Class 153 'sag'

[90sWereBetter]

I've noticed several photos of these DMUs over the last few years with a prominant 'body sag' in the centre of the carriage. Now I wonder, what has actually caused this to happen, and how long can these units feasibly run before they'll have to be withdrawn for fear of severe body failure?

 

[anthony263]

I have noticed this on some of ATW's class 153's although it is not really noticable on the class 153's I have seen operated by FGW.

There is talk of the class 153's being reformed back into class 155's once again if they are to be refurbished for use beyond 2020

 

[bronzeonion]

Yeah I've noticed it too, same as anthony263 it was an ATW one but i've seen pics of other TOC's 153's with the same 'feature'. Its probably because they are fairly long vehicles and the bodies are constructed like a bus body would be I guess!

 

[MCR247]

Does anyone have any links to any pictures that show this?

 

[Class172]

Is it an actual physical sag or is it just an optical illusion due to the long section of panel windows without interruptions?

 

[MCR247]

I've heard before that it is quite a major problem with 153s long before I heard anything about it being easily visible?

 

[richw]

Does anyone have any links to any pictures that show this?

I've googled class 153 after finding this thread and cant see any results where it can be noticed,

 

[sprinterguy]

Is it an actual physical sag or is it just an optical illusion due to the long section of panel windows without interruptions?

I'm fairly certain that it is a physical sag as it is noticeable at solebar level as well as at the level of the windows, accentuated of course when looking at a unit from a narrow angle. I'm sure it has been mentioned as a potential reason why the 153s might not be suitable for extensive DDA compliance work to allow them to continue in service after 2020.

 

[Mr Sam]

cant say ive ever noticed any

 

[sprinterguy]

Its probably because they are fairly long vehicles and the bodies are constructed like a bus body would be I guess!

I'd agree with this - "Basic" British Leyland manufacturing standards!

 

[Rich McLean]

I am sure that I have see photo's before of the sag, but none found on google

 

[starrymarkb]

IIRC the structure is based on that of the 142 but self supporting rather then mounted on an underframe (142 bodies are technically self supporting too if they were not mounted on the frame)

 

[nlogax]

Found this..doesn't look extremely pronounced but it's definitely visible.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/kevin_r_boyd/3627185886/

 

[yorksrob]

That's quite an interesting photo. I had no idea that 15* units could work in multiple with modern stuff.

 

[MCR247]

Yeah, thats the main advantage to 170s. Although 156s did require a slight mod

 

[Jonny]

Does this mean that the 153s might be the first 15x units to go for scrap?

 

[richw]

Does this mean that the 153s might be the first 15x units to go for scrap?

Depends if you count the two class 151s which were scrapped in 2004?

Sent from my HTC Sensation Z710e using Tapatalk 2

 

[MCR247]

And carriages that have been scrapped due to accident damage?

 

[fgwrich]

And carriages that have been scrapped due to accident damage?

Ex 150s 52209 & 52212 Would have been the first 15X vehicles to have been scrapped. However, as future casualty of the DDA regulations then who knows?

As for the sagging of 153s, it seems to be a common thing that's been going on for quite some time - a friend of mine once commented on one of the examples that was stored in Eastleigh Works back in 2007. Mind you, blooming thing wouldnt start most of the time either.

This one appears to be suffering some of the characteristic sagging - Hold a piece of paper up above the cantrail line and you'll just about notice it's not completley straight.

http://ukrailwaypics.smugmug.com/UK...79068_3LD4kF#!i=1435643990&k=7t27Ftw&lb=1&s=A

http://ukrailwaypics.smugmug.com/UK...79068_3LD4kF#!i=1238195884&k=9gnTTd5&lb=1&s=A

 

[dubscottie]

I cant find pics of the interior, but could a central partition have been removed during refurbishment at some point to squeeze more seats in?

I remember reading that the Mk2 B/C's were bad for sagging also due to there being poor support of the central part of the bodyshell.

 

[fgwrich]

Nope, the central partition seems to still be fitted to all 153s. Same goes for all Mk3s (bar FGW's), although these fortunatly are not suffering any sagging problems either (I should hope not with their impressive stretched skin/monocoque construction).

 

[sprinterguy]

And carriages that have been scrapped due to accident damage?

I think that Jonny meant as an entire (or the most part of a) class.

And mentioning the class 151s is only splitting hairs really, as they were only two prototype units.

 

[northwichcat]

That's quite an interesting photo. I had no idea that 15* units could work in multiple with modern stuff.

It used to be the case that almost any DMU could work in multiple with almost any DMU. Then the newer Alstom and Siemens units came along.

 

[dosxuk]

It used to be the case that almost any DMU could work in multiple with almost any DMU. Then the newer Alstom and Siemens units came along.

158s & 159s?

165s & 15xs?

 

[HSTEd]

158s & 159s?

158s can work with 159s, that nonsense about different couplers being fitted is just that, nonsense.
They do it all the time on SWT.

 

[starrymarkb]

158s can work with 159s, that nonsense about different couplers being fitted is just that, nonsense.
They do it all the time on SWT.

I believe initially they couldn't as 159s have an extra brake wire in the coupler, but common sense soon prevailed and a mod was made to allow them to work with sprinters.

 

[northwichcat]

158s & 159s?

165s & 15xs?

Note the word 'almost' in my post. The number of 16xs is very small in comparison to the total number of DMUs around.

 

[TEW]

And you can have 165s and 168s and 165s and 172s.

 

[172212]

I have noticed on some units the window seems a lot higher than expected, if this is the 'sag' that we're discussing.

 

[sprinterguy]

I have noticed on some units the window seems a lot higher than expected, if this is the 'sag' that we're discussing.

The windows on the Leyland Sprinters have been criticised for being too high since they were originally introduced as class 155s. I don't think that this has anything to do with the body sag issue, as it would presumably affect the floor height the same as the height of the windows.