BFI: Fully Fitted Freight in the 1950's Talking Pictures 13.40pm 17/07

[Midnight Sun]

BFI: Fully Fitted Freight in the 1950's Talking Pictures 13.40pm 17/07 Sky 328 | Freeview 81 | Freesat 306 | Virgin 445

The story of the fast freight, 4:48 pm, Bristol-Leeds, vacuum braked throughout. Conveyed in crisp black & white images by veteran cinematographer Ronald Craigen. 1957. Factual. Director: Ralph Keene.

 

[hexagon789]

On again on the 2nd August at 17:05 if anyone misses it.

 

[hexagon789]

And The Ghost Train (1941) is on Thursday the 6th at 11:45.

 

[WesternLancer]

BFI: Fully Fitted Freight in the 1950's Talking Pictures 13.40pm 17/07 Sky 328 | Freeview 81 | Freesat 306 | Virgin 445

The story of the fast freight, 4:48 pm, Bristol-Leeds, vacuum braked throughout. Conveyed in crisp black & white images by veteran cinematographer Ronald Craigen. 1957. Factual. Director: Ralph Keene.

A superbly made film. I have heard that not long after release it got fewer public airings because it shows/highlights a steam operation at just the point the modernization plan needed to be seen to be conveying images of more modern traction, such as diesel haulage.

As a matter of interest, when would long distance freight like that depicted in the film have gone over to diesel haulage generally? Closer to 1960? And what sort of diesels would have been the typical motive power for a turn like that?

 

[ainsworth74]

Fully Fitted Freight is well worth a watch for a window into a world that was about to come crashing to an end in not much more than a decade or so later. Absolutely fascinating stuff. It might still be floating around on YouTube actually (that's where I saw it).

And The Ghost Train (1941) is on Thursday the 6th at 11:45.

Oh that's very good too and well worth a watch. The story was by Arnold Ridley who would go on to play Godfrey in Dad's Army.

 

[WesternLancer]

Fully Fitted Freight is well worth a watch for a window into a world that was about to come crashing to an end in not much more than a decade or so later. Absolutely fascinating stuff. It might still be floating around on YouTube actually (that's where I saw it).

Its included on several of the BFI British Transport Films classic collections (both DVD and before that VHS) that are available - those collections are so good I've always considered them worth buying to own - assuming you have a DVD player of course. Some I think are free to view on BFI web player, tho I have not checked which.

 

[hexagon789]

Fully Fitted Freight is well worth a watch for a window into a world that was about to come crashing to an end in not much more than a decade or so later. Absolutely fascinating stuff. It might still be floating around on YouTube actually (that's where I saw it).



Oh that's very good too and well worth a watch. The story was by Arnold Ridley who would go on to play Godfrey in Dad's Army.

Indeed, and there was an earlier version (1931) he had more direct input on but that one is mostly lost, I think about 1/3 of the film survives unlike this version.

 

[WesternLancer]

Indeed, and there was an earlier version (1931) he had more direct input on but that one is mostly lost, I think about 1/3 of the film survives unlike this version.

what was the 1931 equivalent? something from the LMS film unit?

 

[Dr Hoo]

what was the 1931 equivalent? something from the LMS film unit?

I think he meant 'Ghost Train' not 'Fully Fitted Freight'.

 

[hexagon789]

what was the 1931 equivalent? something from the LMS film unit?

Just an earlier version of The Ghost Train by Gainsborough Pictures.

 

[Richard Scott]

Thanks for letting us know, I really enjoyed that. Surprised to see same loco used throughout, thought they regularly changed locos in steam days.

 

[WesternLancer]

Just an earlier version of The Ghost Train by Gainsborough Pictures.

ah - sorry I misunderstood which film was being referred to!

 

[Ashley Hill]

Talking Pictures TV often show BTF films but they tend to be the same ones over and over again. Perhaps it's a lisenceing thing. Terminus,Blue Pullman,Snow and Wild Wings together with Fully Fitted Freight seem to be the regular ones. You Tube has dozens of BTF films available for your perusal. From SeaSpeed hovercrafts to Highland Journey!

 

[Midnight Sun]

Talking Pictures TV often show BTF films but they tend to be the same ones over and over again. Perhaps it's a lisenceing thing. Terminus,Blue Pullman,Snow and Wild Wings together with Fully Fitted Freight seem to be the regular ones. You Tube has dozens of BTF films available for your perusal. From SeaSpeed hovercrafts to Highland Journey!

When you concide that this channel is broadcasted from a private house in a village near Watford, they do damm good job. Credit to Noel Cronin for saving so many films, programs that would have been losted for ever. BTF films are through collaboration with the Imperial War Museum, allowing them to show old movies and public information films from the public archives, as well as private films:

Inside Talking Pictures

 

[hexagon789]

ah - sorry I misunderstood which film was being referred to!

No worries!

Talking Pictures TV often show BTF films but they tend to be the same ones over and over again. Perhaps it's a lisenceing thing. Terminus,Blue Pullman,Snow and Wild Wings together with Fully Fitted Freight seem to be the regular ones. You Tube has dozens of BTF films available for your perusal. From SeaSpeed hovercrafts to Highland Journey!

It would be nice to see a greater range I agree, but they do quite a good job for what is essentially a small family-run outfit.

I still haven't seen a couple of the BTF they do screen mind you.

 

[70014IronDuke]

...
As a matter of interest, when would long distance freight like that depicted in the film have gone over to diesel haulage generally? Closer to 1960? And what sort of diesels would have been the typical motive power for a turn like that?

It would depend upon the area that any such train worked. If it was the GE, probably diesel by end 1962. In the case of the train in the film, I expect it could have been diagrammed for diesel from about 1963 (using Cl 45s), but likely to have steam turning up well into 64 and possibly 65. I'd say that by late 65 it would have been 100% diesel.

BICBW. I remember spending a day at Gloucester in August 65 and being surprised at the amount of steam on goods traffic on the Bristol line, and others may have more detailed knowledge of the Bristol scene.

 

[WesternLancer]

When you concide that this channel is broadcasted from a private house in a village near Watford, they do damm good job. Credit to Noel Cronin for saving so many films, programs that would have been losted for ever. BTF films are through collaboration with the Imperial War Museum, allowing them to show old movies and public information films from the public archives, as well as private films:

Inside Talking Pictures

Good points, however I think BTF films are in the care and copyright of the British Film Institute, not the IWM, as BFI took them on from BR at the end of BR. Minor point of course. IWM does have military film archives of course in its won extensive collection.

 

[Taunton]

I'm always surprised in films of this generation by the number of those doing heavy manual labour jobs who seem aged in their 60s.

 

[WesternLancer]

I'm always surprised in films of this generation by the number of those doing heavy manual labour jobs who seem aged in their 60s.

Yes, very good point. Although sometimes I fear they were a fair bit younger but just looked like they were in their 60s! Mind you, I suspect they had had working lives that required physical fitness at a high degree for a long time, and that may well help sustain your strength.

I also marvel at the energy people had from what were pretty meagre diets in terms of calorie intake, for many even on modest incomes, given food was significantly more costly as a proportion of income than it is now.

 

[Kingsbury Jn.]

I'm always surprised in films of this generation by the number of those doing heavy manual labour jobs who seem aged in their 60s.

Many were probably only in their 40's. Working life was far harder in those days. It aged them considerably.

 

[WesternLancer]

It would depend upon the area that any such train worked. If it was the GE, probably diesel by end 1962. In the case of the train in the film, I expect it could have been diagrammed for diesel from about 1963 (using Cl 45s), but likely to have steam turning up well into 64 and possibly 65. I'd say that by late 65 it would have been 100% diesel.

BICBW. I remember spending a day at Gloucester in August 65 and being surprised at the amount of steam on goods traffic on the Bristol line, and others may have more detailed knowledge of the Bristol scene.

Thanks IronDuke - interesting to read that and always fascinating to read the experiences of forum members who were 'there at the time' - appreciate your response. Cheers.

 

[Taunton]

In the case of the train in the film, I expect it could have been diagrammed for diesel from about 1963 (using Cl 45s), but likely to have steam turning up well into 64 and possibly 65. I'd say that by late 65 it would have been 100% diesel.

BICBW. I remember spending a day at Gloucester in August 65 and being surprised at the amount of steam on goods traffic on the Bristol line, and others may have more detailed knowledge of the Bristol scene.

Surprisingly, I don't recall that many 45s on freight on the Gloucester line in the 1960s, they seemed to stay steam hauled (4Fs, Black 5s, 8Fs, 9Fs) until about 1964-5, and then move straight on to Brush 4s and a surprising number of EE 3s (47s and 37s for our younger readers). The 45s did dominate passenger workings, apart from summer Saturdays, from quite early on, maybe by the end of 1961, with the odd Jubilee still here and there. Steam on WR freight through Taunton was pretty much cleared out by the arrival of the Hymeks by 1962, but these didn't work north of Bristol. I think the Bristol-Birmingham line was an early candidate for BR pattern AWS, whereas west of Bristol had longstanding GWR ATC, locos were not dual fitted, a lot of the power of the Birmingham line stayed LMR types (both steam and diesel), so there was long a definite divide at Bristol.

 

[70014IronDuke]

Surprisingly, I don't recall that many 45s on freight on the Gloucester line in the 1960s, they seemed to stay steam hauled (4Fs, Black 5s, 8Fs, 9Fs) until about 1964-5, and then move straight on to Brush 4s and a surprising number of EE 3s (47s and 37s for our younger readers). The 45s did dominate passenger workings, apart from summer Saturdays, from quite early on, maybe by the end of 1961, with the odd Jubilee still here and there. Steam on WR freight through Taunton was pretty much cleared out by the arrival of the Hymeks by 1962, but these didn't work north of Bristol. I think the Bristol-Birmingham line was an early candidate for BR pattern AWS, whereas west of Bristol had longstanding GWR ATC, locos were not dual fitted, a lot of the power of the Birmingham line stayed LMR types (both steam and diesel), so there was long a definite divide at Bristol.

I've just found my logbook for that day. It was 08 September, 1965.

Didcot MPD - 7904, 6928 (probably dumped)

Swindon - Gloucester - D826 (probably on shed? I don't think Warships worked to Gloucester) D7028, D 1680, D1025, D7023, D7064, D3108, 15100 (Southern shunter???), D2194, 4100 (2-6-2T?), 45392, 44264, 6160, D3992, 6113
(So still three GWR 2-6-2Ts - I can't remember these at all. I do remember the lovely scenes as the train wound itself out of Savernake Tunnel, however.)
85B Gloucester Shed (I forget if it was the ex LMS or ex GWR)

D6954, 82040 (Taunton has difficulties appreciating these lovely Standard 2-6-2Ts ), D1614, 92219, 82042 (another one!) 8745, 6857, 7814, 3643, 78006, D1667, D178, 92129, 80037, 41291, 92230, D3993, D2196, 48651, 3823, 4698, 3816, 92000, D1744. 82039 (oh, another beauty!), 44269, 90037, D1668, D4168, 6965

As I typed these out, I am staggered by a) the number of locos on the shed and b) by the variety. I had completely forgotten how many different classes of locos were there! A Grange, a Manor, several GWR 2-8-0s, an Ivatt 2-6-2T and not to mention those lovely Standard tanks . wow, we were still so rich in variety at such a late stage. I had forgotten.

Now, these are my spottings after returning to Gloucester Eastgate. This would have been from approx 12.00 noon to approx 15.30.

92213, D1656, 4689. D1697, D6914, D2138, D1815, D1661, 48291, 1693, 7802, 76039, D1651,
92231, D123, D37, 70024, D1615, D136, 48393, 78004, D1609, D1700, 92247, D1036, D7033, D1067

Leaving Gloucester 6876.

What an absolutley amazing variety of motive power, and so late in the day - not including DMUs, of course!

Taking into account Taunton's thoughts, I suspect that the LMR's policy was to dieselise the express passenger workings first of all - thereby ridding the railway of expensive-to-maintain 3 cylinder passenger locos ( Jubilees and Scots) and then slowly whittle down the steam on freight. Notice too that there were quite few 9Fs working that day - relatively modern heavy freight locos.

BTW, ISTR that on my way back to Goring and Streatley (my aunt lived in the latter village) there had been a derailment on the down relief, and the sleepers were rather cut up by the errant waggon. This was somewhere between Goring and Cholsey.

 

[Lloyds siding]

Yes, very good point. Although sometimes I fear they were a fair bit younger but just looked like they were in their 60s! Mind you, I suspect they had had working lives that required physical fitness at a high degree for a long time, and that may well help sustain your strength.

I also marvel at the energy people had from what were pretty meagre diets in terms of calorie intake, for many even on modest incomes, given food was significantly more costly as a proportion of income than it is now.

Indeed! Many of the workers in local industries on Merseyside in the 1960s did not survive beyond their 50s (they looked much older). However, so far as calories go for physical work: if you don't get the calories then you will shrink and die! Most people made up the calories with potatoes or bread. Another point is that then (and now), often the only option for work for people in their 60s is physical work (that younger people are unwilling to do), no one is going to train you for (new) computer tasks. (Speaking as a mid-60s worker who often works in hard physical jobs and/or in adverse weather; providing that your health and strength are OK..it's a job.)

 

[njamescouk]

Fully fitted is also on the BFI site at https://player.bfi.org.uk/free/film/watch-fully-fitted-freight-1957-online?play-film