Caledonian Sleeper

[SteveM70]

There are of course other modes of transport. It's only really London commuting where driving is not a feasible option, for instance, and for longer journeys you've got air too, often at a very competitive price.

Blimey. I live 25 miles from Manchester - commuting by train is (timetabled) about 35 minutes, driving is a minimum of 90 minutes unless you leave at silly o’clock, and the train fare is broadly equal to fuel plus parking. And however bad Northern get, I find them less stressful than peak hour city centre driving

 

[Leisurefirst]

I couldn't check availability and fares yesterday and today (kept getting spinning circle etc after entering dates and passengers continually.)
Spoke to customer service just now apparently problem with railcards.
It worked without selecting a railcard.
Have to call back to book with a railcard.

 

[Chris999999]

These trains were built by CAF trains I believe. They are going to build new long distance trains for NSW Trainlink. I am wondering how they will stand up to the 1000s of miles of extremely rough track in NSW Australia. The track has been enough to crack frames on XPT/HST units that are now 40 years old.

Also I am left wondering how good the aircon system will be on these CAF trains and weather it can handle up to 50 Degrees in the shade temperature.

Clever misuse of "weather".

 

[gazthomas]

I was on the lowland to Glasgow last night. Arrived on time. There still seem to be snagging issues though, lost lighting in the club car at one point and no water in my friends coach, much to his annoyance

 

[alangla]

We are talking about the sleeper. If you want to reduce car use for enviromental reasons, then it is desirable to use alternative modes of transport to driving, which are going to be trains. One big advantage of the sleeper over alternatives is the ability for someone in SE England to do a weekend backpacking trip in the Scottish Highlands, starting and finishing at different locations, something that is a lot harder to do (or impractical) using planes.

Why harder? EasyJet, BA and FlyBe serve all the same end-points as the sleeper, except Fort William. The coach from Fort William even stops at Glasgow Airport, though I grant you, it’s not possible to leave Fort William after 7pm & arrive in Central London by 9. For all the others, an early arrival in London would be possible, even Dundee via Stansted.

Correction- it actually is possible from Fort William- 1910 coach to Glasgow (2212) for an early bus to the airport or just go to the airport in the evening & sleep in the Holiday Inn/Express on site

 

[Norther Monkey]

Also I am left wondering how good the aircon system will be on these CAF trains and weather it can handle up to 50 Degrees in the shade temperature.

Keeping the carriage (too) cold certainly hasn't been an issue in the seats so far.

 

[Bald Rick]

We are talking about the sleeper. If you want to reduce car use for enviromental reasons, then it is desirable to use alternative modes of transport to driving, which are going to be trains. One big advantage of the sleeper over alternatives is the ability for someone in SE England to do a weekend backpacking trip in the Scottish Highlands, starting and finishing at different locations, something that is a lot harder to do (or impractical) using planes.

It really isn’t impractical to do using planes. My last weekend walking trip was arrive at Glasgow, hire car, drive to the west highlands, walk all weekend, drive to Inverness, head home. Courtesy of EasyJet and Enterprise it was cheaper than a sleeper by a mile.

 

[MrEd]

So is the 73 providing any power or is it just a translator

The 73/9 definitely provides power for the electric train supply and I’d have thought that as Class 67s and 73/9s have multiple working compatibility through the AAR system, they would both be providing traction power. I’m sure that 67s and 73/9s have worked in multiple on the Inverness portion before.

 

[BRX]

It really isn’t impractical to do using planes. My last weekend walking trip was arrive at Glasgow, hire car, drive to the west highlands, walk all weekend, drive to Inverness, head home. Courtesy of EasyJet and Enterprise it was cheaper than a sleeper by a mile.

Did you manage to do all that and have a full day of work on the friday & monday?
It's not necessarily impractical but some might say it's more of a driving & walking weekend, rather than a walking weekend.

 

[TimboM]

The 73/9 definitely provides power for the electric train supply and I’d have thought that as Class 67s and 73/9s have multiple working compatibility through the AAR system, they would both be providing traction power. I’m sure that 67s and 73/9s have worked in multiple on the Inverness portion before.

67004 + 73971 have been working in multi - the 73/9 is providing traction as well as ETH and just a mere 4,800hp on a Load 8

 

[Bald Rick]

Did you manage to do all that and have a full day of work on the friday & monday?
It's not necessarily impractical but some might say it's more of a driving & walking weekend, rather than a walking weekend.

Yes, albeit a bit stiffly on Monday morning!

To be fair I’ve done it more often by day train on the way up - train north after work, either a lift or late hire car to ‘base camp’ that night, or overnight in Glasgow or Edinburgh and an early hire car straight to the hills. However the late flights back from Glasgow, Edinburgh and Inverness are terribly convenient, usually cheap, and have me in my own bed well before midnight Sunday.

I’ve done this about a dozen times. I have also tried the sleeper (new and old) for the journey north, and it gives little if any extra time on the hills, and has the disadvantage of a day on the hills feeling half asleep, which isn’t necessarily a good idea.

 

[31160]

The 73/9 definitely provides power for the electric train supply and I’d have thought that as Class 67s and 73/9s have multiple working compatibility through the AAR system, they would both be providing traction power. I’m sure that 67s and 73/9s have worked in multiple on the Inverness portion before.

Excellent many thanks

 

[Failed Unit]

I’ve done this about a dozen times. I have also tried the sleeper (new and old) for the journey north, and it gives little if any extra time on the hills, and has the disadvantage of a day on the hills feeling half asleep, which isn’t necessarily a good idea.

I must admit for business, I would rather go for the red eye. Never had great sleep on the sleeper.

the advantage the lowlander has (at least when it was mk3 operated) was I nearly always got you into London before 0700. You could be in most of London by 0800. Using air you struggled to get into most of London for 0900.

not used the new sleeper yet so can’t comment if you can sleep well on it or if you are still jolted around.

 

[Bald Rick]

I must admit for business, I would rather go for the red eye. Never had great sleep on the sleeper.

the advantage the lowlander has (at least when it was mk3 operated) was I nearly always got you into London before 0700. You could be in most of London by 0800. Using air you struggled to get into most of London for 0900.

not used the new sleeper yet so can’t comment if you can sleep well on it or if you are still jolted around.

From Edinburgh the first flights will easily get you into any part of central London by 0900; it’s not so easy from Glasgow.

New sleeper - in my opinion it’s more comfortable, definitely better sleep, but it’s still a fact that you get moved around a bit.

 

[hwl]

Dont forget 1S26 and 1M16

CAF 331s is the sidings at Preston suspected of doing funky things to the OHLE line voltage and upsetting the 92s while stopped for driver change...

 

[al78]

Why harder? EasyJet, BA and FlyBe serve all the same end-points as the sleeper, except Fort William. The coach from Fort William even stops at Glasgow Airport, though I grant you, it’s not possible to leave Fort William after 7pm & arrive in Central London by 9. For all the others, an early arrival in London would be possible, even Dundee via Stansted.

Correction- it actually is possible from Fort William- 1910 coach to Glasgow (2212) for an early bus to the airport or just go to the airport in the evening & sleep in the Holiday Inn/Express on site

Earlier this year I did fly up to Inverness because the sleeper doesn't run on Saturday evening and getting a daytime train is double the price and means getting up at 5:30am, but there are other examples where the sleeper is far more practical than the plane, even ignoring environmental ethics.

A couple of years ago I walked the Minigaig from Blair Atholl to Kingusse, with an overnight camp. That involved an evening train to London, board sleeper, get off at Blair Atholl aboout 6:45am, walk, camp, walk, arrive at Kingussie, kill a few hours before getting a pub meal, then board sleeper for home. All done in one weekend with no time off work.

To do the same by plane would require flying to one of the major cities on Friday evening (if there are any flights), getting a bus or train to Blair Atholl (which takes some time, and if there is a bus/train service late evening), stay overnight (because trying to do this walk after travelling on Saturday morning probably leaves the timing dangerously tight), start walk next morning, camp overnight, walk, get train from Kingussie to Inverness (if there are any running on Sunday afternoon), fly from Inverness to Gatwick (if there are any evening flights on a Sunday, and I can make it to the airport in time using train and bus, and all the connections work). Might be cheaper but a lot more stress and hassle, requires a day off work, and the many connections mean more chance of something going wrong. In addition to that, I have to buy camping cas after landing and then throw it away before leaving because you can't take compressed flammable gas canisters on flights.

Starting at Fort William is equally a pain in the arse as it is a long way from any airport, and will be impossible to arrive there and start a multi-day walk early. So yes, just because something is theoretically possible doesn't make it practical or sensible.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Starting at Fort William is equally a pain in the arse as it is a long way from any airport, and will be impossible to arrive there and start a multi-day walk early. So yes, just because something is theoretically possible doesn't make it practical or sensible.

FW is certainly an awkward place to get to/from for a weekend other than by Sleeper, though the addition of a winter Sunday morning train is long overdue and will at least make it possible to get back to the South East by day train the same day without using the coach, which often books full.

 

[Bald Rick]

FW is certainly an awkward place to get to/from for a weekend other than by Sleeper, though the addition of a winter Sunday morning train is long overdue and will at least make it possible to get back to the South East by day train the same day without using the coach, which often books full.

It really isn’t. I’ve done it several times leaving London after work, and being in FW for breakfast the following morning in Morrisons when the cafe opens. That’s rather earlier than possible off the sleeper. Full day walking, curry in Spice Tandoori, bed. Then another full day walking, leaving FW around 1700/1730 Sunday, and being in bed at home in Hertfordshire for 2330.

 

[Bletchleyite]

It really isn’t. I’ve done it several times leaving London after work, and being in FW for breakfast the following morning in Morrisons when the cafe opens. That’s rather earlier than possible off the sleeper. Full day walking, curry in Spice Tandoori, bed. Then another full day walking, leaving FW around 1700/1730 Sunday, and being in bed at home in Hertfordshire for 2330.

By what mode(s) of transport?

If your answer is "driving through the night" that doesn't count as doing so after a full day's work with a normal morning start is highly questionable in road safety terms - even if you share the driving and nap for half of the night you will not have had enough sleep to drive safely as your body clock is not properly adjusted for the late night. If it was possible to legislate against doing that I'm sure it would have been.

It would be possible I guess to take a Friday evening flight (or last day train of the day), followed by a hotel in or around Glasgow or Inverness, followed by a hire car to FW after an early start (or boarding the Sleeper at Glasgow in its day train mode), but that's a right rigmarole for a weekend.

 

[Bald Rick]

By what mode(s) of transport?

If your answer is "driving through the night" that doesn't count as doing so after a full day's work with a normal morning start is highly questionable in road safety terms - even if you share the driving and nap for half of the night you will not have had enough sleep to drive safely as your body clock is not properly adjusted for the late night. If it was possible to legislate against doing that I'm sure it would have been.

It would be possible I guess to take a Friday evening flight (or last day train of the day), followed by a hotel in or around Glasgow or Inverness, followed by a hire car to FW after an early start (or boarding the Sleeper at Glasgow in its day train mode), but that's a right rigmarole for a weekend.

1630 to Glasgow, bus to airport, hire car there, Dumbarton travelodge, drive up next morning.
Sunday - drive back to airport, EZY78, then either taxi or bus/train/walk.

A couple of times the hire car is replaced with a lift with friends who have driven up from the Midlands after work. The train up could easily be replaced by any of the flights from London airports after 1900 - there’s several. I use the train because it’s most convenient for me.

 

[paul1609]

1630 to Glasgow, bus to airport, hire car there, Dumbarton travelodge, drive up next morning.
Sunday - drive back to airport, EZY78, then either taxi or bus/train/walk.

A couple of times the hire car is replaced with a lift with friends who have driven up from the Midlands after work. The train up could easily be replaced by any of the flights from London airports after 1900 - there’s several. I use the train because it’s most convenient for me.

!8.00 flight from Southend, Hire Car from Glasgow Airport Tent Up, In the Clachan Inn Glencoe for 10 pm,
Pissed by 1 am.

 

[John Bishop]

!8.00 flight from Southend, Hire Car from Glasgow Airport Tent Up, In the Clachan Inn Glencoe for 10 pm,
Pissed by 1 am.

2 hours from Southend to Glencoe?

 

[Bald Rick]

!8.00 flight from Southend, Hire Car from Glasgow Airport Tent Up, In the Clachan Inn Glencoe for 10 pm,
Pissed by 1 am.

I’m a bit quicker than you on the last leg - an hour tops!

 

[Bletchleyite]

!8.00 flight from Southend, Hire Car from Glasgow Airport Tent Up, In the Clachan Inn Glencoe for 10 pm,
Pissed by 1 am.

None of these options involve finishing work at a conventional time (1730) though...not everyone can sneak off early!

 

[BRX]

It really isn’t. I’ve done it several times leaving London after work, and being in FW for breakfast the following morning in Morrisons when the cafe opens. That’s rather earlier than possible off the sleeper. Full day walking, curry in Spice Tandoori, bed. Then another full day walking, leaving FW around 1700/1730 Sunday, and being in bed at home in Hertfordshire for 2330.

That must involve getting up at 5 or 6 am on the Saturday morning though?

 

[Struner]

2 hours from Southend to Glencoe?

He said fly at 18:00 i.e. 6pm. But I doubt he went to Drymen.
A nice place though, at least when I was there, many moons ago now.

 

[BRX]

I was curious how things would compare, to travel to Fort William next Friday.

For one person on the sleeper it's £210 for a berth or £50 for a seat.

Easyjet Luton to Glasgow (arrive 2150) is £85. Travelodge in Dumbarton £42. Car hire another £45?

For two people, sleeper berth £255 (£127 each). Hotel would be a bit cheaper per person.

The flying option is way more expensive than seated sleeper, a fair bit cheaper than a solo sleeper cabin, and a little more expensive than a shared cabin (if there's two of you).

Horses for courses... and there are plenty of other variables, naturally.

 

[Struner]

£45, That would be car hire for 48 hrs plus fuel?

 

[BRX]

£45, That would be car hire for 48 hrs plus fuel?

Yes, based on a very rapid search.

 

[Mag_seven]

Does anyone know if there is a seat selector for the seated portion?