Bus with Shortest working lives

[delt1c]

We all know of the Wullfarians and their short working lives. But was wondering of others , both single vehicles and classes ( excluding demonstrators) . For example Eastern Scottish had several Leylands which were sold or transferred to other operators after 1year

 

[CBlue]

At the height of minibus mania in the mid 1980s Cambus bought a batch of Sherpa minibuses, DxxxKVA registrations if I remember right. Some of them, despite being brand new, never entered service as they were so unreliable..

 

[GusB]

Northern Scottish's double-deck MCW Metroliners had fairly short lives with their original owner, being transferred to Western in 1989 - the newest was only 3 years old. They had gone from there by 1992.

The single-decks lasted a bit longer, but disappeared around the time of the Stagecoach buyout in 1991 - a lifespan of only 5-7 years.

 

[Statto]

MCW collaboration with Scania that brought the single deck Metro-Scania & double deck version Metropolitan, didn't last long with there original operators, GMPTE sold all there Metropolitans when they reached 7 years old, Merseyside, Tyne & Wear & a couple of municipals kept there's the longest, Merseyside Metropolitans lasted until 1985, Hull corporation brought some Merseyside Metropolitans

 

[Statto]

Northern Scottish's double-deck MCW Metroliners had fairly short lives with their original owner, being transferred to Western in 1989 - the newest was only 3 years old. They had gone from there by 1992.

The single-decks lasted a bit longer, but disappeared around the time of the Stagecoach buyout in 1991 - a lifespan of only 5-7 years.

I have one of the buses yearbooks that has a chapter on MCW, featuring the Metroliners, & apparently the Metroliners were seen as often parked up on the hard shoulder of a Motorway waiting for a fitter as they were in the fast lane.

 

[route101]

Lothian electrics? Are they coming back ? The plaxton coaches?

 

[MotCO]

Surely any buses bought for DRT schemes

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

United Auto Leyland National 3102 LUP902T. Delivered in July 1979, entered service, destroyed with a number of other vehicles in Durham depot fire about 3 days later. However, beaten by three brand new Atlanteans delivered in 1976 to Trent’s Derby depot and caught up in that depot fire. 571 was damaged but was famously rebodied with a bizarre Willowbrook body but 573 and 577 were destroyed without entering service! Don’t know if that constitutes a working career? Think Southdown lost some nearly new VRs at Hove in a fire - depots fires very seemingly common in the 1970s/

Of course, there were plenty of examples of changing views and requirements leading to whole tranches of vehicles being withdrawn. London were experts with AEC Merlins and DMS class Fleetlines all going early - the first Fleetlines were scrapped at 9 years old. London Country were withdrawing Leyland Nationals at 7 years old. With MAP schemes and single deckers going out of style, many NBC firms withdrew Leyland Nationals, Bristol LHs and REs, and assorted Ford single decks prematurely as well. Seem to recall that NBC bought quite a number of Duple bodied Ford R1014 buses and many went in five years!

 

[scosutsut]

Lothian electrics? Are they coming back ? The plaxton coaches?

The coaches have multiple use cases - what they were bought for if the EX2 restarts, ECB X7 would take them happily, Motorcoaches fleet, Citylink work should they be able/willing to take it again.

Harder to be positive about the milk floats though! Candidates for worst purchase ever competition?

 

[86247]

I've never seen a metro - scania single decker or a metropolitan but I've been watching old you vids and both look amazing. The DMS fleetline's I've always liked them they had quite short lives with london transport dont know why, as they were brought by many operators who wanted omo buses.

 

[Statto]

Maintenance was an issue with the DMS Fleetlines, parts became defective sooner than the half cab buses, plus maintenance costs too much higher, plus the LT specifications, when they were brought by other operators, the operators requested they'd be stripped of LT specifications before buying them second hand, & thus became popular after d-reg with so many available.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

I've never seen a metro - scania single decker or a metropolitan but I've been watching old you vids and both look amazing. The DMS fleetline's I've always liked them they had quite short lives with london transport dont know why, as they were brought by many operators who wanted omo buses.

Metro Scanias and Metropolitans were both extremely heavy on fuel (hence why LT withdrew theirs) and also highly susceptible to corrosion. Leicester and Newport both kept theirs going longer than most firms.

DMS Fleetlines famously were bought but the maintenance practices locally (at depots) and centrally (at Aldenham) were geared up to handling RTs, RFs and RMs rather than more modern designs where bodies couldn't be swapped. Many subsequent buyers were very happy with them, despite some London specifications.

 

[Statto]

Didn't some of the DMS Fleetlines ended up having a longer spell with a second operator than LT.

Funnily enough, late 80s LT set up a couple of low cost operations, Harrow Buses & Bexleybus, & LT ended up buying back some DMS Fleetlines for Bexleybus.

 

[86247]

could some kind person explain what the difference is between the DMS and the B20 fleetline as on Wikipedia it says the last 400 of london's were B20 models.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

could some kind person explain what the difference is between the DMS and the B20 fleetline as on Wikipedia it says the last 400 of london's were B20 models.

From the superb http://www.countrybus.org/DMS/DMS2.htm

“London Transport was ahead of noise-limitation legislation with the B20. One of the public criticisms of the DMS had been the noise inside, whether they were powered by Leyland O.680 or Gardner engines. The B20 was fitted with a quietening kit, with a turbocharged engine fed with air through a cowl drawn through a cowl where the offside cosmetic hood had been. Air from the cooler group exited by a cowl on the nearside. The asymmetric cowls increased the bus length by 6cm, and reduced the width of the rear saloon window. This in turn was fitted with a magnifier to widen the angle of view. They went into service at Bexleyheath in March 1978, with great expectations. But they were short-lived. It seemed that the B20 was no more reliable than the earlier "Standards". One additional problem was created by the filler for the power steering, which was high inside the cowl above the engine. The sight-glass was difficult to see, and the inevitable overfilling was dealt with by a drip tray. But when that overflowed oil dripped onto a hot engine. Bad news!”

 

[86247]

The B20 sounds worse then the standard DMS, did the other companies who bought them have much difficulty with them as much as LT did. If memory serves me right maynes of Manchester had both types always tried to have a ride on one when I was in Manchester.

 

[awsnews]

SPT haven't got a good track record here, first with the electric CVE Omnis which I don't believe were ever used in passenger service and more recently the LoBus Renaults bought for MyBus duties. They departed quite early on as well. Then there were the hybrid E200s and the one off converted hybrid Solo.

 

[6Gman]

I've never seen a metro - scania single decker or a metropolitan but I've been watching old you vids and both look amazing. The DMS fleetline's I've always liked them they had quite short lives with london transport dont know why, as they were brought by many operators who wanted omo buses.

The Metro-Scanias and the Metropolitans were both very impressive from a passenger point of view. Less so for the operators!

The DMS had short lives in London because (depending on your viewpoint) they were unable to cope with the special circumstances of London OR London's exceptionalism led to their being ditched as "not invented here".

 

[Jordan Adam]

The coaches have multiple use cases - what they were bought for if the EX2 restarts, ECB X7 would take them happily, Motorcoaches fleet, Citylink work should they be able/willing to take it again.

Fully agree regarding the X7, but the Leopards would be no use on Citylink the mileage would kill them fast.

 

[carlberry]

With MAP schemes and single deckers going out of style, many NBC firms withdrew Leyland Nationals, Bristol LHs and REs, and assorted Ford single decks prematurely as well.

Most of Bristol Omnibuses LHs didnt last long enough for the paint to dry before being sent off to other companies!

 

[carlberry]

The DMS had short lives in London because (depending on your viewpoint) they were unable to cope with the special circumstances of London OR London's exceptionalism led to their being ditched as "not invented here".

Oddly after having certain London specific features removed they managed to serve out new lines in quiet places like Birmingham, Hong Kong and, er, London (Bexley Bus)!

 

[jammy36]

Plymouth City Transport made a number of purchases that had short lives. These include

Leyland Nationals - a large number (around 60) of dual door Leyland Nationals arrived between 1972 and 1974. Few listed more than six years or so with Plymouth before being disposed and some I believe went straight for scrap.

Leyland Olympians - Plymouth had been a long term Leyland customer and for many years operated an all Leyland fleet. Large numbers of Atlanteans had been purchased, but with the end of their production looming Plymouth took three Olympians in 1982. For whatever reason the Olympian and the corporation were not happy bedfellows and all three were fairly quickly disposed of (sold to Stevensons either in 1985 or 88). Amazingly, despite such short lives they carried three liveries with Plymouth, being delivered in traditional Plymouth City Transport colours, then the first Plymouth Citybus livery and then Plymouth's black Citybus scheme!

VW LT31 - three were purchased in 1985, saw very little use and then sold to Truronian in 1988.
Those with better memories may be able to expand/correct.

 

[busesrusuk]

A few types have not excelled, the Marshall minibus was one. At the time it was the only sub 9m low floor midibus available and an umber entered service in London but didn't last long at all. A number of them self combusted fairly quickly. Another more recent type with few fans is/was the Plaxton Primo minibus.

The Metroplitans were great buses but suffered from serious corrosion and, as has been said up thread, were heavy on fuel. London's 164 examples didn't last long, mainly due to the lack of spare parts as well as the corrosion issues. I remember the sad sight of three year old buses parked up in Kingston coal yard stripped of bits to keep the remaining members of the fleet on the road. They did however find ready buyers when LT sold then off (Reading and Whippet Coaches spring to mind)

 

[Snow1964]

United Auto Leyland National 3102 LUP902T. Delivered in July 1979, entered service, destroyed with a number of other vehicles in Durham depot fire about 3 days later. However, beaten by three brand new Atlanteans delivered in 1976 to Trent’s Derby depot and caught up in that depot fire. 571 was damaged but was famously rebodied with a bizarre Willowbrook body but 573 and 577 were destroyed without entering service! Don’t know if that constitutes a working career? Think Southdown lost some nearly new VRs at Hove in a fire - depots fires very seemingly common in the 1970s/

I think Western Greyhound had a fire (arson) in May 2013.
I think it was reported that 2 destroyed buses were brand new (might have been solos)

 

[Statto]

The other thing with the DMS Fleetline, the LT depots & Aldenham was set up for the Routemasters & half cab buses, they also couldn't remove the body from the chassis like the Routemasters when giving them an maintenance overhaul.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

I think Western Greyhound had a fire (arson) in May 2013.
I think it was reported that 2 destroyed buses were brand new (might have been solos)

2 x 2011 Solo SRs were the newest vehicles lost IIRC

 

[overthewater]

Has anyone mentioned the Tayside Bristol VRT with Alexander body? They were not happy with them and within 3 years started selling them off.

 

[carlberry]

Has anyone mentioned the Tayside Bristol VRT with Alexander body? They were not happy with them and within 3 years started selling them off.

Positively long term compared with how long the SBG kept their VRs back in the day (Swapped with NBC for FLFs).

 

[cnjb8]

London's Citaro artics had quite a short life in comparison to other London fleets. Some GoAhead London buses don't last long, GALs Alexander ALX400, Plaxton President and East Lancs Myllenium Vykings come to mind. Transdev London got a batch of East Lancs Olympus vehicles in 2007, but I think they failed a tilt test and were not used.
Two First West of England StreetDecks were pinched by First Eastern Counties after three years. While First Manchester disposed of some StreetLites to Leicester after a year of use.
TrentBartons Optare Tempo SRs only survived five years before being sold to Ipswich Buses, which was a relief for i4 passengers. The Mercedes-Benz Citaros used on Skylink Derby are also leaving too, some of them have lasted just three years.

 

[busesrusuk]

The Plaxton president bodied Volvo B7's lasted nearly 20 years with Go Ahead London. The Plaxton bodied Tridents went quicker but were essentially non-standard as the fleet was fairly standardised on the Volvo B7 at the time.