2024 Local, Mayoral and PCC Elections

[dorsetdesiro]

Oh dear, as Brabin is re-elected so there'll be pressure on her to "put spades in the ground" in the next few years, she may surprise us...

Now all of Yorkshire's mayors are in the same party, will we see more integration in transport linking between West, South & North, wishful thinking I know?

If the North Yorkshire Mayor had been Tory then this may have made the link between Leeds & York more difficult so both West & North are now in the same party so a possible extension of WY Metro network to York & surrounding areas not in WY such as Selby & Harrogate districts as these are between Leeds & York?

Probably shouldn't expect too much as the combined authorities are more of talking shops aren't they?

 

[ainsworth74]

Probably shouldn't expect too much as the combined authorities are more of talking shops aren't they?

Depends on the Combined Authority. Whilst the Tees Valley Combined Authority (Ben Houchen) is a hot bed of financial mis-governance and obfuscation including enrichment of select individuals it has got spades impacting the ground. So it is more than a talking shop.

 

[Thirteen]

A January election would kill the Tories stone dead, resentful voters having to come out in the cold and resentful MPs having to campaign over Christmas and in the cold is a lethal combination.

 

[Cowley]

Depends on the Combined Authority. Whilst the Tees Valley Combined Authority (Ben Houchen) is a hot bed of financial mis-governance and obfuscation including enrichment of select individuals it has got spades impacting the ground. So it is more than a talking shop.

Private Eye has been covering this story for quite some time now, yet it seems to have received very little attention from the mainstream press for some reason? There’s been some fairly shady stuff happening with him and his associates!

 

[Thirteen]

Who? To win in London you need reasonable name recognition - it's where the Tories have come unstuck in the last 2 elections. Sadiq Kahn is not a popular mayor and someone with a good public profile and a bit of charisma stood a good chance of beating him.

An extreme example would be If David Attenborough had stood for the Greens he would have had a good chance of winning if you look at how well they did on the party list vote, far better than for mayor.

The Tories no longer have people like Ken Clarke or Michael Hesseltine who are well known and appeal to a wider electorate. Find one of them and London could easily go blue again.

That's going to be tricky if Sadiq Khan decides he doesn't want to do another term because would anyone in a future Labour Government Cabinet want to run as Mayor?

 

[SteveM70]

From a purely practical perspective, setting aside individual desire and motivation to vote, and cold weather elections tend to favour the Tories, surely?

More represented amongst the retired, who can vote in daylight

More represented amongst car owners, who can minimise time outdoors

Private Eye has been covering this story for quite some time now, yet it seems to have received very little attention from the mainstream press for some reason? There’s been some fairly shady stuff happening with him and his associates!

1 - not in London

2 - hideously complicated and the full story not yet known

 

[YorkRailFan]

BREAKING: Final England Council Results 2024

LAB: 1,158 (+186)
LDM: 522 (+104)
CON: 515 (-474)
⚪️ IND: 228 (+93)
GRN: 181 (+74)
RA: 48 (+11)
⚫️ WPB: 4 (+4)
RFM: 2 (+2)

Changes w/ seats in 2021
107/107 councils declared

https://twitter.com/PolitlcsUK/status/1787085076078993497?t=ZRP6-t28JA82wiuSrGOvfA&s=19

Final Council results after Salford was declared. A good night for all parties except the Tories.

 

[birchesgreen]

Plus it will require some investigative journalism not just copying and pasting press releases or copying from social media, so that rules 99.9999% of current journalists out.

 

[deltic]

That's going to be tricky if Sadiq Khan decides he doesn't want to do another term because would anyone in a future Labour Government Cabinet want to run as Mayor?

Didnt Frank Dobson resign from the Cabinet to stand in 2000 or had he left before that?

Plus it will require some investigative journalism not just copying and pasting press releases or copying from social media, so that rules 99.9999% of current journalists out.

That's not the journalists' fault but ours for not being prepared to pay for news any more. There are few profitable news media outlets anymore.

Private Eye has been covering this story for quite some time now, yet it seems to have received very little attention from the mainstream press for some reason? There’s been some fairly shady stuff happening with him and his associates!

Widely covered in the Financial Times

 

[Thirteen]

Paul Scully's anger at not being even shortlisted for the Conservative Mayoral candidate is justified given how badly things went and he's right, it was just too negative as a campaign and for the Tories to win the London mayoralty again, they need to change tact and focus on someone who actually likes living in London and be a tad competent.

 

[takno]

Paul Scully's anger at not being even shortlisted for the Conservative Mayoral candidate is justified given how badly things went and he's right, it was just too negative as a campaign and for the Tories to win the London mayoralty again, they need to change tact and focus on someone who actually likes living in London and be a tad competent.

If anything he's got an even lower profile than Hall, and is really from the fringes of London. I doubt he could have run a worse campaign, but it's perhaps optimistic to assume he could have run a better one.

 

[brad465]

If that is really how people vote, then we deserve every bad government we've had and will have.

It's what the system imposes on something like 95% of voters. The other 5% are the swing voters in swing seats who do actually get to vote what they want, because the main parties target them specifically. I'm not a member of any political party, but I am a member of a PR voting campaign group and do occasional presentations for that group to clubs/societies locally to promote it, because I consider it an important issue that will address many of the concerns the likes of you have with our political setup today. Electoral reform is not the only reform needed, for example I think standards MPs are held to need vastly improving and a lot of things that rely on goodwill need codifying into a constitution, but I think they'll be easier to gain later on after other reforms.

There's more to democracy than just turning up at a ballot box when the opportunity comes around, if more voters realised this then we will get better politicians and in turn a better country.

 

[weeklycommuter]

I should be a prime candidate to vote Green (I don't own a car, for example) however I consider them to be utterly bonkers; their anti-HS2 stance is indicative of the fact they are not in the real world. Most people know they are completely unelectable as a party. There are not enough sensible people in the party to consider voting for them.

I agree. I do not have a car, I always walk and travel by bus and by train, I am concerned about the environment and agree with the need to stop using fossil fuels but I would not vote for the Green Party for the same reasons, especially their opposition to HS2 which is totally inconsistent with what they claim to stand for. To reduce carbon emissions it is essential to shift large amounts of freight from lorries to trains and a large number of passenger journeys from cars and planes to trains and building HS2 is essential to achieve this. This cannot be done without the additional capacity on the railway which will be provided by HS2.

 

[Snow1964]

Politics West (the regional BBC politics show at 10am this morning, based in Bristol) had the West of England metro mayor, Dan Norris, the Green Party co-leader, Carla Denyer, (and a Conservative candidate for a new constituency in north Bristol).

Bristol Council now has Greens as biggest party and both Carla and Dan were both clear that Bristol needs its public Transport sorting out big time and it is high priority.

I guess it is watch this space for Bristol developments

 

[simonw]

From a purely practical perspective, setting aside individual desire and motivation to vote, and cold weather elections tend to favour the Tories, surely?

More represented amongst the retired, who can vote in daylight

More represented amongst car owners, who can minimise time outdoors

I'm not sure that those factors have such an influence at General Elections.

 

[gswindale]

Not bothered too much when it is, as I will not be making a trip to a polling station. My vote will be casted a short time before polling day and in the post in plenty of time to be counted.

I really don't understand why more people don't sign up to postal voting?

 

[jfollows]

Not bothered too much when it is, as I will not be making a trip to a polling station. My vote will be casted a short time before polling day and in the post in plenty of time to be counted.

I really don't understand why more people don't sign up to postal voting?

I also vote by post, but the big problem is that it makes you vote too early and if you’re likely to change your mind because of events and canvassing then it’s not good. Probably like you, I already know how I’ll vote (Labour, as in tactical vote against Conservatives) in the next general election but not everyone thinks the same way.

 

[HullRailMan]

It's what the system imposes on something like 95% of voters. The other 5% are the swing voters in swing seats who do actually get to vote what they want, because the main parties target them specifically. I'm not a member of any political party, but I am a member of a PR voting campaign group and do occasional presentations for that group to clubs/societies locally to promote it, because I consider it an important issue that will address many of the concerns the likes of you have with our political setup today. Electoral reform is not the only reform needed, for example I think standards MPs are held to need vastly improving and a lot of things that rely on goodwill need codifying into a constitution, but I think they'll be easier to gain later on after other reforms.

There's more to democracy than just turning up at a ballot box when the opportunity comes around, if more voters realised this then we will get better politicians and in turn a better country.

PR is hardly a perfect solution, not least because it amplifies minority voices when power sharing deals are being sought - see the influence the crazy Greens have in Scotland.

 

[brad465]

PR is hardly a perfect solution, not least because it amplifies minority voices when power sharing deals are being sought - see the influence the crazy Greens have in Scotland.

I agree there is no perfect solution, not just for PR but any system. However, FPTP does not stop minority voices getting amplified: firstly it didn't stop the Lib Dems and the DUP having influence as a minority party in government, the latter in particular had very huge sway from 2017-19. Also, the formation of large "broad church" parties still allows minority voices to flourish, but worse they can actually hijack the party in question and do its bidding, even if the majority of supporters/voters disagree. This is what Momentum did to Labour under Corbyn, and what the ERG have done to the Tories since 2015. If PR was in place those groups would have to form separate parties, and at least then they can either be rejected in coalition talks, or forced to make concessions to be part of government.

As for Scotland, they have a hybrid system that still sees FPTP elect more than half the seats, so they are not a suitable example to use in relation to PR's flaws.

 

[Thirteen]

The Australian voting system of single transferable vote and Supplementary Vote which was used for Mayoral voting before they changed it would be interesting replacements for selecting MPs.

 

[Energy]

Bristol Council now has Greens as biggest party and both Carla and Dan were both clear that Bristol needs its public Transport sorting out big time and it is high priority.

I guess it is watch this space for Bristol developments

Unsurprising - Bristol has buses, the Severn Beach line, and nothing else. It suffers from small streets (particularly further out) and being rather hilly. Its been in need of better public transport for a while.

 

[dangie]

Bristol Council now has Greens as biggest party and both Carla and Dan were both clear that Bristol needs its public Transport sorting out big time and it is high priority.

I guess it is watch this space for Bristol developments

That’ll be interesting when they realise they’ve got no money to sort it with.

 

[bspahh]

PR is hardly a perfect solution, not least because it amplifies minority voices when power sharing deals are being sought - see the influence the crazy Greens have in Scotland.

The Conservative and Labour parties are both coalitions with power sharing deals. First past the post means you get to choose one or the other.

Proportional representation means you can get coalitions with power sharing deals between a range of parties, which are a closer match for the people who vote for them.

 

[Horizon22]

A January election would kill the Tories stone dead, resentful voters having to come out in the cold and resentful MPs having to campaign over Christmas and in the cold is a lethal combination.

Activists of every party would detest it, even Tories.

Turnout would definitely be down, and it is debatable who that might benefit (I'd hunch the Tories). I'd say its unlikely but I wouldn't put it past this government to cling on as long as possible.

Unsurprising - Bristol only has buses and suffers from small streets (particularly further out) and being rather hilly. Its been in need of better public transport for a while.

Eh? There's 10+ local stations in Bristol, one of the few cities outside London to actually have some semblance of a metro railway service!

PR is hardly a perfect solution, not least because it amplifies minority voices when power sharing deals are being sought - see the influence the crazy Greens have in Scotland.

Votes then equal seats, tactical voting would disappear as a concept and minority voices getting listened to is not necessarily bad thing (see "tyranny of the majority").

 

[nw1]

Votes then equal seats, tactical voting would disappear as a concept and minority voices getting listened to is not necessarily bad thing (see "tyranny of the majority").

Indeed, or "tyranny of the largest minority", even. Certainly that's a good description of the 2019 government!

 

[DynamicSpirit]

Eh? There's 10+ local stations in Bristol, one of the few cities outside London to actually have some semblance of a metro railway service!

While that's true, how many of those stations have a sufficiently frequent service to the city centre to be usable as a metro railway service?

PR is hardly a perfect solution, not least because it amplifies minority voices when power sharing deals are being sought - see the influence the crazy Greens have in Scotland.

You could though argue that the voices of small parties are only amplified because the larger parties usually refuse to work with each other. If our political culture was more one of, the larger parties seeing each other as opponents at election time but then seeing them as people to talk to and work out compromises with once it came to governing the country - rather than the current situation of Tory/Labour/SNP/LbDem mostly hating each other and refusing to see any good in their rivals - then the small parties wouldn't end up with an outsize influence.

You could argue that PR is more likely to promote that kind of culture than the enforced two-party-rivalry that FPTP tends to lead to, although it would also require more maturity from politicians (of all parties).

 

[Energy]

While that's true, how many of those stations have a sufficiently frequent service to the city centre to be usable as a metro railway service?

1tph Bristol Temple Meads - Avonmouth and 1tph Weston-Super-Mare - Severn Beach with a 2/3 car 165/166 isn't really a metro service, and it's only within walking distance for a small part of the city. I'll accept that "Bristol has only buses" is incorrect though.

I don't think a change in councillors/mayors alone will make a difference as tram systems depend on central government funding.

 

[HullRailMan]

While that's true, how many of those stations have a sufficiently frequent service to the city centre to be usable as a metro railway service?



You could though argue that the voices of small parties are only amplified because the larger parties usually refuse to work with each other. If our political culture was more one of, the larger parties seeing each other as opponents at election time but then seeing them as people to talk to and work out compromises with once it came to governing the country - rather than the current situation of Tory/Labour/SNP/LbDem mostly hating each other and refusing to see any good in their rivals - then the small parties wouldn't end up with an outsize influence.

You could argue that PR is more likely to promote that kind of culture than the enforced two-party-rivalry that FPTP tends to lead to, although it would also require more maturity from politicians (of all parties).

To be fair, I’m not opposed to PR per se. Of course, you make an excellent point regarding the maturity that would be needed from politicians, and that is in very short supply in our system. To be fair to both parties, at least the 2010 coalition did last a full term.
The whole UK system is designed to be adversarial, down to the layout of the House of Commons. I highly doubt that anyone looks on with pleasure at the behaviour of both sides in the chamber. Altering the voting system would require a complete cultural change within our political system - that may be the most difficult challenge.

 

[Busaholic]

Unsurprising - Bristol has buses, the Severn Beach line, and nothing else. It suffers from small streets (particularly further out) and being rather hilly. Its been in need of better public transport for a while.

Quite a while indeed - I'd suggest since the trams were bombed out of existence during the Second World War! I'd also suggest that the City Council not running their own bus services at a time when virtually every other city of its size did has had an adverse influence ever since, with a near-monopoly nationalised British Transport Commission bus company morphing into a privatised version via the interim National Bus Company years. All attempts at providing a modern tram or light railway network are shelved after much work and money have gone into them, and as for reopening old railway lines....

I sometimes think the place must have an ancient curse placed on it.

 

[RT4038]

While that's true, how many of those stations have a sufficiently frequent service to the city centre to be usable as a metro railway service?

Not helped by not really having a City Centre station in the first place.