I doubt that a reduced capacity in each of half the cars would provide the peak capacity or meet the minimal dwell time requirements. The configuration of the class 700s is inextricably bound with the frequency of the services and the mandated flow capacity as determined in the late noughties when the Thameslink rolling stock was specified.
The average travelling time between LU stations is less than two minutes and 80% of their full load is usually crushed around the doors. The comparison with an outer suburban train that reaches 100mph is irrelevant.
Thameslink FC is hardly cramped
The trains were specified to meet peak load requirements as predicted when the original tender went out (istr 2009). @ThameslinkUser said:"should have been specced" which would be pointless in 2009 given that the Thameslink Programme was justified based on predicted increases in passenger volumes, (which may yet be realised). If it isn't by 2035 'ish, there may be an opportunity to do such a refit at the mid-life update, but I would'n hold my breath.
I'm not sure what Brighton has to do with it. I was posting about dwells on the tube (the clue is in the words "The average travelling time between LUL stations is ...").
The passenger capacity of a route is determined by the capacity of the rolling stock used and the maximum frequency that they can be run. That frequency is determined by the minimum headways that trains can be run, which in turn is subject to suitably short dwell. The interior layout of trains has a major impact on dwell times.
The first class layout is more spacious than the layout of LUL trains. LUL trains manage shorter dwells and higher headways. The average journey time does not play an effect on this, although it should be noted that during peak time, the average journey time for all lines except the Victoria and the Waterloo and City would be closer to Thameslink than you imply. The point is moot.
The first class layout is less spacious* than the nearest equivalent the S7/8. Cluttering up a high capacity train with tables and large(r) seats than the minimum is consuming both seating and standing space. The average journey times on many LUL lines are similar to those on TL because most tube lines run only all-station services, whereas TL services are a mixture. Both services run trains with car interiors suitable for their purposes, not requiring any changes.
I also have been on an Alvia train recently and can conform the comfort levels. We just dont seem to have anyone at a high level interested in passenger comfort.
But they don't. That's the entire issue. You try commuting on a 700 from Brighton to London. They've been designed for East Croydon and St Albans punters and that's it. No consideration of any kind for customers who travel longer distances (the ones who pay more)
That's your opinion. I'm retired but have travelled from St Albans to Brighton and returned the same day a few times and I find the seating OK for that journey recognising that they are designed to move crowds as well with which I've also travelled quite a few times, typically dropping 500 or so passengers at St Albans with a minimum dwell in order to not dely a fast approaching EMR IC train behind. It's horses for courses and will probably be the same for the next 15 years at least when there might be a mid-life refresh. Meanwhile if the accommodation isn't up to your 'spec', you have the choice of Electrostar luxury.
I don't ever travel in standard on LNER or GWR - comfort or not I'm not willing to deal with days of back pain following the journey. That used to mean I'd upgrade to first, but now I largely fly instead. (GWR is generally part of a journey from further north)
This whole concept of ohh but the seats are fine for short journeys or ohh its only 20 mins to stand, its a race to the bottom and the car industry is laughing all the way to the bank. Rails biggest competition is the car, the car is percieved to be far more convenient even if rail is sometimes a lot quicker, so if rail wants to compete then rail needs to be more comfortable and ideally cheaper too.
This i think is totally true, i avoid LNER like the plauge unless its an Intercity225 service, Lumo gets my money or the airlines, who very often are cheaper even with the transfer at either end. I will add that Ryanirs seats are not comfirtable but 1 hour on a ryanair plane to Scotland is preferable to 4-5 hours on an LNER azuma standard class with the hideous seats. GWR, they lose my money to national express or SWR. It says a lot when the coach is more attractive comfortwise than the train.
Quite common on some very recent continental stock, and not necessarily very short run metro services only.
The issue is, 55 miles from central London to Brighton or 30-50 miles beyond Luton is far quicker by train and generally less of a problem than driving. The same destinations back into London is even worse if there's no gauranteed parking. Those here who love to drive will always say that they expect trains to have all the comforts of their own metal box, however, they represent a relatively smallproportionn of potential rail passengers so the fact that road travel is likey to get worse as time goes on means that nothing much needs to change.
The problems that I have experienced with the new classes of CAF MUs is their suspension rather than the seats. The twitchiness of the suspension setup was awful, but even having the benefit of MK1 'spring and horse hair' seat squabs would be uncomfortable because of the jittery ride.
Moulded plastic. Sounds fancy. They'll likely go with wooden boards, and a metal bar to lean back against for safety
Well at least you’ll be able to easily wipe off the filth left behind by the previous occupant !
Correct me if I'm wrong but the south side of the Circle Line from Tower Hill to Gloucester Road is 24 trains per hour. At one point, this was achieved with three types of train (C, D and S stock), all driven manually and with the single leaf doors on the D stock.
The standard class seats in the Belgian class EMUs were pretty much like that. Type Klassiek motorstel interieur in to Google. Didn't put me off; I had 300 of them for haulage over 15 years! By contrast, the first class was basically a sofa.