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Northern Class 195: Construction/Introduction Updates

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pemma

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There are places where 158s are banned but 156s not. I don't know if that's true of Ormskirk, but it is of the Conwy Valley (yes, I know it's ATW now, it used to be FNW! :) ) and I believe the Cumbrian Coast.

None I can think of, though, where all 23m stock is banned - limiting to 20m is a Sarfeast thing, isn't it? :)

With 158s ATW were told by Network Rail they can't use them on Borderlands or Conwy if they want to keep the existing timetable they have based on using 75mph 150s. That's because the 158s will need longer dwell times and they won't be able to get between stations faster by running at 90mph due to the line speeds not allowing it.
 
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Mordac

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I've just had the pleasure of travelling in a NIR Class 3000, and if the 195s are anything like them, they will be an amazing step change for the Northern franchise. I've never travelled on a DMU where the aircon noise is louder than the engine! It's also got nice windows and is bright interiors. The only negative were the seats, which were a bit too hard.
 

61653 HTAFC

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I too am unaware of anywhere on the Northern network with restrictions on C3 vehicles. There are certain areas where certain units are barred or at least discouraged: Buxton can't take 142s because of a tunnel which has clearance issues, and I believe 150s are not considered suitable for the Durham Coast due to curvature of some platforms- though I think door positions and resultant gap between the train and platform is the problem there, rather than a gauging thing.
 

Bletchleyite

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With 158s ATW were told by Network Rail they can't use them on Borderlands or Conwy if they want to keep the existing timetable they have based on using 75mph 150s. That's because the 158s will need longer dwell times and they won't be able to get between stations faster by running at 90mph due to the line speeds not allowing it.

They are also banned on the Conwy Valley because they will clout things, AIUI. Slowing the irregular timetable would not be a massive issue, and dwell of 158s is in any case no different to 153s, or the 156s that FNW used to use.
 

Bletchleyite

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I've just had the pleasure of travelling in a NIR Class 3000, and if the 195s are anything like them, they will be an amazing step change for the Northern franchise. I've never travelled on a DMU where the aircon noise is louder than the engine! It's also got nice windows and is bright interiors. The only negative were the seats, which were a bit too hard.

Northern aren't taking the standard CAF seats (I think TPE are) so this won't be an issue.
 

pemma

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I thought it was the LEAN one, wasn't it? Might be wrong though.

There's been conflicting reports by the time replacement seats for 158s have also been suggested and replacement seats for 158s don't have to be the same type as the seats for the CAF trains. There was definitely one report that they decided the best option would be the least popular seat with extra padding.

Regarding the TPE sets I thought the 397s are a revised version of what First were going to introduce had they been awarded the West Coast franchise and the mk5s are effectively a non-sleeper version of the stock ordered for the Scottish sleepers, so hopefully they'll be more Intercity style than the NI stock.
 

Bletchleyite

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There's been conflicting reports by the time replacement seats for 158s have also been suggested and replacement seats for 158s don't have to be the same type as the seats for the CAF trains. There was definitely one report that they decided the best option would be the least popular seat with extra padding.

That suggests the ironing board, but with the contoured base that ScotRail have used on the Hitachi EMUs, which having sat on both when put on show in Edinburgh does make a *massive* comfort difference.
 

mikemcniven

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Hey all, First images of the new Northern rolling stock been built at CAF has been put on YouTube by Northern, with the first body shells painted.

[youtube]Mx2sDaCe1Fg[/youtube]
 

LNW-GW Joint

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There are some technical details in this Railway Gazette article which I don't remember seeing before: http://www.railwaygazette.com/news/...cement-multiple-units-under-construction.html

The DMUs will have 390kW Rolls-Royce MTU Series 1800 PowerPacks with 6H 1800 R85L engines.
These will comply with EU Stage IIIB emissions regulations, using built-in selective catalytic reduction to reduce the amount of nitrogen oxide produced
...
Leasing company Eversholt Rail
Manufacturer CAF
Running gear and bogies CAF
Doors IFE
Seats Fainsa
Couplers Dellner
Powerpack Rolls-Royce MTU
Transmission and final drive ZF
EMU transformer ABB
EMU traction motors Traktionssysteme Austria
 

Bornin1980s

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Well that video is certainly a development regarding news of the new trains! However, there appears to be an error, early on. It states that there would be 55 new electrics, and 43 new diesel trains. Everything else I have read stated that it's the other way round, 55 diesels and 43 electrics. Now, given the current excess of electrics compared to diesels nationwide, and the impending demise of the Pacers, even that figure still looks disproportionately electric!

I see they have chosen to retain yellow ends on this fleet. Makes sense, it not only looks good with the new livery, but should ease quick acceptance. Again, this would be most important for the diesels, given the high a risk of a diesel train shortage. I see a very slight redesign in the artist's impression, however. Previous impressions showed small grills at the inner ends of the light clusters. A minor, even old-fashioned styling feature I know, but it did give the trains a somewhat more distinct look. It also resembles some old Japanese cars, from the Honda Prelude to the Toyota Space Cruiser! Still, I don't like useless cosmetic grills as styling features, so if they are not needed it's best to leave them out.

I am disappointed, however, to read that these come with Fainsa seats. According to a Modern Railways report, The FISA LEAN seat was the clear winner in a survey with regards to comfort. I was hoping we might finally see a train seat which was a little softer than before, rather than harder. Still, there is someone on the Greater Anglia threads who seems to hate the FISA seats more than anything!
 
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LNW-GW Joint

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I see they have chosen to retain yellow ends on this fleet. Makes sense, it not only looks good with the new livery, but should ease quick acceptance.

Why should it make any difference to acceptance?
The ends can be any colour the TOC likes, given adequate headlights.
That particular tick list item has vanished.
 

pemma

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Well that video is certainly a development regarding news of the new trains! However, there appears to be an error, early on. It states that there would be 55 new electrics, and 43 new diesel trains. Everything else I have read stated that it's the other way round, 55 diesels and 43 electrics. Now, given the current excess of electrics compared to diesels nationwide, and the impending demise of the Pacers, even that figure still looks disproportionately electric!

Probably just an admin error that's gone unnoticed.
 

Bornin1980s

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That suggests the ironing board, but with the contoured base that ScotRail have used on the Hitachi EMUs, which having sat on both when put on show in Edinburgh does make a *massive* comfort difference.

Is that more comfortable, or less?
 

pemma

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Is that more comfortable, or less?

In the context it's been said in that suggests more comfortable. However, it should be noted based on his other posts Bletchleyite seems to be find hard seating more acceptable than other passengers.
 

pemma

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Where does it say that?

It doesn't say that in the article - I gave the link to it because it shows the new interiors for the Scotrail 156s. Rail Gazette says Fainsa will be supplying the seats and Northern's 'customer experience' team have effectively confirmed the interiors will be almost identical to the Scotrail 156s which have new Fainsa seats.
 

LNW-GW Joint

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It doesn't say that in the article - I gave the link to it because it shows the new interiors for the Scotrail 156s. Rail Gazette says Fainsa will be supplying the seats and Northern's 'customer experience' team have effectively confirmed the interiors will be almost identical to the Scotrail 156s which have new Fainsa seats.

And no doubt Northern's own refurbished 156s?
Presumably they'll find a moquette without saltires. ;)
 

1179_Clee2

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Platform 5's NEW 2018 pocket book now has coach numbers in addition to unit numbers

195 001 to 025 (2 car) 101001 to 101025 / 103001 to 103025
195 101 to 130 (3 car) 101101 to 101130 / 102101 to 102130 / 103101 to 103130
331 001 to 031 (3 car) 463001 to 463031 / 464001 to 464031 / 466001 to 466031
331 101 to 112 (4 car) 463101 to 463112 / 464101 to 464112 / 465101 to 465112 / 466101 to 466112

Anybody got any updates on how CAF are doing??
 

skyhigh

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Platform 5's NEW 2018 pocket book now has coach numbers in addition to unit numbers

195 001 to 025 (2 car) 101001 to 101025 / 103001 to 103025
195 101 to 130 (3 car) 101101 to 101130 / 102101 to 102130 / 103101 to 103130
331 001 to 031 (3 car) 463001 to 463031 / 464001 to 464031 / 466001 to 466031
331 101 to 112 (4 car) 463101 to 463112 / 464101 to 464112 / 465101 to 465112 / 466101 to 466112

Anybody got any updates on how CAF are doing??
In the latest customer report, Northern states that "Our first new train is nearing completion at the CAF factory in Spain", if that's of any help.
 

D365

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331 001 to 031 (3 car) 463001 to 463031 / 464001 to 464031 / 466001 to 466031
331 101 to 112 (4 car) 463101 to 463112 / 464101 to 464112 / 465101 to 465112 / 466101 to 466112

Very curious that they are choosing carriage numbers from a range where the class of train (465/1) is in full revenue service.
 

Domh245

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Very curious that they are choosing carriage numbers from a range where the class of train (465/1) is in full revenue service.

Not an issue of course, as the 465/1 fleet starts at 151 and runs to 197. And as seen with the DMSOs of the 3 car class 385s, duplication of unit and vehicle numbers seemingly isn't an issue
 

dubscottie

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Very curious that they are choosing carriage numbers from a range where the class of train (465/1) is in full revenue service.

Should not be an issue for humans to work out.

Vehicle numbers and unit numbers are two different things.

Saying that TransLink added 8000 to NIR train numbers to stop the computer rostering trains on bus services!
 
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