Caledonian Sleeper

[BRX]

My supposedly adult son has managed to persuade me to go all the way to London with him to listen to some games music at a concert (Sonic the Hedgehog Sonic Symphony ). At least it’s an excuse to try out the Mk5 Caledonian Sleeper which I haven’t yet been on.

I am wondering what the chances of getting in to the lounge – sorry Club – car are these days on a Friday night with a mere Classic Room ticket. Maybe we were lucky, but we always managed to get in to the lounge on the old Sleeper.

Sorry if this has been discussed recently but I haven’t managed to read through all the posts made since I last contributed to this thread.

Not sure how much busier friday nights are at the moment, compared to other nights. My impression is that the train is quite full on all nights at the moment.
I've used it twice in the last 3 months or so, in neither case on a Friday night. On both occasions we managed to get seats (2 of us, at the zigzag table stools) with a bit of strategy to get in there ASAP. It then filled up pretty quickly and people getting there ten or fifteen minutes later had to wait... But I think all/most of them did manage to get a place after a while.
So, I'd say you have a reasonable chance, but you might not get in on the first sitting.
Also, you may find multiple things on the menu have run out (seems to happen often).
And I reckon the portions are a lot meaner than they used to be - and more expensive.
And it has a slightly different atmosphere to the old lounge cars.
Still enjoyable to have your dinner in there though.

 

[jagardner1984]

Nice mention of the sleeper from elections legend Professor Sir John Curtice on the Today programme this morning.

Perhaps not the free run advertising CS might have hoped for, given he is stuck on it, cancelled !

Realtime Trains | 1S26 2350 London Euston to Preston | 22/05/2024

Real-time train running information for 1S26 2350 departure from London Euston to Preston on 22/05/2024. From Realtime Trains, an independent source of train running info for Great Britain.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

 

[Statto]

Nice mention of the sleeper from elections legend Professor Sir John Curtice on the Today programme this morning.

Perhaps not the free run advertising CS might have hoped for, given he is stuck on it, cancelled !

Realtime Trains | 1S26 2350 London Euston to Preston | 22/05/2024

Real-time train running information for 1S26 2350 departure from London Euston to Preston on 22/05/2024. From Realtime Trains, an independent source of train running info for Great Britain.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

Flooding has closed the WCML closed North of Carlisle, the Northbound Highlander only made it to Carlisle, Southbound Highlander terminated Edinburgh, i don't think the Southbound Lowlander ran.

 

[Peter Sarf]

We could do with an alternative route up the other side of the country. I know lets call it the East Coast Main Line !.

 

[Scotrail84]

We could do with an alternative route up the other side of the country. I know lets call it the East Coast Main Line !.

You can't just decide on the night to run ECML, theres a lot of pre planning that needs to be put in place for diversions.

Flooding has closed the WCML closed North of Carlisle, the Northbound Highlander only made it to Carlisle, Southbound Highlander terminated Edinburgh, i don't think the Southbound Lowlander ran.

That did run but ran very late. To the tune of nearly 3 hours late into Euston.

 

[Peter Sarf]

You can't just decide on the night to run ECML, theres a lot of pre planning that needs to be put in place for diversions.


That did run but ran very late. To the tune of nearly 3 hours late into Euston.

I know its not simple unfortunately but how much contingency planning could be usable ?. After all the sleeper does use the ECML sometimes so there must be paths, not saying it is easy to juggle staff at the last minute.

 

[JamieL]

Perhaps it would be a good idea to waterproof the WCML to stop things like this happening?

 

[PG]

Nice mention of the sleeper from elections legend Professor Sir John Curtice on the Today programme this morning.

Perhaps not the free run advertising CS might have hoped for, given he is stuck on it, cancelled !

Realtime Trains | 1S26 2350 London Euston to Preston | 22/05/2024

Real-time train running information for 1S26 2350 departure from London Euston to Preston on 22/05/2024. From Realtime Trains, an independent source of train running info for Great Britain.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

Looks like the stock is now heading back to London as 5M26 though as it is running ECS why is that supposedly going all the way to Euston?
https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:75614/2024-05-23/detailed

 

[Scotrail84]

I know its not simple unfortunately but how much contingency planning could be usable ?. After all the sleeper does use the ECML sometimes so there must be paths, not saying it is easy to juggle staff at the last minute.

Drivers are a problem as the drivers needed for ECML are at a premium, need extra locos as well for the drags in the morning.

 

[jagardner1984]

Looks like the stock is now heading back to London as 5M26 though as it is running ECS why is that supposedly going all the way to Euston?
https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:75614/2024-05-23/detailed

Could it be something to do with the crew base being Euston rather than Wembley ? Or would they just taxi them ? Or the orientation of the stock for tonight’s service ?

On the broader point, what length of delay is ok before the drivers run out of hours ? Presumably GBRF have to get relief drivers to another part of the country to take the stock either forward or back ?

 

[David57]

Beds just came through Bletchley at 12.30..

 

[Krokodil]

You can't just decide on the night to run ECML, theres a lot of pre planning that needs to be put in place for diversions.

I bet that BR would have managed to divert (whether via the ECML or the S&C).

 

[PaxVobiscum]

Not sure how much busier friday nights are at the moment, compared to other nights. My impression is that the train is quite full on all nights at the moment.
I've used it twice in the last 3 months or so, in neither case on a Friday night. On both occasions we managed to get seats (2 of us, at the zigzag table stools) with a bit of strategy to get in there ASAP. It then filled up pretty quickly and people getting there ten or fifteen minutes later had to wait... But I think all/most of them did manage to get a place after a while.
So, I'd say you have a reasonable chance, but you might not get in on the first sitting.
Also, you may find multiple things on the menu have run out (seems to happen often).
And I reckon the portions are a lot meaner than they used to be - and more expensive.
And it has a slightly different atmosphere to the old lounge cars.
Still enjoyable to have your dinner in there though.

Thanks, that’s all helpful.

 

[Falcon1200]

I bet that BR would have managed to divert (whether via the ECML or the S&C).

Possibly, but not easy to arrange when the trains are already en route!
(BTW flooding is north of Carlisle so S&C of no use in this case).

 

[185143]

Possibly, but not easy to arrange when the trains are already en route!
(BTW flooding is north of Carlisle so S&C of no use in this case).

And the S&C also had flooding issues. The only route in or out of Carlisle for a good chunk of the morning was the Tyne Valley line to and from Newcastle.

I noticed a few pages back a comment saying seated plebs customers guests passengers are no longer allowed to order food.

When did that change?

And I assume seated passengers are allowed a wee dram or two? I certainly was on Easter Monday. Wasn't looking at food as I'd already eaten.

 

[Krokodil]

Possibly, but not easy to arrange when the trains are already en route!

Maybe, but it was certainly easier in the days when you could find a local crew and hook on whatever ETS-fitted class of loco (diesel or electric as appropriate) they signed to move the train via any route cleared for Mk3s. We've definitely lost the flexibility.

Did GNER work ECML sleeper diverts in the days when Virgin used to hire its locos and crews?

 

[Blindtraveler]

Someone mentioned a few posts back about seated guests no longer being able to order. Food. Website suggests that you still can, I wonder if there was some confusion here or has something changed without the website being updated?

 

[Scotrail84]

And the S&C also had flooding issues. The only route in or out of Carlisle for a good chunk of the morning was the Tyne Valley line to and from Newcastle.

I noticed a few pages back a comment saying seated plebs customers guests passengers are no longer allowed to order food.

When did that change?

And I assume seated passengers are allowed a wee dram or two? I certainly was on Easter Monday. Wasn't looking at food as I'd already eaten.

S+C is a write off, not wired and no diesel loco can power a 14/16 coach set anyway.

 

[AlbertBeale]

I know its not simple unfortunately but how much contingency planning could be usable ?. After all the sleeper does use the ECML sometimes so there must be paths, not saying it is easy to juggle staff at the last minute.

If they come down the ECML, what route do they take to get to Euston? (Assuming they don't turf people out at KX instead...)

 

[Krokodil]

If they come down the ECML, what route do they take to get to Euston?

A route via Wembley reminiscent of a Branch Line Society tour

(Assuming they don't turf people out at KX instead...)

When it's necessary to plan trains to run to KGX they have to reduce the number of carriages to fit the platform.

 

[AlbertBeale]

A route via Wembley reminiscent of a Branch Line Society tour


When it's necessary to plan trains to run to KGX they have to reduce the number of carriages to fit the platform.

Thanks. Does that mean coming off of the ECML just north of KX, and going up the ramp (across the top of StP) to the NLL, and then accessing Wembley? Or do they divert further out of London?

 

[BRX]

Thanks. Does that mean coming off of the ECML just north of KX, and going up the ramp (across the top of StP) to the NLL, and then accessing Wembley? Or do they divert further out of London?

See here

 

[AlbertBeale]

See here

Thanks - though I couldn't fully make sense of the route in the video. Was it in fact using the North London Incline?

 

[BRX]

Thanks - though I couldn't fully make sense of the route in the video. Was it in fact using the North London Incline?

If that's the proper name for this bit, then yes, I think.

 

[Falcon1200]

Did GNER work ECML sleeper diverts in the days when Virgin used to hire its locos and crews?

Don't know, I'm afraid. But I do know that when the WCML was closed by the Lamington Viaduct failure in the early months of 2016, the sleepers were diverted either via Kilmarnock and Dumfries, or the ECML, depending on circumstances, and huge efforts went in to arranging those diversions. However, organising such things with notice, even just a day, is very different from doing it when the trains are already en route!

 

[185143]

Don't know, I'm afraid. But I do know that when the WCML was closed by the Lamington Viaduct failure in the early months of 2016, the sleepers were diverted either via Kilmarnock and Dumfries, or the ECML, depending on circumstances, and huge efforts went in to arranging those diversions. However, organising such things with notice, even just a day, is very different from doing it when the trains are already en route!

I'm pretty sure they even went via Hartlepool one night. But yes, huge efforts must have gone into organising it, which being a significant length of time the WCML was closed no doubt was worthwhile.

 

[RGM654]

It may be difficult/impossible to re-route a train at short notice, but it can't be exactly easy to deal with a tranload of passengers in the middle of the night. Were they allowed to stay in their berths at Preston until the morning and then found alternative transport?

 

[AlbertBeale]

If that's the proper name for this bit, then yes, I think.

View attachment 158677

Exactly what I was thinking of - thanks! An interesting bit of rare track to experience for the price of your Sleeper ticket...!

 

[Davester50]

The wait in Wembley for the run round takes the shine off the rare track, from my first hand experience!

 

[zero]

The wait in Wembley for the run round takes the shine off the rare track, from my first hand experience!

Not if you're in the club car