Alliance Rail (GNWR) gets Network Rail approval

[nrturner]

Network Rail has reached an agreement with open access operator Great North Western Railway Company (GNWR) for the sale of access rights for two new rail services on the West Coast main line.

GNWR, a subsidiary of the Arriva-owned Alliance Rail Holdings, will operate new services between London and the north of England, presuming it is given final approval from the Office of Rail Regulation (ORR).

A fleet of eight new Pendolino trainsets will operate six return trips a day between London and Blackpool from 2017 and six return trips a day between London and Huddersfield, via Manchester Victoria and Leeds, from 2018.

More than 200 new jobs created for this operation.

Ian Yeowart, managing director of GNWR, said: “It has taken a significant amount of work since our initial application in 2011 to get to this point where Network Rail has agreed to the sale of access rights.

“There is still some way to go following full approval, as new rolling stock needs to be ordered and a full recruitment process needs to be undertaken. The target dates for operation are set to coincide with the full electrification of the two routes.”

GNWR’s initial application as been scaled back after Network Rail rejected routes to Bradford and the Cumbrian Coast because of potential timetabling and performance issues.

http://www.globalrailnews.com/2014/06/12/gnwr-granted-access-to-west-coast-main-line/
http://www.alliancerail.co.uk/2014/...ndon-direct-rail-services-move-a-step-closer/

Interesting development for Yoghurt Rail.

 

[gordonthemoron]

I trust they will be stopping at Milton Keynes

 

[Jonny]

Manchester, Leeds, THEN Huddersfield?

????????

 

[pemma]

Interesting development for Yoghurt Rail.

Especially when the bids for the failed WC franchise included proposals for Blackpool services and Huddersfield-London is an option bidders can propose for the EC franchise.

 

[Jonny]

I trust they will be stopping at Milton Keynes

I suspect that might be deemed to be "too abstractive"...

 

[nrturner]

Manchester, Leeds, THEN Huddersfield?

????????

Alliance's own site says:

Six return trains a day between London and Huddersfield via Manchester Victoria and then continuing on to Leeds – starting in 2018

 

[pemma]

I trust they will be stopping at Milton Keynes

Ignore I copied the calling patterns off the website not the track application.

 

[rebmcr]

Manchester, Leeds, THEN Huddersfield?

????????

Via Hebden Bridge! :)

 

[thealexweb]

Calling patterns proposed for Blackpool service:

Euston
Milton Keynes
Rugby
Nuneaton
Tamworth
Lichfield
Crewe
Winsford
Warrington Bank Quay
Newton-le-Willows
Preston
Kirkham & Wesham
Poulton-le-Fylde
Blackpool North

Bolton and Chorley overlooked again. Running London to Manchester then via Bolton to Blackpool would surely avoid some of congestion on the WCML.

 

[pemma]

Alliance's own site says:

Which is strange as the route plan on their website shows services going to Stockport and then to Huddersfield via the Denton line.

Maybe they want to run via Eccles and Victoria instead?

 

[A0wen]

I trust they will be stopping at Milton Keynes

Why would they want to do that? It's not like MK doesn't get a decent service now.....:roll:
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Bolton and Chorley overlooked again. Running London to Manchester then via Bolton to Blackpool would surely avoid some of congestion on the WCML.

Except there's not exactly a huge number of available paths from either Stoke or Crewe to Manchester and it would add a considerable overhead to journey time.

 

[pemma]

Ermm - it won't a service to London Euston. The track application states a service to Queens Park (London). Also the calling patterns are different to that on the Alliance website

http://www.alliancerail.co.uk/wp-co...ack access contract/track access contract.pdf

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

One of the oddities about railway history is that no rail company with "Great" in its title has ever operated over the West Cost Main Line or its major branches.
That kind of self-aggrandisement was left to other routes.
The "Great Central" turned up in Manchester from 1897, but everybody knew it was really the Manchester, Sheffield & Lincolnshire underneath.


The important access decision, from ORR, is yet to come.
The battle for the two new WCML paths post-Norton Bridge has started.
This would take one of them, leaving one for the WC franchisee.
If all the stops quoted are made, it won't be a very fast service.
It will work wonders for the train service between Stockport and Stalybridge!

If it goes ahead fairly soon, it will put the various mini-Pendolino options for other TOCs back on the table in a modern form.

 

[A0wen]

Ermm - it won't a service to London Euston. The track application states a service to Queens Park (London). Also the calling patterns are different to that on the Alliance website

http://www.alliancerail.co.uk/wp-co...ack access contract/track access contract.pdf

Not how I read it - it appears they are looking for additional slots between Queens Park and Euston - I assume they need access for servicing or similar?

The services are listed on there as Euston - Blackpool and Euston - W Yorkshire.

 

[abbo1234]

Bolton and Chorley overlooked again. Running London to Manchester then via Bolton to Blackpool would surely avoid some of congestion on the WCML.

Yes, Bolton and Chorley seem to be loosing out a lot now, maybe more trains should call at Euxton Balshaw lane to compensate.

I now use EBL more than Chorley, plus it is £3 cheaper to Blackpool for virtually the same distance.

 

[thealexweb]

Yes,Bolton and Chorley seem to be loosing out a lot now,maybe more trains should call at Euxton Balshaw lane to compensate.

I now use EBL more than Chorley,plus it is £3 cheaper to Blackpool for virtually the same distance.

With the TPX Blackpool, Windermere and Barrow services going over to Northern its only gong to get worse for the (true) Manchester to Preston line

 

[Manchester77]

With the possibility of the future ICWC franchise holder operating an expanded market I wonder whether the ORR will approve this when it could prevent a franchises operation from doing so.

 

[pemma]

Not how I read it - it appears they are looking for additional slots between Queens Park and Euston - I assume they need access for servicing or similar?

The services are listed on there as Euston - Blackpool and Euston - W Yorkshire.

Ah I see they've applied for 12 northbound and southbound Queens Park to Euston paths separately.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

If all the stops quoted are made, it won't be a very fast service.
It will work wonders for the train service between Stockport and Stalybridge!

Ignore the list I posted originally I copied and pasted off the website thinking it would be correct but those aren't the proposed calling points anymore and in the case of Leeds-London it would be via Victoria and Eccles now.

 

[Hellfire]

They are hoping to start the London to Blackpool services from 2017. Presumably they have to wait until the ORR signs it off. Then they have to order new Pendolinos. Is that a realistic timetable?

 

[theshillito]

Interesting that Winsford, which they were planning to upgrade to a "parkway", is omitted from the calling patterns of the Blackpool service in their documents, but still shown on the map on the site http://www.alliancerail.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2009/12/wxc.png. Shame, but understandable considering there's not really that much space they could use around it.

EDIT: also, for those saying it'd be a slow service, there's the "regular calling pattern" and the "additional stations". For example, the London to Blackpool North service would always call at Crewe, Warrington BQ, Preston and Poulton-le-Fylde. As for Milton Keynes Central, Rugby, Nuneaton, Tamworth, Lichfield TV and Kirkham & Wesham, they may not be in all services.

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

With the possibility of the future ICWC franchise holder operating an expanded market I wonder whether the ORR will approve this when it could prevent a franchises operation from doing so.

It would be a problem before the Norton Bridge upgrade, with only one path available in some hours.
Making it afterwards, and also after Blackpool/TP electrification simplifies things as there should be room for both.
But it would be fun if Arriva (who own Alliance) won the ICWC franchise in 2017.
If Alliance go for Pendolinos I imagine they will be managed at Alstom's WCML depots, alongside (currently) VT's trains.
Dropping Barrow, Bradford and Leeds via Stockport means bi-mode or loco haulage is not required.

 

[pemma]

Interesting that Winsford, which they were planning to upgrade to a "parkway", is omitted from the calling patterns of the Blackpool service in their documents, but still shown on the map on the site http://www.alliancerail.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2009/12/wxc.png. Shame, but understandable considering there's not really that much space they could use around it.

Ian Yeowart actually admitted himself that the proposed Winsford changes may not be possible, that was when they were proposing 5 car Polaris trains, now they are proposing 6 car Pendolinos.

 

[Class 170101]

Interesting that Alliance have (almost) got into Euston where others before them failed.

 

[pemma]

Interesting that Alliance have (almost) got into Euston where others before them failed.

Grand Central used to be managed by Ian Yeowart and are owned by Arriva, the same as Alliance. Grand Central haven't resubmitted amended bids to prevent bidding against their sister.

 

[oversteer]

Ermm - it won't a service to London Euston. The track application states a service to Queens Park (London). Also the calling patterns are different to that on the Alliance website

http://www.alliancerail.co.uk/wp-co...ack access contract/track access contract.pdf

How can they operate out of Queens Park? I can't imagine LM being pleased with the slows being blocked for any period of time..

 

[pemma]

How can they operate out of Queens Park? I can't imagine LM being pleased with the slows being blocked for any period of time..

See posts 14 and 18.

 

[ac6000cw]

Which is strange as the route plan on their website shows services going to Stockport and then to Huddersfield via the Denton line.

Is Stockport - Guide Bridge via Denton electrified (or going to be) ? (bit tricky using Pendolinos otherwise )

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

Is Stockport - Guide Bridge via Denton electrified (or going to be) ? (bit tricky using Pendolinos otherwise )

Not needed it seems.
Trains will go Crewe-Warrington-Newton le Willows-Victoria-Stalybridge-Leeds (all electric by 2017/18).

Edit: Actually, when the Ordsall Curve is in (2018?) electric trains could run Crewe-Stalybridge via Stockport, Oxford Road and Victoria.

 

[theshillito]

Ian Yeowart actually admitted himself that the proposed Winsford changes may not be possible, that was when they were proposing 5 car Polaris trains, now they are proposing 6 car Pendolinos.

The platforms are getting lengthened, aren't they, or is that Hartford (which used to get London trains back in the day anyway)?

 

[pemma]

The platforms are getting lengthened, aren't they, or is that Hartford (which used to get London trains back in the day anyway)?

I don't know of any plans. Winsford isn't mentioned under platform lengthening in Network Rail's CP5 plans.

Hartford can take a 11 car train and the trains stopping at it are 4 car 350s, so I don't think it needs platform lengthening!