313 in the dirt at Welwyn (13/09)

[Bald Rick]

On the delay attributing - let's say it was driver error. (Not saying it was, no evidence to suggest it was before the mafia want my head on a pole) who would be liable. GTR for causing the issue or network rail for the time it took to clear it up? I guess we get similar problems when pantograph faults bring down the wires.

The incident would be split, with an agreement on the percentage apportioned to each party through negotiation (and evidence).

 

[petersi]

The weekend engineering work messages for next two days make no mention of Welwyn garden City.
So when is the works likely if not this weekend

 

[hedpe]

I think this one might be up for early retirement!

 

[ChiefPlanner]

Went past them today. Rust now on the wheelsets ..

I reckon a Xmas possession to remove - soft ground / power cables supposedly underneath and huge access problems for a land based crane , plus the OLE issues.....

Cannot see why the back 3 car - non derailed - cannot be pulled off, leaving just the 3 car north end in the ballast ?

 

[Class315]

Preparations scheduled for Sunday 25/09, with isolation & possession of the Up slow between 08:00-17:00 to allow the stricken unit 055 to be lifted and hauled in XYW up sidings pending recovery to depot (XHE).

If all goes to plan, further possession will continue next week to carry out repairs with normal service anticipated for the middle of next week.

 

[Sunset route]

Preparations scheduled for Sunday 25/09, with isolation & possession of the Up slow between 08:00-17:00 to allow the stricken unit 055 to be lifted and hauled in XYW up sidings pending recovery to depot (XHE).

If all goes to plan, further possession will continue next week to carry out repairs with normal service anticipated for the middle of next week.

Being hauled to where and what depot?

 

[greatkingrat]

XHE is Hornsey Depot

 

[Class315]

Scheduled to be hauled to Welwyn Up Sidings, before being removed back to Hornsey.

 

[Skimpot flyer]

Certainly seems to have been some clearance of trees and vegetation on the embankment adjacent to the incident, in preparation for Sunday, as these photos from a passing down Cambridge train show ...

 

[Jd12]

They've got a possession booked on Sunday between 0800 and 1700 to recover it.

 

[Phil.]

Went past them today. Rust now on the wheelsets ..

I reckon a Xmas possession to remove - soft ground / power cables supposedly underneath and huge access problems for a land based crane , plus the OLE issues.....

Cannot see why the back 3 car - non derailed - cannot be pulled off, leaving just the 3 car north end in the ballast ?

'cos it's at the wrong end.

 

[notverydeep]

DB Cargo road railer and crew on site. The DMSO at the Welwyn Garden City station end is now upright. No sign of any crane though, perhaps it has been and gone?

 

[Lockwood]

Sorry to sound like a broken record, but how come they seem to make trap points derail vehicles into places that are so awkward to rerail?

Comments upthread about the ground conditions underneath being soft here - since it is more likely to derail here than the surrounding area, since it is designed for the train to come off, why not reenforce the groundwork in that area?
People have said elsewhere about trap points that would send you into overhead equipment or footbridges.
The point of these points being to prevent a collision, sending stuff into other objects is odd. You're either going to close everything pending assessment, foul the other line, foul more lines than you would have going straight on, or play a perverse game of dominoes and still hit another train.

 

[dviner]

Sorry to sound like a broken record, but how come they seem to make trap points derail vehicles into places that are so awkward to rerail?

Comments upthread about the ground conditions underneath being soft here - since it is more likely to derail here than the surrounding area, since it is designed for the train to come off, why not reenforce the groundwork in that area?
People have said elsewhere about trap points that would send you into overhead equipment or footbridges.
The point of these points being to prevent a collision, sending stuff into other objects is odd. You're either going to close everything pending assessment, foul the other line, foul more lines than you would have going straight on, or play a perverse game of dominoes and still hit another train.

Lesser of two evils.

 

[edwin_m]

Lesser of two evils.

Also derailments at trap points are relatively rare so there isn't much justification in making them easier to recover, as it won't happen very often. From what I read on another forum, the OLE support damaged at Paddington was placed as far as practicable from the trap point, but the length of overrun was still sufficient to hit it.

If the ground had been reinforced in the "impact area" at Welwyn the train would probably have overrun further as it wouldn't have had the retarding effect from digging into the ground.

 

[notverydeep]

Both units have now been recovered, presumably to Hornsea as they aren't in Welwyn Garden City up sidings. Headshunt wires still need to be fixed. Platform indicators suggest the flyover is back in use.

 

[SpacePhoenix]

Was there much damage to the side that ended up in the dirt and/or the edge of the ballast?

 

[jon0844]

Is there a risk that drivers will now overshoot the platforms at WGC, having become so used to using the ditched 313 as part of their route knowledge?






(not serious)

 

[ungreat]

Is there a risk that drivers will now overshoot the platforms at WGC, having become so used to using the ditched 313 as part of their route knowledge?






(not serious)

No......lol

 

[jon0844]

No......lol

But can you remember far enough back to the time where it wasn't there?!

 

[ungreat]

Oh now thats a tricky one....ummm...
Might have to get back to you on that!!

 

[Failed Unit]

It's ok, still got the damage ohle. I guess the bridge can be used as the track circuit is clear now. But when the train was lying around, was would a train have got past if it had used the flyover.

Assume trains such as 0942 WGC will still use ladder.

 

[Jd12]

They have a possession on tonight from 2100 - 0700 to complete piling works on the site on the derailment

 

[notverydeep]

The presumably undamaged unit trapped by the derailment - 313050 - is now back in service. Seen at Drayton Park this morning...

 

[Class315]

313055 has been repaired and is currently undergoing testing, it ran from XHE to MOG as 5K91 and returned back to XHE as 5E91. It's had fresh paint where it incurred damage and has remained within the defunct GN dynamic lines livery. Should be back in service soon.

 

[adrock1976]

313055 has been repaired and is currently undergoing testing, it ran from XHE to MOG as 5K91 and returned back to XHE as 5E91. It's had fresh paint where it incurred damage and has remained within the defunct GN dynamic lines livery. Should be back in service soon.

Could this be translated into plain English, as I am sure it mentions somewhere in the forum that acronyms and abbreviations should not be used without first saying what they mean?

 

[MidnightFlyer]

XHE is Hornsey Depot, MOG is Moorgate station. I presume you know what GN stands for.

 

[Ianno87]

XHE is Hornsey Depot, MOG is Moorgate station. I presume you know what GN stands for.

In the post context "GN" stands for First Capital Connect, technically

 

[adrock1976]

XHE is Hornsey Depot, MOG is Moorgate station. I presume you know what GN stands for.

Thanks very much.

Regarding the code for Hornsey Depot, I notice it is a 3 character code as opposed to the standard 2 character codes that you see elsewhere.

For example, Old Oak Common = OO, Allerton = AL, etc. Is the depot at Hornsey intended for London Crossrail in the future, as that is the only thing I can think of that the "X" refers to?

 

[Marklund]

No. They're codes used in NR's data feeds.
Depots generally have an X in front of the well known two digit codes.