60+ Oyster and travel outside London

[Angela.dodwell]

I am wondering if anyone can please clarify a query for me. Having only just recieved my 60+ Oyster, I am keen to use it and am planning a trip to Grays, Kent in a few weeks. I'm keen to learn how I manage fares as the 60+ oyster is only valid upto the tfl/rail boundary. I've read something about boundary fares/tickets but don't fully understand concept or how to purchase one. Is it possible to purchase onward journey tickets on line or does it have to be done at a ticket office. Plus, do I have to touch in/out at the boundary stn when I'm on route.
Tfl and rail network sites seem woefully uninformed on the topic and can't find proper guidance.
Guidance and explanations welcome, please. Thank you in advance.

 

[avid2424]

I assume you mean Grays in Essex rather than Gravesend in Kent

You can find the Oyster 60+ map on the web and re Grays in Essex your Oyster 60+ card will take you to Upminster or to Rainham in Essex

Of course you would be able to buy a Senior Railcard to allow discounts re fares to take you onwards to Grays in Essex And you can buy discounted paper tickets online no log in needed and collect the paper ticket at any National Rail Station Ticket Machine, or buy at the ticket office at any National Rail station and that might be easier.

You do not have to tap out at the station where you switch from Oyster 60+ to a paper ticket. And nor do you have to tap in on the way back when you switch between paper ticket and Oyster 60+. Just stay seated on the train(s)

 

[themeone]

The 60+ Oyster is valid to end of Zone 6. If you're on a train and want to go beyond that you can either get a boundary zone ticket, or a ticket from the last station in Zone 6 on that route. The train doesn't have to stop there, nor do you have to touch in or out - it's the same rules as a Zone 1-6 travelcard in that respect.

Often, though not always, a ticket from Boundary Zone 6 will be the same price as the last Zone 6 station on the line anyway. Although Boundary Zone tickets are available from some ticket machines, I don't think you can get them online at all so for most people they are effectively only available from ticket offices.

 

[avid2424]

And if you are at a ticket office you can ask whether a ticket fromi Boundary Zone 6 would be cheaper than a ticket from Upminster and/or from Rainham in Essex. In your own circumstances the train would always stop at either Upminster or Rainham in Essex, but not both of these stations. However with a paper ticket from Upminster you must be on a train that goes via Upminster - although all your trains going via Upminster would stop there. And if you have a paper ticket from Rainham in Essex you must be on a train that goes via Rainham in Essex and again all trains that go via Rainham in Essex stop there

 

[MotCO]

In case it's not obvious, you must also have bought the paper ticket before you board.

 

[miklcct]

The 60+ Oyster is valid to end of Zone 6. If you're on a train and want to go beyond that you can either get a boundary zone ticket, or a ticket from the last station in Zone 6 on that route. The train doesn't have to stop there, nor do you have to touch in or out - it's the same rules as a Zone 1-6 travelcard in that respect.

Often, though not always, a ticket from Boundary Zone 6 will be the same price as the last Zone 6 station on the line anyway. Although Boundary Zone tickets are available from some ticket machines, I don't think you can get them online at all so for most people they are effectively only available from ticket offices.

You can buy one online at c2c website.

 

[Peter Sarf]

The 60+ Oyster is valid to end of Zone 6. If you're on a train and want to go beyond that you can either get a boundary zone ticket, or a ticket from the last station in Zone 6 on that route. The train doesn't have to stop there, nor do you have to touch in or out - it's the same rules as a Zone 1-6 travelcard in that respect.

Often, though not always, a ticket from Boundary Zone 6 will be the same price as the last Zone 6 station on the line anyway. Although Boundary Zone tickets are available from some ticket machines, I don't think you can get them online at all so for most people they are effectively only available from ticket offices.

My bold. There are some places beyond Zone 6 that an over 60s Oyster can be used to. For example Shenfield which is beyond Zone 9 (not 6) !.
BUT only on the Elizabeth Line trains (TfL). However on the same route if its a NR train (not TfL) then its Harold Wood which is in Zone 6.

Here is the map. Careful how you interpret it.

EDIT - improved punctuation (added part in italics)
I assume on the map NR means National Rail ?.

 

[Somewhere]

My bold. There are some places beyond Zone 6 that an over 60s Oyster can be used to. For example Shenfield which is beyond Zone 9 (not 6) !.
BUT only on the Elizabeth Line trains (TfL) if its a NR train (not TfL) then its Harold Wood which is in Zone 6.

Here is the map. Careful how you interpret it.

Elizabeth Line is NR, as well as TfL. So not valid on non-TfL

 

[Peter Sarf]

Elizabeth Line is NR, as well as TfL. So not valid on non-TfL

I have just tidied the puntuation. The map takes a bit of interpretation.

 

[Somewhere]

I have just tidied the puntuation. The map takes a bit of interpretation.

It doesn't help that TfL like to pretend their non-Underground railways aren't National Rail

 

[Peter Sarf]

It doesn't help that TfL like to pretend their non-Underground railways aren't National Rail

Those TfL services straying on to Network Rail (like the Elizabeth Line) are a kind of in between. But, after all, TfL are paying for them ?. I don't mind if it gives me destinations further afield !.

 

[Somewhere]

Those TfL services straying on to Network Rail (like the Elizabeth Line) are a kind of in between. But, after all, TfL are paying for them ?. I don't mind if it gives me destinations further afield !.

They're a combination of TfL/DfT regardless, they're National Rail. And TfL

 

[Peter Sarf]

They're a combination of TfL/DfT regardless, they're National Rail. And TfL

Anyway the main point is the ticket validity as the OP needs to know what to buy (and how).

 

[BJames]

Often, though not always, a ticket from Boundary Zone 6 will be the same price as the last Zone 6 station on the line anyway. Although Boundary Zone tickets are available from some ticket machines, I don't think you can get them online at all so for most people they are effectively only available from ticket offices.

c2c's website do sell Boundary Zone 6 tickets. Off peak day return BZ6 to Grays £3.95 without a railcard. If the OP does buy a senior railcard for general use anyway, this becomes £2.60.

I am wondering if anyone can please clarify a query for me. Having only just recieved my 60+ Oyster, I am keen to use it and am planning a trip to Grays, Kent in a few weeks. I'm keen to learn how I manage fares as the 60+ oyster is only valid upto the tfl/rail boundary. I've read something about boundary fares/tickets but don't fully understand concept or how to purchase one. Is it possible to purchase onward journey tickets on line or does it have to be done at a ticket office. Plus, do I have to touch in/out at the boundary stn when I'm on route.
Tfl and rail network sites seem woefully uninformed on the topic and can't find proper guidance.
Guidance and explanations welcome, please. Thank you in advance.

Welcome to the forum!

As above, you can buy a Boundary Zone 6 to [Destination] from the c2c website, regardless of whether this journey is done on c2c. No doubt others will confirm if other ticket sites also sell boundary tickets but you can definitely buy from there. You can buy from a ticket office or some ticket machines. You don't need to get off your train and the train does not need to stop at the boundary station at all (my mum regularly does a Boundary Zone 6 ticket where the train runs non-stop between East Croydon and Oxted, not calling at the boundary station en-route).

 

[Hadders]

The forum's ticketing site also sells Boundary Zone fares.

 

[themeone]

On the subject of boundary zone fares, I have just experimented with a Boundary Zone 6 to Fareham ticket on this forum's ticketing site and also c2c.

On c2c you can enter "Zone U6* London" as starting point which brings up times but no fares so can go no further. The RailUKforums ticket site doesn't accept Zone U6* London, the nearest I could see was "London Underground Zone 6" which throws a generic error.

I also tried entering 0072 in the From field but neither site would accept it.

 

[miklcct]

On the subject of boundary zone fares, I have just experimented with a Boundary Zone 6 to Fareham ticket on this forum's ticketing site and also c2c.

On c2c you can enter "Zone U6* London" as starting point which brings up times but no fares so can go no further. The RailUKforums ticket site doesn't accept Zone U6* London, the nearest I could see was "London Underground Zone 6" which throws a generic error.

I also tried entering 0072 in the From field but neither site would accept it.

You need to enter boundary zone into c2c website.

 

[Somewhere]

On the subject of boundary zone fares, I have just experimented with a Boundary Zone 6 to Fareham ticket on this forum's ticketing site and also c2c.

On c2c you can enter "Zone U6* London" as starting point which brings up times but no fares so can go no further. The RailUKforums ticket site doesn't accept Zone U6* London, the nearest I could see was "London Underground Zone 6" which throws a generic error.

I also tried entering 0072 in the From field but neither site would accept it.

U6 is different to Boundary 6 - U6 would include a journey from Underground Zone 6 - for example starting at Upminster Bridge then changing at Upminster onto National Rail

 

[themeone]

U6 is different to Boundary 6 - U6 would include a journey from Underground Zone 6 - for example starting at Upminster Bridge then changing at Upminster onto National Rail

Thank you. Entering "Boundary Zone 6" works fine on c2c, but is not accepted on Rail UK Ticketing.

 

[microrich]

The forum's ticketing site also sells Boundary Zone fares.

Is this correct?

On the forum's ticketing site (my normal site of choice for buying tickets) I've tried to enter "Boundary Zone 6" (which is what you can enter on brfares.com) but it doesn't seem to be an option. Maybe it's called something else, but I can't work out what to enter. What it does do is allow you to enter as an option that you have a TFL 60+ oystercard. But unfortunately the forum's ticketing site appears to fail to offer the cheapest fare when doing this.

To give an example:

A return trip on a weekday after 9.30am from St Pancras to Leagrave using a Senior railcard with TFL 60+ Oyster.

brfares.com suggests that the cheapest fare is £9.60 (i.e. Boundary Zone 6 to Leagrave off-peak day return): https://www.brfares.com/!fares?orig=0072&dest=LEA&rlc=SRN&period=20231001

But on the forum's ticketing website, it gives the cheapest option with Senior railcard and TFL 60+ oyster as £11.80. The ticket it offers at this price is a West Hampstead Stations to Leagrave off-peak day return. It is not clear to me why it is offering a ticket from West Hampstead - which is in Zone 2. The last station in Zone 6 is Elstree and Borehamwood. It seems that the site is not offering boundary fares and in addition is not offering the cheapest fares for journeys with TFL 60+ oysters.

As suggested by others, the c2c site does offer the correct cheapest fare of £9.60 (and allows Boundary Zone 6 to be entered as an origin/destination). I cannot find any other online ticket seller site that offers this. But c2c does seem to prove that it is possible to offer this ticket online!

One other observation is that the c2c option is TOD only, with no eTicket option (St Pancras to Leagrave is certainly an eTicket enabled route).

So far, my conclusion is that if you want these fares that you have to either use the c2c website or buy at a ticket office.

Be interested to know if others concur with my conclusions, or whether I'm making a mistake or missing something.

 

[jfollows]

It's not obvious, but if you search this forum for "Boundary Zone 6" you will find, inter alia, https://www.railforums.co.uk/threads/freedom-pass-plus-senior-railcard.254623/#post-6411083 which says

Go into Advanced settings and at the bottom there’s an option to say you already hold a Travelcard.

as the method for buying a Boundary Zone 6 ticket from the forum's ticketing website.

 

[paul1609]

The forum's ticketing site also sells Boundary Zone fares.

I was previously told (on a forum meet) that trainsplit didnt want to sell TOD tickets under about £20 because they lost money because of the charges. Does the forum make any money out of a BZ 6 to Grays ticket?

 

[Hadders]

I was previously told (on a forum meet) that trainsplit didnt want to sell TOD tickets under about £20 because they lost money because of the charges. Does the forum make any money out of a BZ 6 to Grays ticket?

I’ve absolutely no idea.

 

[Adam Williams]

I was previously told (on a forum meet) that trainsplit didnt want to sell TOD tickets under about £20 because they lost money because of the charges. Does the forum make any money out of a BZ 6 to Grays ticket?

Raileasy would make a loss on a £4.80 ticket fulfilled to ToD. This is not entirely down to the industry's fee tariff for collecting ToD tickets, there are other fees to consider too.

 

[Haywain]

Raileasy would make a loss on a £4.80 ticket fulfilled to ToD. This is not entirely down to the industry's fee tariff for collecting ToD tickets, there are other fees to consider too.

On that particular ticket, or is that a reflection of costs on all ToD transactions?

 

[paul1609]

On that particular ticket, or is that a reflection of costs on all ToD transactions?

The enquiry I was making and this was several years ago was for an off peak day return from London Terminals to an East Sussex station which was at the time around £15. I was told they couldn't cover the costs for a TOD ticket but would be able to when it became a e ticket. So it would seem to apply to all low value tod ticket s

 

[Angela.dodwell]

I assume you mean Grays in Essex rather than Gravesend in Kent

You can find the Oyster 60+ map on the web and re Grays in Essex your Oyster 60+ card will take you to Upminster or to Rainham in Essex

Of course you would be able to buy a Senior Railcard to allow discounts re fares to take you onwards to Grays in Essex And you can buy discounted paper tickets online no log in needed and collect the paper ticket at any National Rail Station Ticket Machine, or buy at the ticket office at any National Rail station and that might be easier.

You do not have to tap out at the station where you switch from Oyster 60+ to a paper ticket. And nor do you have to tap in on the way back when you switch between paper ticket and Oyster 60+. Just stay seated on the train(s)

Thank you