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MrJeeves · 24 May 2025

The site can only work with the timetable data, which ScotRail have evidently entered incorrectly (or they are planning to remove first class!).

I'd recommend complaining to ScotRail and making it clear that the eNRT (https://www.networkrail.co.uk/running-the-railway/the-timetable/electronic-national-rail-timetable/) shows it as being standard class only, and asking them to either edit the data, or confirm first class is declassified on the service.

RailUK Forums

andythebrave · 24 May 2025

Note that it does not say that first class is available on the West Highland services mentioned, merely that there is catering on board.
Later it says that if there is catering on board there is a complimentary first class offer but clearly when there is no first class (as in this case) this isn't relevant.
There is no first class accommodation on the West Highland route, declassified or not.

styles · 25 May 2025

andythebrave said:
Note that it does not say that first class is available on the West Highland services mentioned, merely that there is catering on board.
Later it says that if there is catering on board there is a complimentary first class offer but clearly when there is no first class (as in this case) this isn't relevant.
There is no first class accommodation on the West Highland route, declassified or not.

This makes a lot more sense, thanks!

I've gone standard anyway, take my own flask of coffee!

talldave · 29 May 2025

Would I be right in thinking that the Existing Travelcard Held field under More/Advanced Options needs multiple instances, one for each adult/child selected?

Mike395 · 30 May 2025

talldave said:
Would I be right in thinking that the Existing Travelcard Held field under More/Advanced Options needs multiple instances, one for each adult/child selected?

No, anything you select in the Advanced dialog will apply to all passengers in the search.

talldave · 30 May 2025

Mike395 said:
No, anything you select in the Advanced dialog will apply to all passengers in the search.

Thanks for the reply. I now understand this is how the site works as it uses the same approach for railcards - applies the same railcard to all passengers. I find that a bit frustrating as a family trip for us would require multiple transactions. It also nudges people towards a "I didn't realise I'd selected 16-25 for everyone in our group" thread in Disputes and Prosecutions!

Sadly, yesterday my enthusiasm to support the site was thwarted as my attempt to quickly purchase 2 Boundary Zone 6 tickets for my son & I just resulted in endless error messages and I had to give up and use Avanti who I cannot praise enough for allowing "Boundary Zone 6" to be simply entered as your starting point.

I tried yesterday evening to recreate the error on the forum's site so that I could provide some constructive feedback but it just wouldn't fail again

. So I can only assume there was some Edge cache/sulking silliness yesterday morning.

Mike395 · 30 May 2025

talldave said:
Thanks for the reply. I now understand this is how the site works as it uses the same approach for railcards - applies the same railcard to all passengers. I find that a bit frustrating as a family trip for us would require multiple transactions. It also nudges people towards a "I didn't realise I'd selected 16-25 for everyone in our group" thread in Disputes and Prosecutions!

Sadly, yesterday my enthusiasm to support the site was thwarted as my attempt to quickly purchase 2 Boundary Zone 6 tickets for my son & I just resulted in endless error messages and I had to give up and use Avanti who I cannot praise enough for allowing "Boundary Zone 6" to be simply entered as your starting point.

I tried yesterday evening to recreate the error on the forum's site so that I could provide some constructive feedback but it just wouldn't fail again. So I can only assume there was some Edge cache/sulking silliness yesterday morning.

There was a (now-fixed) upstream bug affecting any searches for Travelcard-held fares yesterday morning - so that makes perfect sense in terms of the timescales. You shouldn't have issues hopefully moving forward with similar searches.

SickyNicky · 2 Jun 2025

Mike395 said:
There was a (now-fixed) upstream bug affecting any searches for Travelcard-held fares yesterday morning - so that makes perfect sense in terms of the timescales. You shouldn't have issues hopefully moving forward with similar searches.

It was a licence key expiring, with no warning or communication of any sort from the vendor, and despite the bill having been paid properly. We fixed it quite quickly. Suffice to say, we are migrating away from that vendor.

MarkR13 · 2 Jun 2025

Are there any plans to enable the forum site / TrainSplit to purchase further ahead into the future. I notice CrossCountry are now selling advances more than 12 weeks in advance, which I can find on their own site (but without split tickets) https://www.crosscountrytrains.co.uk/travel-updates-information/train-timetables

SickyNicky · 2 Jun 2025

We can faciliate it at our end, but the issue is one of customer service. There would be customers that book at a higher price when a lower one becomes available later. I'm sure the relevant people are watching, if anyone has any ideas.

Benjwri · 2 Jun 2025

SickyNicky said:
We can faciliate it at our end, but the issue is one of customer service. There would be customers that book at a higher price when a lower one becomes available later. I'm sure the relevant people are watching, if anyone has any ideas.

Of course some TOCs have been releasing significantly later than 12 weeks (Looking at GTR), the risk is always there. Perhaps a warning could be put on directing customers to the national rail booking horizon page?

yorkie · 2 Jun 2025

Benjwri said:
Of course some TOCs have been releasing significantly later than 12 weeks (Looking at GTR), the risk is always there. Perhaps a warning could be put on directing customers to the national rail booking horizon page?

Would that be sufficient to avoid customer service complaints asking why a journey from (say) Derby to London was routed via Stoke, or something like that, when just a few days later, the direct route is opened for bookings?

Are people likely to realise that this might be the reason for a convoluted route ?

It sounds easy but if you think about it, there are consequences for a decision either way and there is no obvious answer.

OscarH · 2 Jun 2025

Benjwri said:
Of course some TOCs have been releasing significantly later than 12 weeks (Looking at GTR), the risk is always there. Perhaps a warning could be put on directing customers to the national rail booking horizon page?

Yes, the non-synchronised booking window is absolutely insane. It's unfortunately too common in many contexts that the TOCs and RDG think that every journey is a single leg on a single TOC, and multi leg/multi TOC journeys are just not considered.

The booking horizon is something on the radar, but it's non-trivial to work out how to handle the warnings

Haywain · 2 Jun 2025

yorkie said:
Would that be sufficient to avoid customer service complaints asking why a journey from (say) Derby to London was routed via Stoke, or something like that, when just a few days later, the direct route is opened for bookings?

Are people likely to realise that this might be the reason for a convoluted route ?

It sounds easy but if you think about it, there are consequences for a decision either way and there is no obvious answer.

I suppose the one (poor) consolation is that every single retailer, TOC or independent, has to juggle with the same problem.

fandroid · 6 Jun 2025

This may have arisen before but I had to think my way around it yesterday. I was looking for split tickets for an Off-Peak return Reading to Bristol Parkway. The site sensibly calls these "semi flexible", presumably as they have time restrictions. Anyway, I was offered a variety of fares, and for direct services, there were basically two offers, one splitting at Didcot (the cheapest) and one splitting at Swindon. I wasn't even sure of the timing of my outward journey, let alone the return one. As I know the route reasonably well, I chose the Swindon split, as that covered all eventualities, as all Parkway-bound trains appear to stop there.

I worked that out, as I had plenty of time to explore, but the usual presentation of the options doesn't make the issue clear. This is not intended as a complaint. I just wonder if there's a way of flagging up the additional limiting of flexibility that some adopted splits impose.

Egg Centric · 6 Jun 2025

OscarH said:
it's non-trivial to work out how to handle the warnings

For the forum site wouldn't it be ok to link to an in depth explanation? I appreciate that the forum site is presumably a small proportion of customers so it might not be worth it, but you could maybe make use of this by presenting users with several different explanations and ask which they preferred. Although again I do appreciate we're going to be atypical in terms of how we process the information. Then again the absolutely most obsessive about saving forum members are probably not going to be using the convenient automated tools but instead quite possibly using an interesting routing and rinsing someone daft enough to give out 10% cashback... so us casuals might be more representative than you think!

Adam Williams · 6 Jun 2025

Egg Centric said:
For the forum site wouldn't it be ok to link to an in depth explanation? I appreciate that the forum site is presumably a small proportion of customers so it might not be worth it, but you could maybe make use of this by presenting users with several different explanations and ask which they preferred. Although again I do appreciate we're going to be atypical in terms of how we process the information. Then again the absolutely most obsessive about saving forum members are probably not going to be using the convenient automated tools but instead quite possibly using an interesting routing and rinsing someone daft enough to give out 10% cashback... so us casuals might be more representative than you think!

I don't know if Oscar was just referring to the frontends, but some of it is contractual requirements set by the TOCs as well, to be able to send out warnings to customers affected by set swaps as and when they happen in the reservation system (before go-live).

There's been a bit of engineering work on that, but not enough time has been able to be dedicated to it yet to enable some popular TOCs to have an extended horizon.

lnerazuma · Wednesday at 17:47

lnerazuma said:
Not able to book tickets between Wales amd England during Severn Tunnel engineering work via the forum site, can admin please assist on this? Cheers

Seems the problem is still outstanding. Not able to purchase any through ticket from South West to South Wales.

MrJeeves · Wednesday at 18:34

lnerazuma said:
Seems the problem is still outstanding. Not able to purchase any through ticket from South West to South Wales.

Please could you provide a search link (preferably for a few days in the future) for the journey you're looking at and let us know what ticket(s) you'd expect to see?

lnerazuma · Wednesday at 19:08

MrJeeves said:
Please could you provide a search link (preferably for a few days in the future) for the journey you're looking at and let us know what ticket(s) you'd expect to see?

Westbury > Cardiff Central - Search Results

The Split Ticketing Champions - Compare fares and get the best value for money through split tickets and booking cheap train tickets online and on our mobile app, E-Tickets to your phone, no booking fee, save up to 90%

tickets.railforums.co.uk

12 June from Westbury to Cardiff Central.

Trainline currently showing £13.3 through advance for 15:59 - 19:31 itinerary with a change in Gloucester, no RRB involved. My preference is to purchase through advance and flexible tickets with itineraries via Gloucester during the engineering work period in Severn tunnel.

MrJeeves · Thursday at 12:17

lnerazuma said:
Westbury > Cardiff Central - Search Results

The Split Ticketing Champions - Compare fares and get the best value for money through split tickets and booking cheap train tickets online and on our mobile app, E-Tickets to your phone, no booking fee, save up to 90%

tickets.railforums.co.uk

12 June from Westbury to Cardiff Central.

Trainline currently showing £13.3 through advance for 15:59 - 19:31 itinerary with a change in Gloucester, no RRB involved. My preference is to purchase through advance and flexible tickets with itineraries via Gloucester during the engineering work period in Severn tunnel.

We're looking into this, but whatever it is I'm sure it's not likely to be a quick fix.

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