Cheapest way to get a Pacer from London

[northwichcat]

Of course that used to be reversed - the South got knackered, ageing, rotting and uncrashworthy Mk1s, and the North got new 150s, 156s and 158s. And Pacers, but people forget how run-down the old Mk1 DMU fleet was actually getting.

The North didn't fully get rid of slam door stock on local/regional services until 2003 and the South got brand new 159s, 317s, 319s, 321s, 322s, 442s, 455s, 456s and possibly others in the 80s and very early 90s. Yes the South had a higher number of old trains but given how many more carriages they have did they have a higher proportion of old carriages?

And if the South's old EMUs were so bad why did Metro use some as a short-term fix in the Leeds area prior to the 333s being built? (If you believe some people it was the introduction of old 308s that sparked growth!)

 

[Tracked]

Shopping trolleys usually need a pound to use, if you can get a friend to push you around in one you could buy him a pint to say thanks? Probably under a tenner at London prices ...


Seriously though: Grand Central/Hull Trains advance singles to Doncaster, and one of those South Yorkshire SYConnect+ tickets for £7.90, all over South Yorkshire's railway lines with all the joy of the pacers everywhere

 

[meridian2]

I spent most of Saturday bouncing round on Pacers, the sun was out too. A West Yorks Day Rover for £7.20 offers Pacer heaven (or hell if you're my wife who travels on one daily), plus I got to ride a 333 t'Ilkley.

 

[knockknock81]

I'd say Cardiff is pretty interesting as a city, and travel there isn't as much as you think. Without a railcard, you can get advance singles for £15 at the moment.

it is also a dive

 

[Bletchleyite]

The North didn't fully get rid of slam door stock on local/regional services until 2003

There were a piddling number of Class 101 sets around east Manchester and north Wales (which had quite an enthusiast following, particularly the green liveried one), and the north Wales LHCS which was very popular with passengers (by being proper InterCity) if a bit old.

That's nothing like the huge amount of knackered old Mk1s there were knocking around sarf Landan. Well over half the fleet in the NSE area until at least 2000 I'd say.

given how many more carriages they have did they have a higher proportion of old carriages?

Yes, massively so.

And if the South's old EMUs were so bad why did Metro use some as a short-term fix in the Leeds area prior to the 333s being built? (If you believe some people it was the introduction of old 308s that sparked growth!)

Because that was what they had available!
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it is also a dive

I can tell you plenty of places that are a dive (if you want one in Wales, try just about every town on the North Wales Coast bar Llandudno), Cardiff ain't one of them.

 

[boyaloud]

Thanks for everyone's replies, looks like we're off to Manchester! Found Euston to Crewe for £9 one way, and Crewe to Manchester for £3 - pretty decent!

I'd recommend EUston to Stoke (same train as EUston to Crewe, but alight ~20 minutes earlier), then there are the same £3 electric Northern advances from there as from Crewe, take same time, about an hour. Just cuts your London Midland travel time which despite it now going at up to 110mph, still drags.

 

[northwichcat]

There were a piddling number of Class 101 sets around east Manchester and north Wales (which had quite an enthusiast following, particularly the green liveried one), and the north Wales LHCS which was very popular with passengers (by being proper InterCity) if a bit old.

Prior to the 175s coming in to service there were probably around 30ish diesel slam door trains and 130ish DMUs built in 1984 or later in the North West franchise, which was reduced to around 6 x slam door sets for the period between when all the 175s were delivered and the 'teething problems' were sorted out. I actually forgot about the 31 hauled mk2 set being used in 2004 which was used on what's now my local line but I wasn't living in the area at the time.

Because that was what they had available!

They decided to replace 144s with old 308s straight away rather than waiting for new EMUs to be delivered before doing an internal cascade. If the 308s were good for nothing except scrap Metro wouldn't have been able to use them.

 

[Joe Paxton]

...
That's nothing like the huge amount of knackered old Mk1s there were knocking around sarf Landan. Well over half the fleet in the NSE area until at least 2000 I'd say.

Re "sarf London" - not really for inner-suburban / metro routes. Plenty of Networkers and 455s for instance. The slam doors generally hung around on longer routes.

I'm sure someone (not me) could provide chapter and verse regarding the ex-NSE fleet in 2000.

I think your overall point is sound though - lots of Mk1 stock in the south east which stayed around for longer than intended, in part because rail privatisation threw a spanner in the works of NSE's grand plans.
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I'd recommend EUston to Stoke (same train as EUston to Crewe, but alight ~20 minutes earlier), then there are the same £3 electric Northern advances from there as from Crewe, take same time, about an hour. Just cuts your London Midland travel time which despite it now going at up to 110mph, still drags.

Yep, Euston - Stoke - Manchester (as opposed to Crewe) is the way I'd suggest getting up there on the cheap.

However I don't think the Northern trains from Stoke to Manchester (with the cheap Advances) connect very well with the London Midland trains coming up from Euston.

XC seem to offer a good selection of Advance fares for this journey from around £7-ish, plus there are cheaper VT-only walk-up fares for Stoke to Manchester, e.g. £12.50 off-peak day return (no VT-only period return fare though, but there's an any operator £16.60 off-peak period return).

 

[DeeGee]

Re "sarf London" - not really for inner-suburban / metro routes. Plenty of Networkers and 455s for instance. The slam doors generally hung around on longer routes.

I'm sure someone (not me) could provide chapter and verse regarding the ex-NSE fleet in 2000.

I think your overall point is sound though - lots of Mk1 stock in the south east which stayed around for longer than intended, in part because rail privatisation threw a spanner in the works of NSE's grand plans.

Commuting to the city of London from Mid/West Kent, I can confirm that I was still riding around in slammers from Sevenoaks, Tunbridge Wells and Maidstone until August 2001 when I moved north. Networkers ran into Charing Cross; Cannon Street and Victoria enjoyed slammers.

 

[PeterY]

I'm off to Leeds on Tuesday.

What routes are almost guarenteed a pacer from Leeds?

 

[RJ]

I've been in the OP's shoes as a Londoner who was keen to give them a try. I quite like them for the novelty, though I'd hate to have to commute on them.

I'd recommend a jaunt from Manchester to Southport if you want the full bounce experience. The Saltburn Line also has some industrial scenery worth looking at. I'd also recommend a ride from Blackpool South to Blackburn, might have to hold onto your seat between Preston and Lostock Hall. 143s and 144s aren't nearly as characterful as the 142s.

 

[northwichcat]

I'm off to Leeds on Tuesday.

What routes are almost guarenteed a pacer from Leeds?

Stopper to Huddersfield via Dewsbury is probably the most likely to be a Pacer. Although, some of the routes that get a higher proportion of Sprinter operated services have more frequent services e.g. Harrogate line, Calder Valley and Sheffield.

 

[cactustwirly]

I'm off to Leeds on Tuesday.

What routes are almost guarenteed a pacer from Leeds?

Huddersfield stopper, Knottingley, Sheffield stopper via Moorthorpe

Harrogate loop services are a mixture of pacers and sprinters.

 

[James H]

Another option is London Waterloo to Exeter St Davids, and then a Devon Day Ranger. Tickets from Waterloo can be pretty cheap (especially the £16 promo returns they did last year).

You can get an even better fare for Waterloo to Exeter with Megatrain

 

[Howardh]

I know there's a thread for meetings and stuff, but I wonder if, considering how devoted we all are to pacers (ahem) we could have a Saturday meet on one, get an all-day ticket and chat (drink) the day away?

Colne to Blackpool South and back and back again........anyone??

Thought not!

 

[meridian2]

I know there's a thread for meetings and stuff, but I wonder if, considering how devoted we all are to pacers (ahem) we could have a Saturday meet on one, get an all-day ticket and chat (drink) the day away?

Colne to Blackpool South and back and back again........anyone??

Thought not!

This was last weekend's excursion in Pacer country, if any encouragement were needed: https://www.flickr.com/photos/143683333@N04/32272994046/in/dateposted-public/

 

[fowler9]

This was last weekend's excursion in Pacer country, if any encouragement were needed: https://www.flickr.com/photos/143683333@N04/32272994046/in/dateposted-public/

Lancashire to the East and Greater Manchester to the South East?

 

[meridian2]

Lancashire to the East and Greater Manchester to the South East?

I noticed the geographical flaw earlier and was in two minds if to keep it in. I blame having to convert 41 Raw files, title the photos and provide details in one sitting. It took slightly longer than the actual journey, which is why I don't post these excursions very often!

It's now corrected.

 

[ondi]

Getting back to this one - here's how our day panned out.

London Midland from Euston to Crewe (Class 350)
Northern from Crewe to Manchester Piccadilly (Class 323)
Northern from Manchester Victoria to Rochdale (Class 150)
Northern from Rochdale to Manchester Victoria (Class 150)
Virgin Manchester Piccadilly to London Euston (Class 390)

Thought we'd have a chance of catching a Pacer to/from Rochdale as per Neil Williams and Ianno87's posts, but were left disappointed. While at Victoria we saw a couple of Pacers going off towards Stalybridge, but had run out of time and money by then.

Maybe we'll try a trip down to Devon or to Cardiff next time.

 

[northwichcat]

Getting back to this one - here's how our day panned out.

London Midland from Euston to Crewe (Class 350)
Northern from Crewe to Manchester Piccadilly (Class 323)
Northern from Manchester Victoria to Rochdale (Class 150)
Northern from Rochdale to Manchester Victoria (Class 150)
Virgin Manchester Piccadilly to London Euston (Class 390)

Thought we'd have a chance of catching a Pacer to/from Rochdale as per Neil Williams and Ianno87's posts, but were left disappointed. While at Victoria we saw a couple of Pacers going off towards Stalybridge, but had run out of time and money by then.

Maybe we'll try a trip down to Devon or to Cardiff next time.

To be honest that itinerary is not a good one for getting a Pacer. If you caught the first train from Rochdale after arriving at Victoria and the first train back after wanting to leave Rochdale you probably only had around a 25% chance of getting a Pacer in each direction, as the majority of the Victoria-Rochdale-Leeds services are operated by Sprinters. Local services between Crewe and Manchester are exclusively 323s bar one weekday morning service between Crewe and Bolton which is booked as 2 x 142s.

However, how many Pacers operate on a line may depend on the day of the week. On my local line 142s are impossible to avoid on weekdays but at the weekend it's quite easy to avoid them but 150s are impossible to avoid instead.

 

[fowler9]

The 18:55 Lime Street to Oxford Road is pretty much always a pair of Pacers. As is the much earlier service that stops at West Allerton at 06:30 heading to Manchester. Almost nailed on to be a pair of Pacers.

 

[Merseysider]

Pretty much anything from Vic to Kirkby too. At least whenever I've got it.

 

[Kite159]

Pretty much anything from Vic to Kirkby too. At least whenever I've got it.

I've found Vic - Kirkby is a mix between 142s, 150s & 156s, similar to the Southport services. Especially if the return from Kirkby carries on to Blackburn via Rochdale

 

[fowler9]

The pair of trains I mentioned are reliable when it comes to being Pacers. When I say reliable you can't rely on being able to get out of the toilet if you need to use them.

 

[Merseysider]

I've found Vic - Kirkby is a mix between 142s, 150s & 156s, similar to the Southport services. Especially if the return from Kirkby carries on to Blackburn via Rochdale

Ah, fair enough! For my commute into Salford Crescent from Vic I only ever get 142 or 156, or from Picc my Southport services are always a 142 coupled to something else. I've seen a fair number of Pacers on the Vic-Stalybridge shuttles too.

Hard to think they'll be gone in the near future!

 

[Bletchleyite]

I think if I had been the OP I'd have gone to Picc or Vic and waited for one to show up with a GM Rail Ranger in hand. There'd have been one soon enough.

 

[philthetube]

Having re-read the title, I would suggest on the back of a lorry.

 

[rg177]

Sounds like a disappointing trip but next time I'd recommend sticking at Piccadilly and getting a Rose Hill/Marple/New Mills service which is almost entirely 142 worked with the odd 150 in the mix.

Sent from my SM-A310F using Tapatalk

 

[northwichcat]

I think if I had been the OP I'd have gone to Picc or Vic and waited for one to show up with a GM Rail Ranger in hand. There'd have been one soon enough.

The one thing to be careful of at Piccadilly is sometimes, particularly at the lower numbered platforms, there can be multiple trains there at once so you might see a 142 but the 150 in front of it may be working the next service alone with the next working for the 142 being an ECS.

 

[brompton rail]

If you come to Sheffield or Doncaster, however, almost all Trains on the Scunthorpe-Doncaster -Sheffield - Lincoln - Sheffield - Doncaster -Adwick circuit will be Pacers. Having said that, today saw a 153 substituting on one diagram. Also Hull - Doncaster stoppers at around 09.25 from Hull and 10.50 from Doncaste, repeated on a three hourly cycle, will be a Nodding Donkey too (the rest are 158s!).

And by coming to Doncaster from London you have the choice of 225s and 125s from Virgin East Coast, 180s from Hull Trains or Grand Central. Or from St Pancras to Sheffield with 222s from East Midland Trains, or 125s to Nottingham and then Northern 158s or EMT 158s, or change at Derby for XC Voyagers.