard, with FCC-era vinyls that have been allowed to weather away to nothing..
 
Strathclyder

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As already posted above, once the 385s start coming on stream, the future of the 314s looks particularly bleak. Can't see much of a future for them aside from the scrapyard, given their age and astronomically high mileage. It'll be sad to see them go, as they (along with the 303s, 318s & 320s) helped kickstart my interest in the railways.
 
Class455

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sd0733 said:
As they have been retractioned and DDA mods completed if they are replaced, wonder if potentially some of the SWT 455s could switch over to Southern for a few years to replace their non modified ones.
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I would think the SN 455's are being modified after all 313's are completed. Some retractioned 455/7's could potentially force the 313's out of Coastway services. I would also think if any additional 455's were going to Southern, SWT's 455/8's would most likely move if it were to occur, as they fit with the existing 455's Southern have.
 
class387

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Fincra5 said:
I heard 442's have recently been cleared in/out of Euston. But not a clue why, unless there's an Open Access operator who's eyeing them up.
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I'm not sure whether or not you're being sarcastic...
 
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AndyW33

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Fincra5 said:
I heard 442's have recently been cleared in/out of Euston. But not a clue why, unless there's an Open Access operator who's eyeing them up.
Click to expand...

Was this a "paper" clearance in that Network Rail looked for any clearance differences between a 442 and the straightforward Mk3 hauled stock (and at periods HSTs) that has been running in and out of Euston for decades, and found there weren't any? Or did they actually take a 442 to Euston to see if it fitted? Of course Euston is one of the very few places outside former Southern Region territory that a third-rail only EMU might be some use as-is. Lets start a rumour that LO will be taking them, after all they've been linked with every other TOC by now.
 
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MatthewRead

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AndyW33 said:
Was this a "paper" clearance in that Network Rail looked for any clearance differences between a 442 and the straightforward Mk3 hauled stock (and at periods HSTs) that has been running in and out of Euston for decades, and found there weren't any? Or did they actually take a 442 to Euston to see if it fitted? Of course Euston is one of the very few places outside former Southern Region territory that a third-rail only EMU might be some use as-is. Lets start a rumour that LO will be taking them, after all they've been linked with every other TOC by now.
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No London Midland are planning to use them in place of 350's check the LM to consider loco hauled option thread;)
 
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