Avanti West Coast: Standard Premium

[Bletchleyite]

The Coach K situation really needs to stop, it's been going on for years and no one seems to care.

First Class being significantly smaller than it used to be should sort it out when/if demand picks up again at least.

The staff now have a row of officially reserved seats (the very back row). You could perhaps argue that the row in front should be reserved too to allow them to distance, but really this formal reservation of the back row was meant to solve it.

But beyond that Avanti really do need to grasp the nettle on this even if it does mean needing to enter into a formal dispute (on which I would be wholly in Avanti's support), it's simply not OK and never has been, and needs to stop, now. Even more so if First is only going to be two vehicles.

 

[voyagerdude220]

Surely Avanti are at risk of "upsetting" First Class ticket holders.
(particularly now TOCs are trying to encourage more people to return to the trains after Covid)

First Class passengers now: (on Pendolino trains)

Have far fewer seats to choose from.
Paying greatly increased fares (as cheaper Advance tickets not available- presumably as a direct consequence of far fewer First Class seats being bookable)
Scrapped Weekend First upgrades
No longer have as much personal space away from fellow passengers because of the reduced First Class capacity.

Whereas..

Standard Premier sounds much more attractive. Just take your own food/drink.

 

[Butts]

Are Standard Premier Advances about the same price banding Advanced 1st Class Singles used to be ?

 

[DJ_K666]

I'd do away with first and upgrade Standard to match. Passengers pay through the nose as it is so I think giving them some perks is not before time.

 

[Journeyman]

I'd do away with first and upgrade Standard to match. Passengers pay through the nose as it is so I think giving them some perks is not before time.

That won't work because you'd immediately cut capacity, which would force up fares.

 

[Trackman]

Are Standard Premier Advances about the same price banding Advanced 1st Class Singles used to be ?

Are Standard Premier advances out yet?

 

[Hazlehead]

Are Standard Premier advances out yet?

No led to believe they are available to buy from July for travel from September

 

[Butts]

No led to believe they are available to buy from July for travel from September

Will be interesting to see how they compare in price with the Old First Class Advanced and how much they in turn have bumped up.

 

[CyrusWuff]

Fares are already showing on BRFares.com, at least for the flows I've looked at.

Euston - Manchester Standard Advances range from £19.50 to £161.10; Standard Premier from £44.50 to £209.70; and First Class from £39.00 to £239.10. By comparison, the Off-Peak Single is £66.10, Earlybird Anytime Single (has to be booked at least 15 days in advance, but is unrestricted) is £147.80, Anytime Single is £184.70, First Class Off-Peak Single is £163.10 and First Class Anytime Single is £255.00.

 

[Butts]

Fares are already showing on BRFares.com, at least for the flows I've looked at.

Euston - Manchester Standard Advances range from £19.50 to £161.10; Standard Premier from £44.50 to £209.70; and First Class from £39.00 to £239.10. By comparison, the Off-Peak Single is £66.10, Earlybird Anytime Single (has to be booked at least 15 days in advance, but is unrestricted) is £147.80, Anytime Single is £184.70, First Class Off-Peak Single is £163.10 and First Class Anytime Single is £255.00.

So the lowest First Class Fare is £5 lower than the cheapest Standard Premier ?


What's that all about - is there only 1 on each service or something ?

 

[Merseysider]

So the lowest First Class Fare is £5 lower than the cheapest Standard Premier ?


What's that all about - is there only 1 on each service or something ?

Possibly there so they can advertise “First class from £39” - though they’ll probably have a maximum of one at that price available per train.

 

[GNER 91128]

I have to wonder if Standard Premier will go the same way as the GNER Standard + did, although it does offer a little bit more than Standard + as that was just a standard class carriage with complimentary tea and coffee.

 

[py_megapixel]

I have to wonder if Standard Premier will go the same way as the GNER Standard + did, although it does offer a little bit more than Standard + as that was just a standard class carriage with complimentary tea and coffee.

Standard Premium is essentially the opposite of that - the first class carriage but without the complementary refreshment.

 

[Butts]

Standard Premium is essentially the opposite of that - the first class carriage but without the complementary refreshment.

it wouldn't kill them to throw in free tea, coffee and biscuits in SP.

Possibly there so they can advertise “First class from £39” - though they’ll probably have a maximum of one at that price available per train.

Are you serious, I was joking saying one !!

What will be the next cheapest and how many of them will there be ?

 

[Merseysider]

it wouldn't kill them to throw in free tea, coffee and biscuits in SP.



Are you serious, I was joking saying one !!

What will be the next cheapest and how many of them will there be ?

For Manchester to London, it looks like the next tier up is £41 and then £49.

On your morning rush hour trains I wouldn’t be surprised if the cheapest 1st Advance fare is above even that price level, given that Standard is typically £30-£40 at that time.

 

[Butts]

For Manchester to London, it looks like the next tier up is £41 and then £49.

On your morning rush hour trains I wouldn’t be surprised if the cheapest 1st Advance fare is above even that price level, given that Standard is typically £30-£40 at that time.

Still with a Senior Railcard those fares become manageable- if you can blag one and the Whisky comes back.

They should serve Free Alcohol on all services like BA do, morning noon and night.

 

[philosopher]

Standard Premium is essentially the opposite of that - the first class carriage but without the complementary refreshment.

I would have thought there would be a bigger market for a better seat without food than for a standard seat with free tea / coffee and a snack. Buying a tea or coffee and a small snack will in most cases will not cost more than four pounds and can be bought on train in any case.

 

[CC 72100]

Still with a Senior Railcard those fares become manageable- if you can blag one and the Whisky comes back.

They should serve Free Alcohol on all services like BA do, morning noon and night.

Not everything in life revolves around free alcohol you know.

 

[D6130]

Not everything in life revolves around free alcohol you know.

Very true....but it does seem to make the journey more pleasant and relaxed - especially if your train is delayed.

 

[Butts]

Not everything in life revolves around free alcohol you know.

No but it's nice to have the choice.

 

[Class83]

Fares are already showing on BRFares.com, at least for the flows I've looked at.

Euston - Manchester Standard Advances range from £19.50 to £161.10; Standard Premier from £44.50 to £209.70; and First Class from £39.00 to £239.10. By comparison, the Off-Peak Single is £66.10, Earlybird Anytime Single (has to be booked at least 15 days in advance, but is unrestricted) is £147.80, Anytime Single is £184.70, First Class Off-Peak Single is £163.10 and First Class Anytime Single is £255.00.

The interesting bit is the Standard Premium equivalent of a Standard Open Return. Not that we're travelling much at the moment, but my work won't allow First Class for 2 hour journeys, however, they might let 'Standard Premium' through. Looking at BR fares there either isn't or I can't see if there is such a thing as a Standard Premium Open Return. But I expect a lot of people travelling for work would happily book these and grab a coffee and croissant in the station, increasing revenue from Standard Open Returns.

 

[CyrusWuff]

Looking at BR fares there either isn't or I can't see if there is such a thing as a Standard Premium Open Return.

For walk-up tickets it's like Weekend First, in that you can upgrade on-board, subject to space being available.

Using Euston to Manchester again, the upgrade is £25 Single. (Ticket type 25Q STDPREM ONBOARD), compared to a full First Class upgrade at £50 Single (Ticket type U50 AWC UPGRADE 50).

 

[godfreycomplex]

Not everything in life revolves around free alcohol you know.

I’ve never seen any evidence to prove that statement

 

[gallafent]

full First Class upgrade at £50 Single (Ticket type U50 AWC UPGRADE 50).

Wow, Weekend First can cost £50 now!? When I were a lad it were £2. Those were the days.

 

[Carlisle]

Wow, Weekend First can cost £50 now!? When I were a lad it were £2. Those were the days.

Wasn’t it originally Bargain First & cost £1

 

[STINT47]

What will happen if someone books first class but the catering is unavailable?

In the past they said the catering was complimentary so no compensation was due but now that they offer two products in the same seats one with and one without catering I'm not sure this answer will be valid anymore.

 

[Watershed]

What will happen if someone books first class but the catering is unavailable?

In the past they said the catering was complimentary so no compensation was due but now that they offer two products in the same seats one with and one without catering I'm not sure this answer will be valid anymore.

'Refreshments are "complimentary"' wasn't an excuse before, and certainly won't be now. But I wouldn't be surprised if it's wheeled out again.

 

[jfollows]

Wasn’t it originally Bargain First & cost £1

At one time it was free (Manchester-London at least), at weekends a number of First Class carriages had window labels "for the use of passengers with second class tickets" or something similar.
I'd make a point of going into Manchester on a Saturday day out to London (from Macclesfield) to get the 10:12 thence and my choice of First Class seat when the stock came into the platform, then calling only at Stockport and Wilmslow.
The carriage working diagrams of the time specified which carriages were to be so labelled.

Of course at the time there was no service of any sort in First Class, all you got was a more comfortable seat and you had to slum it in the buffet queue like everyone else anyway.

I'm talking about late 1970s by the way. When there was a £9 return "saver" ticket to London also if memory serves correctly, with few time restrictions and none at weekends.

 

[Wolfie]

'Refreshments are "complimentary"' wasn't an excuse before, and certainly won't be now. But I wouldn't be surprised if it's wheeled out again.

If it happened to me l would go straight to Court if l didn't get the cost difference between First and Standard Premium immediately refunded. It's about time that the rail industry was taught some hard sharp lessons about consumer rights and contractual obligations. Sue every single time.

 

[island]

If it happened to me l would go straight to Court if l didn't get the cost difference between First and Standard Premium immediately refunded. It's about time that the rail industry was taught some hard sharp lessons about consumer rights and contractual obligations. Sue every single time.

That attitude's likely to get costs awarded against you (or at least no order as to costs, meaning you bear your own costs) for failing to comply with pre-action conduct and protocols in the civil procedure rules. Litigation is expected to be a last resort and parties are required to engage in negotiation/mediation or use an ombudsman scheme, not jump straight into court.