16+ Zip Fraud - What are the consequences?

[londonstudent]

Hi there,

I am a student in London (aged 19). In September, I used my brother's passport details to apply for a 16+ zip London oyster card. By the way, my brother does not live in the UK so he would not need it. Instead of putting his picture, I put mine. I have been using this 16+ zip oyster card since September. Today, I was stopped on a bus and asked to scan my card. The woman then asked for my driving license (as she saw it when I opened my wallet). She then confiscated the oyster card and said I would hear from the Tfl in a few days.

Obviously, I will respond to this letter, explaining everything that has happened and being perfectly honest. I will admit what I have done and agree to pay any fine. I do not have any previous offences and I only did this to save cash, as being a student in London is very expensive.

What do you think Tfl will say? Will it just be a fine or can I expect a prosecution and an entry on my criminal record? I personally think I will just get a heavy fine, but what do you all think?

Thanks

 

[najaB]

I'm sorry to say this, but your actions go beyond "simple" fare evasion and into fraud territory - using someone else's identity documents is looked on very seriously.

The consequences could be extremely severe indeed - it's not impossible (though unlikely) that it could result in a custodial sentence.

 

[tony_mac]

Obviously, I will respond to this letter, explaining everything that has happened and being perfectly honest. I will admit what I have done and agree to pay any fine.

It might be a good idea to get some (proper) legal advice before you do anything.

 

[Modron]

My thoughts as a layman are to plead guilty to what you have done, and to hope that the jury (if it goes to trial) are lenient.

At the very least, you are going to be hit with a large fine plus other costs (I think it's currently £85 to the courts) and you will have this blemish over you for a long time.

As you are a Student, a letter from your Dean/Head of Department to HM Courts could make a lot of difference if you are otherwise of good character and have no current criminal record.

 

[Haywain]

My thoughts as a layman are to plead guilty to what you have done, and to hope that the jury (if it goes to trial) are lenient.

You are showing some ignorance of the legal system here. A jury, when involved, simply make a decision on whether the accused is guilty or not - they cannot "be lenient". If a guilty plea is entered then a jury has no part to play in the process. It is the judge who one might hope would exercise leniency.

 

[farleigh]

Please be reassured that this will NOT result in a custodial sentence.

Stay calm and seek support from family, friends and colleagues. There will be expert people on here that will help you. What perhaps feels a very difficult situation will pass. Be strong and stay positive.

 

[najaB]

Please be reassured that this will NOT result in a custodial sentence.

I agree, if this was treated as a straight fare evasion matter, that there would be zero chance of a custodial sentence.

However, we have the matter of misuse of the passport which is treated much more harshly these days than in times gone past. I could see a suspended custodial sentence being issued.

 

[tony_mac]

I can't see anything that would lift it above a community order, at worst.
https://www.sentencingcouncil.org.uk/offences/magistrates-court/item/fraud/

For something like this, I don't think I would be looking for advice from friends, family, or strangers on the internet. With the best of intentions, it's all too easy to make matters worse than they need to be.

 

[najaB]

I can't see anything that would lift it above a community order, at worst.

I could see a suspended sentence being imposed for the identity theft aspect of the case.

But IANAL, the OP should seek proper legal advice.

 

[big all]

I could see a suspended sentence being imposed for the identity theft aspect of the case.

But IANAL, the OP should seek proper legal advice.

possibly available via your student union if you are or can become a member immediately

 

[Surreytraveller]

My thoughts as a layman are to plead guilty to what you have done, and to hope that the jury (if it goes to trial) are lenient.

At the very least, you are going to be hit with a large fine plus other costs (I think it's currently £85 to the courts) and you will have this blemish over you for a long time.

As you are a Student, a letter from your Dean/Head of Department to HM Courts could make a lot of difference if you are otherwise of good character and have no current criminal record.

If the OP pleads guilty, there won't be a jury. If there is a jury, it would be the judge that would be lenient, not the jury, as all the jury do us decide guilt or not, not the sentence

 

[twpsaesneg]

If TfL decide to really throw the book at you, you have potentially committed offences under Section 2 and possibly Section 11 of the Fraud Act 2006.

These do have a real risk of a custodial sentence depending on what previous you have if any.

https://www.cps.gov.uk/legal-guidance/fraud-act-2006

The above link gives some idea of offences and possible sentences.

I would wait until you get a letter and then seek professional legal advice - I only speak as an ex Police officer and that's certainly what I would be looking at if I'd have come across this.

Edited to add - unless they offer a settlement - then pay it and put it down to experience!

 

[Helenamuti]

Take proper legal advice before you do anything-including writing about the incident on internet fora and the like.
The dishonesty element alone can mean some careers are now closed for you (eg finance, law).

 

[najaB]

The dishonesty element alone can mean some careers are now closed for you (eg finance, law).

Not necessarily closed, but the bar to entry will definitely be raised if the OP is convicted.

 

[js1000]

It might be a good idea to get some (proper) legal advice before you do anything.

Agreed. I would ignore all the "advice" on this thread and seek proper legal advice as you are in what can only be described as a sticky situation (i.e. not simply a dispute over the validity of a penalty fare let's say). Generic responses like "I could see a suspended custodial sentence being issued" doesn't cut the mustard for me.

 

[LAX54]

I think I would be more worried about the Passport Fraud and Identity theft, more than the deliberate fare evasion !

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2010/40/crossheading/false-identity-documents-etc

which says:

Possession of false identity documents etc with improper intention E+W+S+N.I.

(1)It is an offence for a person (“P”) with an improper intention to have in P's possession or under P's control—

(a)an identity document that is false and that P knows or believes to be false,

(b)an identity document that was improperly obtained and that P knows or believes to have been improperly obtained, or

(c)an identity document that relates to someone else.

(2)Each of the following is an improper intention—

(a)the intention of using the document for establishing personal information about P;

(b)the intention of allowing or inducing another to use it for establishing, ascertaining or verifying personal information about P or anyone else.

(3)In subsection (2)(b) the reference to P or anyone else does not include, in the case of a document within subsection (1)(c), the individual to whom it relates.

(4)A person guilty of an offence under this section is liable, on conviction on indictment, to imprisonment for a term not exceeding 10 years or a fine (or both).

------

Now if it's your picture, and someone else's personal details..... ?

 

[cuccir]

I think it's worth noting that contributors here, in general, have experience in understanding railway related legislation, but not so much regulation related to fraud and even less identity theft.

I agree with js1000. Wait until TfL contact you and then you will probably need legal advice. If they're only interested in prosecuting under railway legislation, then at that point come back here and you'll get good and informed advice. If it's anything else, you should seek legal advice.

 

[najaB]

I would ignore all the "advice" on this thread...

So far there have only been two bits of actual advice given: "plead guilty and hope the jury is lenient", and "get legal advice". I agree with ignoring the former.

 

[RJ]

Hi there,

I am a student in London (aged 19). In September, I used my brother's passport details to apply for a 16+ zip London oyster card. By the way, my brother does not live in the UK so he would not need it. Instead of putting his picture, I put mine. I have been using this 16+ zip oyster card since September. Today, I was stopped on a bus and asked to scan my card. The woman then asked for my driving license (as she saw it when I opened my wallet). She then confiscated the oyster card and said I would hear from the Tfl in a few days.

Obviously, I will respond to this letter, explaining everything that has happened and being perfectly honest. I will admit what I have done and agree to pay any fine. I do not have any previous offences and I only did this to save cash, as being a student in London is very expensive.

What do you think Tfl will say? Will it just be a fine or can I expect a prosecution and an entry on my criminal record? I personally think I will just get a heavy fine, but what do you all think?

Thanks

I suggest you seek advice from a qualified legal practitioner.

Only you know why you voluntarily chose to hand over your driving licence when you knew you were up to something dodgy. Decision making is possibly something you should think more about.

It is known that being a student in London is expensive - an 18+ photocard is available which offers 30% off season Travelcards for full time students.

 

[island]

I think I would be more worried about the Passport Fraud and Identity theft, more than the deliberate fare evasion !

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2010/40/crossheading/false-identity-documents-etc

which says:

Possession of false identity documents etc with improper intention E+W+S+N.I.

(1)It is an offence for a person (“P”) with an improper intention to have in P's possession or under P's control—

(a)an identity document that is false and that P knows or believes to be false,

(b)an identity document that was improperly obtained and that P knows or believes to have been improperly obtained, or

(c)an identity document that relates to someone else.

(2)Each of the following is an improper intention—

(a)the intention of using the document for establishing personal information about P;

(b)the intention of allowing or inducing another to use it for establishing, ascertaining or verifying personal information about P or anyone else.

(3)In subsection (2)(b) the reference to P or anyone else does not include, in the case of a document within subsection (1)(c), the individual to whom it relates.

(4)A person guilty of an offence under this section is liable, on conviction on indictment, to imprisonment for a term not exceeding 10 years or a fine (or both).

------

Now if it's your picture, and someone else's personal details..... ?

More ill-informed scaremongering, I’m afraid.

A Zip card is not an identity document for the purposes of the Identity Documents Act. Section 7 of that Act defines an identity document as an immigration document, a passport, a document that can be used instead of a passport, or a driving licence. That is all.

 

[Trackman]

I've helped someone with a 16+ Zip; the verification process is very stringent.

To verify your details at the post office and you need proof of residence (3 months) and of course ID.
You say you used your brother passport 'details' - so not his actual passport, some other form of ID?

If you are under 18 your parent/guardian has to apply, when you are 18 you can apply yourself but have to be in full time eduction - and you'll need a letter from the school/college, which they check.

I'm curious on how you obtained one in the first place.

TfL will certainly go back to last September to see the journey history.
I'd wait for the letter and go from there.

 

[big all]

he actually says he is 19

"I am a student in London (aged 19)."

 

[30907]

he actually says he is 19

"I am a student in London (aged 19)."

If you are under 18 your parent/guardian has to apply, when you are 18 you can apply yourself but have to be in full time eduction - and you'll need a letter from the school/college, which they check.

I'm curious on how you obtained one in the first place.

I assume that the brother is entitled to a Zip whereas the OP isn't, because of age, residence or the nature of their study.
(ISTR tertiary students are not in "full time education" for many purposes - the Zip seems to fulfil the function of the child-rate season ticket I had even in the Upper Sixth, half a century ago!)