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Bridge strike at Plymouth (30/08)

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61653 HTAFC

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That would certainly help. Or how about a dummy infill under the arch to redude the headroom to a constant height throught the bridge? Then it would be obvious how high the bridge is coming from the downhill side of the bridge.
How about glass tubes filled with mucky grease or red paint/dye, suspended on cables from the lower portal at the height of the upper portal. Any vehicle too high for the whole bridge will smash the tubes and have the grease or paint spread over their windscreen. Good luck explaining that to your boss!
 
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zwk500

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How about glass tubes filled with mucky grease or red paint/dye, suspended on cables from the lower portal at the height of the upper portal. Any vehicle too high for the whole bridge will smash the tubes and have the grease or paint spread over their windscreen. Good luck explaining that to your boss!
And then the lorry can't move out of the way until the tow truck comes, because the driver can't see where he or she is going. Not to mention the impact on other motorists coming down the hill who unexpectedly find the road covered in grease, heading towards a crossroads!

A laser-activated flashing sign, followed by a chain/bar hanging down over the road to cause a big bang should be sufficient. As most have said, no professional driver goes looking to wedge their lorry under a bridge. You don't have to turn them into a kid's afternoon TV show and cover them in gunk to stop them.
 

RPI

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Indeed but the negligible seating difference between is hardly relevant here as I haven't seen many 9 car instead of 10 car IET's, whereas there have been plenty of 5 car trains from Paddington through to Penzance. Is this what you mean by 9 vice 10? There have been many more 9 and 10 car formations as you rightly point out but that has been necessary for a while now.
I've seen about 3 or 4 5 car sets going to Penzance in the past few weeks and I work on the things every day? Most of the time any short formations of 5 cars have been swapped onto the Exeter terminators for which a 5 car is more than adequate.
 

Dai Corner

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I've seen about 3 or 4 5 car sets going to Penzance in the past few weeks and I work on the things every day? Most of the time any short formations of 5 cars have been swapped onto the Exeter terminators for which a 5 car is more than adequate.
Bristol and Cardiff are suffering more than Plymouth because of the stock shortage; their frequencies have been halved in addition to any short-forming.
 

The exile

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While you can’t penalise someone for not using something ( unless there is a requirement todo so) - you can for using something inappropriately. Quite apart from that, my own opinion is that commercial Hgv drivers should be required to have something like route knowledge ( not necessarily in their head - an hgv satiable would be fine)
 

RPI

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Bristol and Cardiff are suffering more than Plymouth because of the stock shortage; their frequencies have been halved in addition to any short-forming.
Agreed, however the original reply was regarding Plymouth, the West of England services have been incredibly busy of late due to the whole nation deciding to holiday in Cornwall it seems
 

Robertj21a

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While you can’t penalise someone for not using something ( unless there is a requirement todo so) - you can for using something inappropriately. Quite apart from that, my own opinion is that commercial Hgv drivers should be required to have something like route knowledge ( not necessarily in their head - an hgv satiable would be fine)
What, for every road in the UK?
- you do realise that many lorry drivers cover totally different routes much of the time ?
 

Neo9320

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Or perhaps maybe measuring the maximum height of the unit before leaving the depot??? Just a thought…
 

Sean Emmett

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Or perhaps maybe measuring the maximum height of the unit before leaving the depot??? Just a thought…
They have to with steam locos, to make sure coal well trimmed and not foul of loading gauge. Esp if to run under 25kV wires...
 

geoffk

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I see that XC is still running to/from Totnes only. Do we still have single-line working across the bridge? Not sure if GWR is running a full service but it seems so from RTT.
 

Deafdoggie

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They usually are. But people are human and sometimes it's measured incorrectly or recorded incorrectly. If the height the driver is given fits under the bridge then it's not their fault if it doesn't fit. I've never seen an MOT tester check the height label actually has the correct height on it.
 

Neo9320

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They usually are. But people are human and sometimes it's measured incorrectly or recorded incorrectly. If the height the driver is given fits under the bridge then it's not their fault if it doesn't fit. I've never seen an MOT tester check the height label actually has the correct height on it.
Food for though. I’m not a driver so obviously know not the ins and outs of things, but it would seem to me that something like that really should be on the mot. Almost screams safety critical.
 

The exile

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What, for every road in the UK?
- you do realise that many lorry drivers cover totally different routes much of the time ?
“Some sort of “ doesn’t mean the same as railway route knowledge. Appropriate satnav will do - as will a pre- agreed/ checked route which is “signed off@ by someone who will carry the can. That should ensure that no hgv is scheduled on a route for which it is unsuitable, leaving just the unexpected diversions.
 

61653 HTAFC

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Food for though. I’m not a driver so obviously know not the ins and outs of things, but it would seem to me that something like that really should be on the mot. Almost screams safety critical.
Thing with a lot of wagons though, is that when fully laden they can sit a few inches lower on the springs than when empty. In theory this could mean that a route to a construction site that involves a low bridge might be fine for the loads going in but not for the empties going out!
 
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Thing with a lot of wagons though, is that when fully laden they can sit a few inches lower on the springs than when empty. In theory this could mean that a route to a construction site that involves a low bridge might be fine for the loads going in but not for the empties going out!
That's very marginal though and it it was a hit when empty it would be bloody close when full, close enough to make me uncomfortable if it does just fit.

he up Line is still shown as "Line Shut" on Open Train Times (https://www.opentraintimes.com/maps/signalling/exeter).
Update on this: As of 16:35, the line remains shut according to Open Time Trains (which isn't always the most accurate but still). I heard somewhere that it's due to open at around 10pm tonight, but as far as I'm aware it's not guaranteed as of yet.
 

61653 HTAFC

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That's very marginal though and it it was a hit when empty it would be bloody close when full, close enough to make me uncomfortable if it does just fit.
No more so than the difference caused by surface-dressing or resurfacing, which is frequently cited as a reason not to blame the road vehicle drivers.

Personally I'd want at least 6" of wiggle room if I was driving under a low bridge, but I probably wouldn't be hired in that case because I'd be considered "too cautious".
 
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No more so than the difference caused by surface-dressing or resurfacing, which is frequently cited as a reason not to blame the road vehicle drivers.
They are two very differant situations though. The height of a vehicle due to loading is a vehicle issue and therefore down to the operator, the road surface is purely down to local councils and if there is a change the sinage should be updated accordingly.

Adding to this, I wonder how many sings there are that have been up since say the 70's that have seen several resurfacings. The road could be 5 - 6 inches higher than what the sign says.
 

61653 HTAFC

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They are two very differant situations though. The height of a vehicle due to loading is a vehicle issue and therefore down to the operator, the road surface is purely down to local councils and if there is a change the sinage should be updated accordingly.

Adding to this, I wonder how many sings there are that have been up since say the 70's that have seen several resurfacings. The road could be 5 - 6 inches higher than what the sign says.
Different in terms of liability, but not in terms of the end result. Certainly there should be better management of signage to ensure it is updated as soon as any changes take place. There does seem to be a significant section of the haulage industry with a cavalier attitude to low bridges though. I recall a thread several years ago where an LGV driver boasted about how he "knew" that the signage gave a lower height limit than was actually there. It wouldn't surprise me if the more cautious drivers find themselves being ridiculed by their comrades... that doesn't seem to be a culture that has been allowed to take root on the railway.
 
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Different in terms of liability, but not in terms of the end result. Certainly there should be better management of signage to ensure it is updated as soon as any changes take place. There does seem to be a significant section of the haulage industry with a cavalier attitude to low bridges though. I recall a thread several years ago where an LGV driver boasted about how he "knew" that the signage gave a lower height limit than was actually there. It wouldn't surprise me if the more cautious drivers find themselves being ridiculed by their comrades... that doesn't seem to be a culture that has been allowed to take root on the railway.
That's because the railway has been beat down with very strict safety methods since privatisation where as other industries (like road haulage, house building etc) haven't had such a massive beat down (well they have to an extent but we get away with it). H&S is great but when it makes the job harder there comes a point when something needs to be done.
 

Deafdoggie

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Or perhaps maybe measuring the maximum height of the unit before leaving the depot??? Just a thought…

Food for though. I’m not a driver so obviously know not the ins and outs of things, but it would seem to me that something like that really should be on the mot. Almost screams safety critical.
They check there is a height sign in the cab. But not that it's the correct height!
 

Ediswan

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I recall a thread several years ago where an LGV driver boasted about how he "knew" that the signage gave a lower height limit than was actually there.
And they would be correct. As a safety margin, the signed height is always at least 3" or 0.08 m less than the measured height. BUT, drivers are not supposed to intentionally take advantage of that safety margin.
 

61653 HTAFC

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And they would be correct. As a safety margin, the signed height is always at least 3" or 0.08 m less than the measured height. BUT, drivers are not supposed to intentionally take advantage of that safety margin.
Which is entirely my point- that margin of error is there for a number of reasons, not least the variations in actual vehicle height caused by things like loading, tyre pressure and any number of other factors. Being "correct" in this case is a Phyrric victory if you end up wedged, or (unlikely though it is) stopped by a random check that shows you've ignored a posted height restriction.

Can you imagine the uproar on here if a type of train was used on a route it hadn't been gauge-cleared for? Even if it narrowly turns out to fit through all the structures.
 

Annetts key

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The plan is for Single Line Working to be withdrawn overnight Friday/Saturday 3rd/4th September.
At the same time, the Up Main will reopen at 5mph at first, and if all is well, this will be increased to 20mph.
The speed restriction on the Down Main will be lifted and running at line speed can resume.

On Saturday/Sunday night, the speed restriction on the Up Main will be lifted and it will return to line speed.
 

adc82140

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I had an interesting chat with a receptionist at the Newton Abbot Premier Inn last night. She said that on Monday people were turning up on spec with the hope of getting a room, and they helped as many as they could but filled up quickly. By mid evening her attempts at calling round other hotels for vacancies were returning no results. Local taxis were asking upwards of £150 for a trip to Plymouth.
 

EbbwJunction1

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I had an interesting chat with a receptionist at the Newton Abbot Premier Inn last night. She said that on Monday people were turning up on spec with the hope of getting a room, and they helped as many as they could but filled up quickly. By mid evening her attempts at calling round other hotels for vacancies were returning no results. Local taxis were asking upwards of £150 for a trip to Plymouth.
It did cross my mind to stay in Totnes on Monday night, but it wasn't practical for a number of reasons.

I'd also previously been quoted upwards of £90 for a room in one of the hotels well before the actual trip, as I had been thinking of making it a two day rather than a one day trip. As there aren't that many hotels in Totnes to start with, I also thought that there was a good chance that they'd become fully booked very quickly, so decided that it wasn't a practical proposition, especially as I had to get to work on the Tuesday morning.

I paid £80 for my taxi from Totnes to Exeter, which was a discounted rate. A fare of £150 from Newton Abbot to Plymouth is, whilst it sounds like a lot - and is, if you're faced with a bill all of a sudden - quite possibly okay. One thing to bear in mind is that a driver who takes a long distance trip is out of service both for the outward journey and for the return one, because they wouldn't be allowed to take a fare back and would have to return empty.
 
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