Avanti reduced timetable – passenger experiences

[Wearhead]

Transport Focus has just published the results of their panel survey into Avanti's reduced timetable customer experiences (that's us, by the way). https://d3cez36w5wymxj.cloudfront.n...educed-timetable-–-passenger-experiences​.pdf

The key problems are . . . .
• information provided prior to travel confusing
• a lack of timely information to make an informed decision
• unable to amend reservations as timetable not published until a few days in
advance of travel
• double booking of reserved seats
• reservation system on trains not activating
• short-notice cancellation occurring on a daily basis
• services full and standing
• erratic provision of catering
• impact of poor journey experience leading to passengers considering alternative
travel options in future
• timetables and tickets not being available when passengers are looking at future
travel dates are putting people off travelling by rail
• concerns that reduced timetable will lead to a poor journey
experience (overcrowding) putting people off travelling
• refund process cumbersome, slow and uncommunicative
• the late availability of information for future travel is not only inconvenient but
making people anxious
• passengers with disabilities or additional needs are put off travelling

But apart from that, Avanti are still a financially viable company thanks to the generosity of the current (and previous) Tory governments.

 

[JamieL]

Avanti are awful at present - and despite the reduced timetable they are unable to confirm their services until far too late. I agree with much of the above. If they could only offer a service whereby the trains ran more or less on time, respected seat reservations, are not declassified and provide the catering facilities advertised. This is hardly an unreasonable ask. Such poor performance would not be tolerated in other industries.

 

[Skiddaw]

They're pants. As I'm always banging on about, us Cumbrians are mightly fed up with them.

 

[route101]

They're pants. As I'm always banging on about, us Cumbrians are mightly fed up with them.

And you don't have much of an alternative such as flying.

 

[dk1]

There is no alternative at the moment & nothing can possibly alter things. It is what it is.

 

[JamieL]

There is no alternative at the moment & nothing can possibly alter things. It is what it is.

I disagree. A good start would be for Avanti to attempt to improve the industrial relations with its staff.

 

[dk1]

I disagree. A good start would be for Avanti to attempt to improve the industrial relations with its staff.

Of course that would help. I was referring to anybody else taking over the franchise.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Of course that would help. I was referring to anybody else taking over the franchise.

A different operator with a different line on industrial relations may help significantly.

 

[LRV3004]

Avanti have a similarity and also a difference between themselves and Boris Johnson.
Similarity - neither of them are fit for purpose.
Difference - Boris Johnson at least admitted defeat and quit.

 

[itsonlyme]

Avanti have a similarity and also a difference between themselves and Boris Johnson.
Similarity - neither of them are fit for purpose.
Difference - Boris Johnson at least admitted defeat and quit.

Absolutely useless. any other reliable way of getting North from Crewe without it taking a whole day would be appreciated

 

[dk1]

A different operator with a different line on industrial relations may help significantly.

DfT unfortunately will still be involved.

The reduced timetable is looking very robust today

 

[3rd rail land]

DfT unfortunately will still be involved.

Are Avanti wanting to negotiate with the unions or make a meaningful offer but getting blocked by DfT?

 

[dk1]

Are Avanti wanting to negotiate with the unions or make a meaningful offer but getting blocked by DfT?

The DfT seem to be interfering with every TOC. Leave it to the operators to decide and things will improve in no time at all.

 

[Bletchleyite]

The DfT seem to be interfering with every TOC. Leave it to the operators to decide and things will improve in no time at all.

It could only do that if the operators were paying, though, which would mean going back to a franchised or other block-grant-style* approach rather than a cost-plus approach. Would you let someone else negotiate on your behalf if you were paying?

* e.g. BR wasn't micromanaged, it received a "block grant" and strategic direction and was largely left to get on with it.

 

[dk1]

It could only do that if the operators were paying, though, which would mean going back to a franchised or other block-grant-style* approach rather than a cost-plus approach. Would you let someone else negotiate on your behalf if you were paying?

* e.g. BR wasn't micromanaged, it received a "block grant" and strategic direction and was largely left to get on with it.

I most certainly would allow it within reason.

 

[Bletchleyite]

I most certainly would allow it within reason.

I absolutely would not. My money, my final sign-off. OK, I would get someone like a solicitor to negotiate professionally on my behalf, but I would have last refusal.

 

[Vespa]

Today my 9.38 from Wigan to Edinburgh got cancelled, I have been able to use TPE as there is cross acceptance of ticket while there is an emergency timetable TPE I'd also affected.

Once I realised this I arrived at Wigan and hoped to dash across to catch the delayed 7.40 to Edinburgh fortunately my connecting train door didn't open in time and the door closed and set off, forcing me to cat h the 8.01 Glasgow and change to TPE Preston.

 

[43066]

I absolutely would not. My money, my final sign-off. OK, I would get someone like a solicitor to negotiate professionally on my behalf, but I would have last refusal.

The irony there is that, up until Covid, Avanti was (AIUI) one of the few operators turning an actual profit. Ideological DfT micro micromanagement and penny wise pound foolish spending decisions are the cause of most of the railway’s current issues and will ultimately make the financial situation worse if recovery of passenger usage is inhibited. See the DfT mandated refusals to renew RDW agreements at TPE and XC, for example (I have no idea what the current state of play is there).

The DfT also clearly has no understanding of just how reliant on goodwill the industry really is….

 

[Howardh]

They're pants. As I'm always banging on about, us Cumbrians are mightly fed up with them.

How's Carlisle airport these days? Noted they flew (still fly?) to Southend for London and the SE, if so that might be a decent alternative to Avanti? But it's absolutely appalling that there's just the one company can get you from Cumbria to the south, and I'm sure if Blackpool Airport was still a thing they could fill the gaps. There's always Transpennine to Manchester Airport....oh.

If Avanti's contract (or whatever it is) can't be cancelled, surely they should allow another company to run trains in the slots that Avanti can't use? However which companies would have the spare capacity

 

[fandroid]

How's Carlisle airport these days? Noted they flew (still fly?) to Southend for London and the SE, if so that might be a decent alternative to Avanti? But it's absolutely appalling that there's just the one company can get you from Cumbria to the south, and I'm sure if Blackpool Airport was still a thing they could fill the gaps. There's always Transpennine to Manchester Airport....oh.

If Avanti's contract (or whatever it is) can't be cancelled, surely they should allow another company to run trains in the slots that Avanti can't use? However which companies would have the spare capacity

They'd probably need 125mph capability and drivers who knew the routes. No other company has pendolinos, so that's unlikely.

 

[Carlisle]

How's Carlisle airport these days?

The flights ceased at the start of the first lockdown. Someone better informed than me might know I’d there’s any prospect of them returning in the medium or longer term .

 

[GodSaveTheKing]

I personally prefer LNR rather than Avanti these days. Not just cheaper fares but also far fewer cancellations / higher punctuality than London Midland eram, at least on Crewe-London route. Also a thumbs up by prioritising their 8-car's on this route (quite often it's 4-car pre-pandemic).

 

[Howardh]

They'd probably need 125mph capability and drivers who knew the routes. No other company has pendolinos, so that's unlikely.

Think people like myself just want to get from A to B without the current hassle, so if it's 100mph and takes a wee while longer then so be it. If a TOC could offer guaranteed times, guaranteed reserved seat and 3hrs Manchester>London I'd book right now.

 

[LRV3004]

If Avanti's contract (or whatever it is) can't be cancelled, surely they should allow another company to run trains in the slots that Avanti can't use? However which companies would have the spare capacity

LSL and West Coast Railways did this recently of course. LSL's "Friday Charter" south to Euston from Crewe currently runs in the path of the 1355 Manchester to Euston.....

 

[AJP62]

Joined 13.15 Manchester P - Euston at Macclesfield just now. Just over 10 late as incoming train from Euston late. Very busy - lots standing where I joined in U - but Standard Premium seems declassified so see how that goes

Edit - made up a couple of minutes and no move out of Standard Premium so not bad overall. Was meant to be joining 13.35 off Piccadilly with ticket so no reserved seat on rearranged service. As off yesterday morning still no tickets for Sunday trains back so going Monday morning.

 

[All Line Rover]

I personally prefer LNR rather than Avanti these days. Not just cheaper fares but also far fewer cancellations / higher punctuality than London Midland eram, at least on Crewe-London route. Also a thumbs up by prioritising their 8-car's on this route (quite often it's 4-car pre-pandemic).

Reliability yes, although the sooner the 350/2s are rid, the better. It is incredibly annoying having the inconsistency of a high quality intercity experience one minute, with a tube-like experience the next, where a third of passengers (on a weekday) are trying to balance a laptop on their knees, there are hardly any power sockets, and passengers with an aisle seat are constantly hit by people walking to/from the toilet through the very narrow aisle.

 

[Skiddaw]

The flights ceased at the start of the first lockdown. Someone better informed than me might know I’d there’s any prospect of them returning in the medium or longer term .

Nope. It was very recently announced that there's no plans to resume any passenger services from Carlisle airport.

 

[David57]

Seconded for the 350/2's, they are dreadful trains for some of the routes that they are used on, quite unsuitable.

 

[Howardh]

Nope. It was very recently announced that there's no plans to resume any passenger services from Carlisle airport.

So that's three local airports gone for pax within a decade (Carlisle/Doncaster/Blackpool). Hopefully at Carlisle that will be temporary and I'm wondering if the new FlyBe might be interested in routes from there? With the state of Avanti we need an alternative.

Seconded for the 350/2's, they are dreadful trains for some of the routes that they are used on, quite unsuitable.

I don't think I could travel Crewe/London in them unless in first; many pax don't go the full distance on them in my experience - although I would imagine that many more do so nowadays as an alternative to Avanti. I'm assuming that 350/2's are the units on that route?

Thought they were being replaced anyway?

 

[philthetube]

With the costs involved, running 1 route from an airport is not feasible, fire provision alone makes this so.