1S91 crash at Copmanthorpe near York - 1 fatality

[devon_metro]

http://www.richardarmstrong.fotopic.net/p34481725.html
http://www.richardarmstrong.fotopic.net/p34481686.html

 

[theblackwatch]

Agree with Metroland on this. The discussion on this thread has been very sensible so lets keep it that way. Yes we are speculating on the various possibilities of what happened, but nobody has (as far as I've noticed) pointed the finger of blame at anyone. We had a similar discussion on what had happened last night at work today (my boss lives in Copmanthorpe, so it was bound to come up) - again we had a chat about the various scenarios of what may have happened, not judging people.

 

[37372]

Was shown on BBC Look North this evening and they likened it to the Great Heck crash as mentioned earlier, also showed footage of 57313 rescuing the voyager this afternoon.

 

[metrocammel]

Not sure if anyone has mentioned it but congrats to the Bombardier as the train didnt fall over. Id have thought at that speed the car would get mashed into the coupler area and the train would ride up and over it. Spelling disaster for the passengers as well. But it didnt. Stayed upright and only the front axle was derailed.

Something positive about a voyager for once Crash Worthiness

It isn't a "special" design feature that it should stay upright while hitting a car, as Metroland said, it is only when the "solid" bits of the car go under wheels etc, when they tip-over, but this obviously didn't hit head-on, and "clipped" the car away thankfully. Even if it was to hit dead-on, it would not crumple the train in any way (like when a Transit van going over a crossing hit a mk1 cravens unit in 1986, the train toppled over, but the front was "undamaged" other than scuffing and bent buffers (plus broken glass), in this incident it was "dead on though", and the van was substantial enough to derail/topple the 70mph train) but a car would not "crumple" a Voyager (though I imagine the fibre-glass (red/ yellow plastic) front has been completely obliterated by the car). Upton Nervet I believe would also have been relativley minor, if it hadn't been for a set of points immediately after the crossing that the car got "snagged" on, and therefore forced the HST to ride over it.

 

[CallySleeper]

It isn't a "special" design feature that it should stay upright while hitting a car, as Metroland said, it is only when the "solid" bits of the car go under wheels etc, when they tip-over, but this obviously didn't hit head-on, and "clipped" the car away thankfully. Even if it was to hit dead-on, it would not crumple the train in any way (like when a Transit van going over a crossing hit a mk1 cravens unit in 1986, the train toppled over, but the front was "undamaged" other than scuffing and bent buffers (plus broken glass), in this incident it was "dead on though", and the van was substantial enough to derail/topple the 70mph train) but a car would not "crumple" a Voyager (though I imagine the fibre-glass (red/ yellow plastic) front has been completely obliterated by the car). Upton Nervet I believe would also have been relativley minor, if it hadn't been for a set of points immediately after the crossing that the car got "snagged" on, and therefore forced the HST to ride over it.

Right on. The front end of the Voyager is very much like the front of a road-going vehicle - the majority of it is designed to crumple on impact, so I suspect if the car hit the nose while going at 100mph the majority of the front end of the Voyager will be obliterated. A design feature similar to on cars - a car with a crumpled front end which absorbs the shock is likely to come out of a collision better off than a car without this safety feature but an almost pristine front end!

A word on derailments - I'm not fully aware of the techonology behind it but basically another design feature of the trains is to stay upright in a collision like this. What was shown at Ufton Nervet was a) the crash worthiness of Mk3 coaches, but also b) the one problem which comes when a train like this is derailed - it is not likely to stay upright if it goes through a points set. Immediately after the level crossing was a set of points - and as some of you remember, there were coaches upright, at an angle, fully derailed and on their sides - everything. The situation would have been the same yesterday had the Voyager passed over a set of points.

None of the 74 onboard - thankfully - were injured yesterday. Had the train toppled, that wouldn't have been the case. At Ufton Nervet, 5 of the passengers (and the two drivers) were killed - probably because the train toppled, and many more injured. However, the fact that many more weren't injured or killed on that day is a testament to the crash worthiness of the Mk3 coaches - despite a lot of them toppling.

(I knew someone who was on that FGW train - yeah. Otherwise I wouldn't have such vivid memories of that weekend)

 

[afterburner]

I read the report on Ufton Nervet, and I believe it said that the cause of the fatality to the driver was ballast and gravel entering the drivers cab. Also at least one of the fatalities in the coaches was caused by the passenger being ejected through one of the windows, then having the coach landing on them. Obviously neither of these would have happened if the train had remained upright.

I guess we should just be grateful that there were no points in the vicinity and the train stayed upright in this instance...

 

[yorkie]

It's now been confirmed that the car was heading south, so had gone through the wooden fence at the end of a road that is very clearly marked as a 'T' road.

This road leads out of Copmanthorpe and goes nowhere other than to a few houses. There are usually parked cars at the end of it, by the houses there.

It's a fairly straight road, but curves to the left slightly.

I don't understand how this could have happened.

 

[AJP]

Was shown on BBC Look North this evening and they likened it to the Great Heck crash as mentioned earlier, also showed footage of 57313 rescuing the voyager this afternoon.

Dont forget 66175 later in the show on coal!

Was it a suicide ?

 

[CallySleeper]

It's now been confirmed that the car was heading south, so had gone through the wooden fence at the end of a road that is very clearly marked as a 'T' road.

This road leads out of Copmanthorpe and goes nowhere other than to a few houses. There are usually parked cars at the end of it, by the houses there.

It's a fairly straight road, but curves to the left slightly.

I don't understand how this could have happened.

Is my theory supportive then?

Seeing as it was (hopefully) obvious the railway was at the end of the road, still speculating obviously but surely that points more towards suicide or attempt to cause mayhem?

 

[yorkie]

More here http://www.yorkpress.co.uk/display....five_was_behind_wheel_of_car_hit_by_train.php

A DEVASTATED family are grieving the loss of a "smashing man" who died when his car was in collision with an express train in York.

Friends told how John Power, 54, was a much liked "ordinary man" and expressed their sympathies to his wife, Hazel, 50, and their five children...

 

[CallySleeper]

It's now been confirmed that the car was heading south, so had gone through the wooden fence at the end of a road that is very clearly marked as a 'T' road.

Yorkie, where did you read this? The York Press article says the vehicle veered off the road - does anyone else get the impression from that that it came from the parallel road on the south side?

 

[66526]

The press say a lto of things. There is no point reading too much into what they say. Saying veered makes it sound more dramatic. No point speculating, the police are investigating the cause of the crash.

 

[yorkie]

Yorkie, where did you read this? The York Press article says the vehicle veered off the road - does anyone else get the impression from that that it came from the parallel road on the south side?

There have been conflicting reports, but a member of staff who passed the scene said it was on the dead-end side.

Anyway, it's now in the York Press:-

http://www.yorkpress.co.uk/news/yor...64.0.riddle_of_victim_at_disused_crossing.php

MYSTERY still surrounds how a father-of-five came to drive his car on to a railway line where it was struck by the Virgin express train at 100mph.

John Anthony Power, 54, was killed when his blue Vauxhall Vectra smashed through a fence blocking off the site of a former level crossing at Moor Lane, Copmanthorpe.

His vehicle was carried nearly a mile-and-a-half by the train, which partially derailed, and came to a halt still upright outside homes in Fairfax Croft.

The Rail Accident Investigation Bureau, British Transport Police and North Yorkshire Police are still looking into how Mr Power's vehicle came to use the deserted lane which brought him to the disused level crossing.

It is thought the crossing was boarded up in the 1970s and it now lies overgrown at the bottom of Moor Lane.

The Press revealed yesterday how delivery driver Mr Power, who worked for the Gap Group in Murton, had been diagnosed with diabetes about four years ago.

It has been suggested locally that he may have suffered a blackout or been suffering from depression before Monday's crash.

A spokeswoman for British Transport Police said the investigation team was looking at "all possibilities" but was no closer to finding out why Mr Power's vehicle ended up on the track.
She said: "We are investigating the circumstances of the collision and working with our colleagues in North Yorkshire to discover how the vehicle came to be on the line.

"But we are no further forward with that at the moment and are looking at all circumstances but have no information yet as to whether this has been a deliberate act or whether it was a tragic accident....