Abellio to return Greater Anglia to DfT?

[jon0844]

As said already, no company can hand back the keys at will. That's totally incorrect and there's no 'effectively' about it. If it wasn't in the contract, it can't be done unless you want some rather serious punishments, like losing other franchises.

First was perfectly entitled to take the option, and if it loses the franchise next time around then it did so earlier than it otherwise might have done - so there IS a risk to the company.

 

[tbtc]

Since a franchise can just be handed back effectively at will, as shown with First, they can easily stem any losses they make

First ran the franchise to the agreed end. They didn't take up the *option* to run it for another couple of years, but that was an option. Completely different thing, and its amazing/ depressing to see the Daily Telegraph fall for this lie.

 

[ainsworth74]

Completely different thing, and its amazing/ depressing to see the Daily Telegraph fall for this lie.

About as amazing/depressing as the time that the media went crazy over all the job losses at Derby but seemed to miss the part where Bombardier were going to shed something like 1000 jobs anyway!

 

[CockneySparrow]

Christ, the only thing I remember about the WA side of WAGN is the number of livery variations, the plane white, plain purple, and the multi-coloured one, although that theme continued through NXEA.

Only because NX didn't bother to repaint the trains very often, in Norwich they still had DMUs in Anglia Railways colours, probably didn't want to spend the money

 

[MK Tom]

Only because NX didn't bother to repaint the trains very often, in Norwich they still had DMUs in Anglia Railways colours, probably didn't want to spend the money

Not helped by realising half way through the franchise that the 'One' livery and name were both terrible.

Have GA been much better at painting though? They got off to a good start, and their white/read livery works nicely, but there still seems to be a Central-liveried 156 kicking around not to mention a lot of de-coloured One and NXEA stock. You can't expect much investment from an 18-month franchise though to be fair.

 

[CockneySparrow]

£250M in the final year or £688.000 a day!!! I queried this with Ruud Hakett just after they were awarded the franchised I asked: "how are you going to pay this, if the revenue steam goes down?" his reply was and this is a direct quote "We are Dutch Railways - we don't go broke"! Hmmm shall I ask him again?...remember that NS is still state owned so the Netherlands government could always cash the franchise in but at a huge penalty cost which might still be cheaper than paying out the £250M. I do hope they hang on to it; for if it fails, that'll be another little job for DOR after DfT have flogged off East Coast.

Are they flogging off East Coast, I heard that East Coast made so much profit the government were thinking of keeping it lol
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Not helped by realising half way through the franchise that the 'One' livery and name were both terrible.

Have GA been much better at painting though? They got off to a good start, and their white/read livery works nicely, but there still seems to be a Central-liveried 156 kicking around not to mention a lot of de-coloured One and NXEA stock. You can't expect much investment from an 18-month franchise though to be fair.

No true, but they did say when they took over that they weren't looking to repaint trains, there is an Arriva coloured 153 kicking around but I believe this is only on loan to GA, inside it still has Arriva adverts on the notice boards
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As said already, no company can hand back the keys at will. That's totally incorrect and there's no 'effectively' about it. If it wasn't in the contract, it can't be done unless you want some rather serious punishments, like losing other franchises.

National Express handed the East Coast franchise back at will, although they didn't immediately lose the East Anglia franchise as a result they did in the end

 

[ainsworth74]

National Express handed the East Coast franchise back at will, although they didn't immediately lose the East Anglia franchise as a result they did in the end

Though they didn't get away without losses as it cost them something like £80m. Alright not much in the grand scheme of things but their reputation in the rail industry has certainly never recovered and I'd suggest part of the reason they didn't get the GA caretaker franchise was handing back NXEC out of the blue.

 

[TheJRB]

Have GA been much better at painting though? They got off to a good start, and their white/read livery works nicely, but there still seems to be a Central-liveried 156 kicking around not to mention a lot of de-coloured One and NXEA stock. You can't expect much investment from an 18-month franchise though to be fair.

From what I've heard, the 156s will receive the official GA livery when they are refurbished to be DDA compliant (which should begin at some point after the Paralympics are over).

That Central 156 is definitely still about; I have a photo of it at Norwich in June!

 

[CockneySparrow]

Though they didn't get away without losses as it cost them something like £80m. Alright not much in the grand scheme of things but their reputation in the rail industry has certainly never recovered and I'd suggest part of the reason they didn't get the GA caretaker franchise was handing back NXEC out of the blue.

Yes it was, I read somewhere that at the time the then government was looking of taking the East Anglia franchise away from NX but were unable to as it was a different franchise, basically somewhere along the line Labour couldn't take it away legally, hence why they stayed on, when the franchise come up for renewal I think their bid was chucked out :roll:

 

[jopsuk]

That Central 156 is definitely still about; I have a photo of it at Norwich in June!

saw it at Cambridge about quarter to six last night...

 

[tunster]

Would be extremely unusual to see something like this happen only after 7 months with Abellio knowing it was going to be a costly short-term franchise to get them on the pegging order for the long-term.

To be fair, the service has improved leap-bounds in comparison to NXEA. Their customer service is much better, the ticket machines have been updated to be much more intuitive and generally more reliable. I'm unsure whether that was down to the work done over months worth of weekends but something's making a difference. Abellio seem to react better when there is a problem (especially around the last hot period when trains were restricted for speed).

I don't think it'll be all easy-peasy for Abellio to get the long-term franchise. Virgin have just lost the West-Coast franchise and surely will be looking at other options. The GEML will probably be quite a tasty prospect for them, especially if the government do look at approving the improvement investment needed.

 

[island]

In my view if a Franchise defaults or hands back a franchise before any get out clauses become active (such as that of FGW), they should be excluded from bidding for all further franchises for a minimum of 5 years. Should stop the ridiculous over bidding if they are penalised with exclusion from future franchise bidding, with stupidly over prices bids

And stripped of every other franchise they hold in the country too. If there's a legal obstacle, get a cross-default clause written into every new franchise agreement from this point forward.

 

[Clip]

From what I've heard, the 156s will receive the official GA livery when they are refurbished to be DDA compliant (which should begin at some point after the Paralympics are over).

That Central 156 is definitely still about; I have a photo of it at Norwich in June!

Saw it in Norwich about a week ago

 

[47421]

has the Abellio / GA franchise agreement been published does anyone know? I have looked on DfT website but does not seem to be there

 

[WCMLaddict]

This thread should really be closed as it is simply rubbish rumour and has no relation to reality.

FYI I know that MD of Abellio UK has actually read first few pages of this thread
What a popular place huh?

 

[swt_passenger]

has the Abellio / GA franchise agreement been published does anyone know? I have looked on DfT website but does not seem to be there

I emailed the link shown on that website page this morning, reply just received this afternoon:

The Greater Anglia Abellio Franchise Agreement has not been published on the DfT website because the redactions are in the process of being completed.

There is a timescale of about 6 -8 weeks for when the redactions will be finalised and the Franchise Agreement published on the DfT website. I have your contact details and will notify you when it is published.

Kind regards

Rail Public Register Team

 

[HH]

Though they didn't get away without losses as it cost them something like £80m. Alright not much in the grand scheme of things but their reputation in the rail industry has certainly never recovered and I'd suggest part of the reason they didn't get the GA caretaker franchise was handing back NXEC out of the blue.

They didn't lose NXEA or C2C due to a legal technicality. That loophole will not arise again.
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And stripped of every other franchise they hold in the country too. If there's a legal obstacle, get a cross-default clause written into every new franchise agreement from this point forward.

There's already such a clause and has been for years.

 

[dk1]

This thread should really be closed as it is simply rubbish rumour and has no relation to reality.

I will second that :roll:

 

[CockneySparrow]

They didn't lose NXEA or C2C due to a legal technicality. That loophole will not arise again.
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There's already such a clause and has been for years.

No, there hasn't been a clause for years, When NX defaulted on the East Coast route the government looked into taking the East Anglia franchise away but found they couldnt