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Step 3 confirmed for 17th May

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Nicholas Lewis

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The prime minister said the latest data showed deaths and hospitalisations had dropped to their lowest level since last July.

Boris presser confirms step 3 will go ahead "as deaths and hospitalisation are at lowest levels since July 20". No face mask in classrooms anymore.

Says we are on target for 21st June and will say more in a few weeks about what that will look like but date won't be bought forward.

Valance said we might need to have face coverings again on public transport if cases increase in Autumn so is that an indicator of where thinking is going?

Vaccination programme is working according to Whitty Hospitalisation down by 75-85%, deaths by 70-80% but under 40's are still at risk so we can't go faster but not expecting a surge.

Covid alert level finally reduced from 4 to 3.
 
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westv

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I assumed the WFH advice would end 21/6 but now I'm not so sure.
 

brad465

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The alert system needs updating as it was made at a time where vaccines weren't a thing, and there was a belief that covid could be eliminated from the UK. Now we know it can't (and the Government themselves are not supporting zero-covid, at least openly), Level 1 needs removing or at least changing, and from next week the measures being opened are akin to what Level 2 states, including minimal social distancing.

The lifting of face masks in classrooms is good not just for those affected, but is a sign that no longer mandating them elsewhere is possible, especially as a precedent is now about to be set.
 

Nicholas Lewis

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The alert system needs updating as it was made at a time where vaccines weren't a thing, and there was a belief that covid could be eliminated from the UK. Now we know it can't (and the Government themselves are not supporting zero-covid, at least openly), Level 1 needs removing or at least changing, and from next week the measures being opened are akin to what Level 2 states, including minimal social distancing.

The lifting of face masks in classrooms is good not just for those affected, but is a sign that no longer mandating them elsewhere is possible, especially as a precedent is now about to be set.
As I say Valance answered a reporters broad question about what might change from 21st June and as part of his answer he said "that mask might have to be reinstated on public transport if cases pick up in the Autumn" is hopefully a positive sign of where there thinking is headed for 21st June. Should know within a few weeks
 

Domh245

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Valance said we might need to have face coverings again on public transport if cases increase in Autumn so is that an indicator of where thinking is going?

I'm liking the implication that we will see face coverings not-mandated prior to the Autumn!
 

Yew

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Valance said we might need to have face coverings again on public transport if cases increase in Autumn so is that an indicator of where thinking is going?
So much for Cautious but Irreversible.
 

Nicholas Lewis

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So much for Cautious but Irreversible.
At this stage just getting rid of them for travelling from 21/6 would be good enough for me. They've been over cautious from the start of relaxation so doubt we will se this actually happen.
 

Class 33

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I'm liking the implication that we will see face coverings not-mandated prior to the Autumn!

Yes. Hopefully a sign that this nonsense will be scrapped on 21st June. And about time too!



As I say Valance answered a reporters broad question about what might change from 21st June and as part of his answer he said "that mask might have to be reinstated on public transport if cases pick up in the Autumn" is hopefully a positive sign of where there thinking is headed for 21st June. Should know within a few weeks
So much for Cautious but Irreversible.

But yet he's also saying they may have to be reinstated if cases pick up in the autumn. As you say, so much for cautious but irreversible. But by the autumn, near enough everyone will have received both jabs of the vaccine, and for much of the population if you do get Coronavirus it will be just like getting a mild flu! If cases do rise in the autumn, it would be ridiculous and pointless to bring back compulsory face masks on public transport again!
 

Darandio

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But don't forget about the incredibly dangerous South African variant which was mentioned about 40 minutes before the press conference. You can set your clock by them.
 

Nicholas Lewis

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But don't forget about the incredibly dangerous South African variant which was mentioned about 40 minutes before the press conference. You can set your clock by them.
The SA variant B1.351 has been very slow to expand since it was declared as VOC on 20 DEC 20

1620670175632.png

In the presser i didn't feel too much concern from Whitty and Valence over the variants at the moment but the risk is if they spiral up after step 3 how they will deal with it.
 

philosopher

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I assumed the WFH advice would end 21/6 but now I'm not so sure.
I very much got the impression that Boris wants people to make up their own choice on WFH and social distancing measures such as not shaking hands after 21/6. Patrick Vallance seems to prefer that the WFH advice and social distancing advice relating to people they do not know well remain.
 

NorthOxonian

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Yes. Hopefully a sign that this nonsense will be scrapped on 21st June. And about time too!






But yet he's also saying they may have to be reinstated if cases pick up in the autumn. As you say, so much for cautious but irreversible. But by the autumn, near enough everyone will have received both jabs of the vaccine, and for much of the population if you do get Coronavirus it will be just like getting a mild flu! If cases do rise in the autumn, it would be ridiculous and pointless to bring back compulsory face masks on public transport again!
It should be said that given the way the vaccine affects transmission, a wave in the autumn seems rather unlikely. So I suspect this will in reality be an irreversible change. Regardless I do like the implication that masks could be removed from public transport over the summer, which isn't something I was expecting (at best I expected an equivocal approach - at peak times and on the tube you might have to still wear one but most of the time you'll be allowed not to).
 

Darandio

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The SA variant B1.351 has been very slow to expand since it was declared as VOC on 20 DEC 20

Indeed, it's been around ages. My gripe is with it being released and posted as breaking news 30 minutes before people are hoping to see a press conference with some good news. They've done it pretty much every time.
 

cuccir

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I was pleasantly surprised by the upbeat thinking on post-June 21st changes. It seems to be the first time that we've moved from the removal of restrictions being 'possible' to 'likely'. Driven by positive news on transmission surpression of vaccines I think.
 

duncanp

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Well it didn't take them long did it?

The usual <expletive deleted> locktivist rabble including (surprise, surprise) Professor Pantsdown are saying that the easing of lockdown from next Monday is going to trigger ANOTHER COVID WAVE.

Why can't they just go and take a running jump and leave the rest of us in peace to get on with our lives? <( <(


Next Monday's lockdown easing will trigger the start of another wave of Covid, SAGE has warned, but it won't be anywhere near as bad as the ones in spring or winter 2020.

In more than 100 pages of files published tonight as Boris Johnson announced social distancing would become optional from May 17, scientists said they were 'more optimistic' about the reopening than earlier in the year.

The better-than-expected vaccine rollout and warmer weather would have Covid on the back foot and keep hospital admissions and deaths much lower than in Britain's first and second waves. Even the worst case scenario submitted by Warwick University experts suggests hospital occupancy might only reach half of its January high.

But SPI-M, a sub-group of SAGE that contains disease modelling experts such as Neil Ferguson, Graham Medley, John Edmunds and Steven Riley, said 'it is likely that Step 3 will lead to R greater than 1 in England'.

This means the rate of spread will be pushed into a continuously increasing state, with everyone catching the virus infecting one or more people.

Due to widespread vaccination of the people most likely to get severely ill or die, however: 'Any resurgence in hospital admissions and deaths following Step 3 of the Roadmap alone is highly unlikely to put unsustainable pressure on the NHS,' they added.

Top-line estimates shown to the Government by SPI-M suggest that following the May 17 unlocking and then opening up society completely in June would likely lead to a maximum of 55,000 hospital admissions over the next year – compared to 464,000 since the start of the pandemic – and to 11,200 more people dying by September 2021.

Prime Minister Boris Johnson has already indicated that more disease and death is inevitable, saying in February there was 'no credible route to zero Covid' and adding: 'Whenever we ease the lockdown – whether it’s today or in six or nine months – we’ve got to be realistic and accept that there will be more infections, more hospitalisations and therefore, sadly, more deaths, just as there are every year with flu.'

The PM tonight confirmed next Monday's softening of the rules would go ahead as England announced zero new Covid deaths for the first time July 30, and there were another 2,357 coronavirus cases and four deaths across the UK. The Covid alert level was downgraded from four to three, suggesting the virus is 'in general circulation'.

SPI-M said in its report, presented to SAGE last Wednesday, May 5: 'Modelling presented in these central scenarios is more optimistic than those in SPI-M's previous Roadmap modelling.

'This is primarily due to recent evidence that vaccines significantly reduce onwards transmission from people who have been vaccinated but nevertheless become infected then symptomatic.

'This suggests that if baseline policies to reduce transmission are kept in place at the end of the Roadmap, behaviour does not return to pre-pandemic levels, and vaccine roll out progresses, there is an opportunity to keep the next resurgence very small.'

The report does not take into account the possibility of a new dominant variant that can escape vaccine immunity or spread faster than the Kent strain, and works off the basis that the situation in the UK is approximately as it is now while measures are released.

Scientists add that 'seasonality' could mean there are fewer cases over the summer – as was seen last year – and the next wave is pushed back to autumn and winter. They estimate transmission is around 10-20 per cent more likely in February than in August in the same outbreak situation.

This is because UV light is known to kill the virus and people spend more time outdoors, where transmission is significantly less common because people don't breathe the same air as much.
 

richw

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BBC news 24 mentioned social distancing will become a Personal choice except in a few settings from Monday . Public transport not mentioned as those settings where it will remain.
Settings I picked up mentioned were social care, medical, retail, hospitality and business settings.
This potentially means the end of social distancing on trains and buses amongst others
 

Domh245

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Well it didn't take them long did it?

The usual <expletive deleted> locktivist rabble including (surprise, surprise) Professor Pantsdown are saying that the easing of lockdown from next Monday is going to trigger ANOTHER COVID WAVE.

Why can't they just go and take a running jump and leave the rest of us in peace to get on with our lives? <( <(

The SPI-M papers date from the 5th of May, so I can only assume your first point is (rightly) aimed at the Daily Mail who've taken a scientific paper, "scared" it up and stuck a clickbaity fearmongering headline on it, but the rest of the post makes me think it isn't..

Nothing they've said is wrong - cases will increase as restrictions ease. This is a simple matter of fact, unless we're reaching herd immunity thresholds where chains of transmission start to become very limited (which would be an unexpected, if pleasant surprise). Also note that they don't at any point talk about putting restrictions in place (it's not their place as modellers after all) - the papers are all just simple estimates of what'll happen with no restrictions for a whole host of possible scenarios. It also doesn't matter if there's another wave and 11,200* die over the next however many months if this is a level that the goverment are fine with - indeed, the information coming out of these that there won't be any significant strain on the healthcare system is probably going to embolden the easing, if anything..

*cherry picked for being the most terrifying of the 3 models, but is massively at odds with the others. It (LSTHM) averages out at something like 80 deaths a day which is quite clearly nonsense when Warwick's estimate of 9000 to June 2022 averages 23 deaths a day, and Imperial's (Ferguson) figure of 7250 to the end of June 2022 works out at 18 a day
 

YorkshireBear

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I think we are in danger of repeating the old thread here a little bit.

The people who make decisions today we're much more positive in tone than previous. Great news all round and certainly makes me feel much happier.
 

cuccir

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Well it didn't take them long did it?

The usual <expletive deleted> locktivist rabble including (surprise, surprise) Professor Pantsdown are saying that the easing of lockdown from next Monday is going to trigger ANOTHER COVID WAVE.

Why can't they just go and take a running jump and leave the rest of us in peace to get on with our lives? <( <(

I mean this is literally the job they're paid to do: to produce models based on data that project likely future outcomes. The newspaper story does very little to convey the detail of the report which is published here, and which shows you the range likely scenarios and the assumptions they've made.

One thing I'd say is that the SAGE report makes a mistake in referring to any increase as a 'wave'. So they describe a circumstance, for example, in which daily deaths rise back up to the mid-teens after opening up in August (currently we're down into single figures) before declining to near-0 in October as a 'wave'. I'm not sure it really warrants that term (it's more of a 'ripple').

For example, the 95% confidence intervals of two of the three models (Warwick, Imperial) used include declines in cases continuing through the summer, ie, no wave at all (for some reason the third model, from the London School of Hygiene and Tropical Medicine, still assumes no reduction in onwards transmission due to the vaccines), and include scenarios with as few as 240 deaths between now and June 2022. There's then various sensitivity analyses which show you the circumstances which would lead to bigger waves, and circumstances which would leave to no wave.

For me the key quote is about halfway through the report:

in order for a significant resurgence to materialise (in the absence of a variant of concern), two or more factors would need to be worse than the central assumptions made here, for example the combination of low vaccine uptake in the under 50-year olds and high transmission after Step 4

In other words, we'd have to be unlucky twice-over for there to be any sort of 'wave' that would be a problem.

The report is positive, it shows good news and while it does presents scenarios in which there are future waves, it shows that the realistically imaginable situations in which these occur are decreasing. The newspaper article on it, of course, conveys none of this and focuses on that small percent of scenarios in which things do go wrong.
 

joncombe

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This is good to hear. I didn't watch it so just catching up now. I am encouraged to here the comments from Vallence as it does suggest we might finally see the back of the mask mandate, I was suspecting it was going to continue. I will be booking a rail journey once I know I won't have to wear a mask (perhaps to Skipton, I was booked to go there just after the 1st lockdown last year....).
 

Dent

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BBC news 24 mentioned social distancing will become a Personal choice except in a few settings from Monday . Public transport not mentioned as those settings where it will remain.
Settings I picked up mentioned were social care, medical, retail, hospitality and business settings.
This potentially means the end of social distancing on trains and buses amongst others

Apart from public transport, isn't that a list of all the settings it was required anyway? That list is certainly not "a few settings", it sounds like the statement "social distancing will become a Personal choice" has so many exceptions that it is meaningless.

"Business settings" is so wide that it could be interpreted to include public transport.
 
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Nicholas Lewis

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Well it didn't take them long did it?

The usual <expletive deleted> locktivist rabble including (surprise, surprise) Professor Pantsdown are saying that the easing of lockdown from next Monday is going to trigger ANOTHER COVID WAVE.

Why can't they just go and take a running jump and leave the rest of us in peace to get on with our lives? <( <(

The important point is SPI-M have said it won't lead to a level of hospitalisations that the NHS can't deal with. The models also don't reflect the real life data that Whitty briefed out tonight so there pessimistic forecasts are way off being realised.
 

Jamiescott1

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Doesn't the mask legislation end on 14th June?
If so, will it just quietly expire or will they keep up the pretence it is still valid after this date and announce it ending on June 21st ?
 

initiation

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Doesn't the mask legislation end on 14th June?
If so, will it just quietly expire or will they keep up the pretence it is still valid after this date and announce it ending on June 21st ?

Shops is the end of July. Public transport is June as it uses a different statutory instrument.
I will be pleasantly surprised if mask mandates are dropped for shops, public transport etc on 21st June.

Nothing they've said is wrong - cases will increase as restrictions ease.
Well clearly even that assertion is not true, the rolling 7 day average positive tests numbers are less than half they were at Step 1 in March and >20% lower than Step 2 in April.
 

kristiang85

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Well it didn't take them long did it?

The usual <expletive deleted> locktivist rabble including (surprise, surprise) Professor Pantsdown are saying that the easing of lockdown from next Monday is going to trigger ANOTHER COVID WAVE.

Why can't they just go and take a running jump and leave the rest of us in peace to get on with our lives? <( <(


"Prime Minister Boris Johnson has already indicated that more disease and death is inevitable"

And the sun will rise tomorrow morning, a footballer will be overpaid at some point, and a Northern train will be late.

I don't want to live in a world cowering from the inevitability of illness and death.
 
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