Class 175 future speculation

[BillStampy]

I thought I read somewhere on here someone had seen one at Laira.

Unsure if one has moved from Ely Papworth, so I don't think that's true, as more people would've noticed.. always could've though

 

[irish_rail]

Have heard they want them in service by December. How likely that is I don't know!

 

[BillStampy]

Have heard they want them in service by December. How likely that is I don't know!

Seems pretty unrealistic to have them all trained up in time when none have even moved over yet! (from my knowledge)

 

[Whistler40145]

How many units are ready to run or requiring little attention?

 

[Western 52]

Not sure if this is a silly question or not, but as it's a while since any 175s were driven, and they are moved around using class 37s, do any drivers now still sign them? If not who trains the GWR drivers?

 

[BillStampy]

Not sure if this is a silly question or not, but as it's a while since any 175s were driven, and they are moved around using class 37s, do any drivers now still sign them? If not who trains the GWR drivers?

You do have 175s being driven to Papworth by themselves, remember that. So I think some will be able to train GWR drivers or they use the training one at Chester.

 

[The exile]

Seems pretty unrealistic to have them all trained up in time when none have even moved over yet! (from my knowledge)

If December has been mentioned, more likely to be getting the first one into service - on a nice captive diagram somewhere.

 

[Xavi]

If December has been mentioned, more likely to be getting the first one into service - on a nice captive diagram somewhere.

Agreed - HST replacement in Cornwall plus Okehampton & Barnstaple.

 

[Sly Old Fox]

Considering it hasn’t been officially announced that GWR are having them yet (and there isn’t one at Laira), having them in service for December sounds optimistic.

 

[Russel]

December would be very welcome, but, it sounds far too optimistic to be true.

 

[Meerkat]

What is the minimum viable 175 service - ie diagrams with the least number of trained drivers required?
Obviously the maintainers need training too, and being based in Laira means you need crew trained to get them there , rather than just Okehampton for example.

 

[Elecman]

Wonder whoever takes them will move the Simulator from Vhestercstatuon ? Also they would need to replicate the Underframe Wash unit that was used at Chester depot that unit was specifically programmed to miss washing certain ‘sensitive’ areas of the underframes

 

[Snow1964]

Indirectly related to the speculation, as some of the released turbos and 158s are expected to enhance services around Bristol.

New article says Metrowest (the Bristol suburban services) aiming for 2.7m extra journeys. (not sure how many extra units per day are needed to carry that number)

The programme as a whole will create over 2.7m new rail journeys and give 100,000 more people access to the railway – for even more work, leisure and travel opportunities.

The West of England Combined Authority has funded the £215m programme, which is a collaboration between us, Department for Transport and the four local authorities.

Bringing better connections to the West of England - Network Rail

We’re working hard to create better rail links in Bristol and the West of England to bring you even more opportunities. Find out more.

www.networkrail.co.uk

 

[The exile]

Indirectly related to the speculation, as some of the released turbos and 158s are expected to enhance services around Bristol.

New article says Metrowest (the Bristol suburban services) aiming for 2.7m extra journeys. (not sure how many extra units per day are needed to carry that number)

Bringing better connections to the West of England - Network Rail

We’re working hard to create better rail links in Bristol and the West of England to bring you even more opportunities. Find out more.

www.networkrail.co.uk

Five of the 7 new stations could probably be served with no extra stock at all (though the Henbury extension to the Filton Shuttle might be a bit too tight on current timings).

 

[dutchbedford]

Yep. Charfield is already timed into one of the 2tph between GCR and BPW, hence why Yate has 2tph but Cam & Dursley only hourly.

 

[83G/84D]

A source at GWR has told me that Laira are expecting the first 175 unit for type familiarisation in the coming weeks. They weren’t sure if it would move there by road or rail.

That was what they were told recently.

Apparently the 2+4 HST’s will not be totally retired until May 2025.

 

[BillStampy]

A source at GWR has told me that Laira are expecting the first 175 unit for type familiarisation in the coming weeks. They weren’t sure if it would move there by road or rail.

That was what they were told recently.

Apparently the 2+4 HST’s will not be totally retired until May 2025.

If the HST sets aren't to be fully retired until May next year then that makes plenty of sense and gives GWR plenty of time to get the crew trained on the 175s and allow enough to be introduced to replace the remaining sets.

 

[Russel]

Would this give us some kind of indication as to when the first sets will potentially be in service?

 

[simonmpoulton]

Anyone heard if 175008 is getting returned to serviceable condition? Last rumour I heard was it was too badly damaged!

 

[irish_rail]

A source at GWR has told me that Laira are expecting the first 175 unit for type familiarisation in the coming weeks. They weren’t sure if it would move there by road or rail.

That was what they were told recently.

Apparently the 2+4 HST’s will not be totally retired until May 2025.

Correct. Possibly two units.

 

[irish_rail]

Would this give us some kind of indication as to when the first sets will potentially be in service?

December has been mentioned, if so no doubt as a fairly skeleton minimal service at first.

 

[craigybagel]

Given no unit has yet arrived in the Southwest (it's not even been officially confirmed that this is happening has it?!), and the units will require route clearing, traincrew will require training, as will maintenance staff (and given the units reputation, this is something that needs special attention), December definitely seems to me the earliest likely service date. That's also before you take into account that GWR may wish to make some of their own alterations (changing the livery, updating the PIS systems, restoring the driver door open controls?) before the units enter service.

Incidentally, the training course at TfW for drivers was 7 days long, and that only really scratched the surface. They're great trains to drive, but they do have rather a lot of unusual quirks.

 

[BillStampy]

Given no unit has yet arrived in the Southwest (it's not even been officially confirmed that this is happening has it?!), and the units will require route clearing, traincrew will require training, as will maintenance staff (and given the units reputation, this is something that needs special attention), December definitely seems to me the earliest likely service date. That's also before you take into account that GWR may wish to make some of their own alterations (changing the livery, updating the PIS systems, restoring the driver door open controls?) before the units enter service.

They'll change the PIS system to the GWR voice, unsure if they'd change the screens. If they were to give them a quick livery to launch them into service, slap a few GWR stickers on there and paint the doors green and you got yourself a temporary livery before moving it to a full refurbishment and livery.

 

[Energy]

They'll change the PIS system to the GWR voice, unsure if they'd change the screens. If they were to give them a quick livery to launch them into service, slap a few GWR stickers on there and paint the doors green and you got yourself a temporary livery before moving it to a full refurbishment and livery.

I've done a mockup of GWR full (left) and GWR lazy (right).



Credit for base image: @WestRail642fan via Wikipedia/Wikimedia Commons.

Inside there are red seat handles, TfW seat cushions and stickers. Stickers will almost certainly be replaced, and cushions would be changed when the existing ones are worn. I wouldn't be surprised if the red seat handles remained, blue panels still exist on the LNWR class 350/1s despite being refurbished. The TfW interior is in pretty good condition.

Green doors and a white body would be a pretty terrible temporary livery as the proper GWR livery would require the doors to be repainted. If we get a temporary livery I expect TfW with GWR stickers until a full vinyl wrap can be done.

Given the recent pinch on railway finance, I'd assume the least and hope for the best! EMR certainly got lucky that the refurbishment was signed off when it was.

 

[Envoy]

If these trains are just sitting around and available, why don’t they just get on with it and get them over to GWR for training? The situation of having some London trains running as 5 car IET’s is not good. I presume this is because 5 car IET’s are being used on Cardiff to south-west services?

Having the 175’s go to GWR would also mean that some 158’s could go to the Portsmouth to Cardiff route - not that they are ideal with their useless air conditioning but at least they have a through corridor connection and will provide additional capacity on this busy route.

 

[BillStampy]

If these trains are just sitting around and available, why don’t they just get in with it and get them over to GWR for training? The situation of having some London trains running as 5 car IET’s is not good. I presume this is because 5 car IET’s are being used on Cardiff to south-west services?

Having the 175’s go to GWR would also mean that some 158’s could go to the Portsmouth to Cardiff route - not that they are ideal with their useless air conditioning but at least they have a through corridor connection and will provide additional capacity on this busy route.

There was a 9 car IET on Taunton/Penzance to Cardiff yesterday, which isn't ideal. So presumably some of those IET services will be replaced by 175s, other services to free up 150s or 158s are also a possibility.

 

[The exile]

If these trains are just sitting around and available, why don’t they just get in with it and get them over to GWR for training? The situation of having some London trains running as 5 car IET’s is not good. I presume this is because 5 car IET’s are being used on Cardiff to south-west services?

Having the 175’s go to GWR would also mean that some 158’s could go to the Portsmouth to Cardiff route - not that they are ideal with their useless air conditioning but at least they have a through corridor connection and will provide additional capacity on this busy route.

Who are “they”, though?

 

[Snow1964]

If these trains are just sitting around and available, why don’t they just get in with it and get them over to GWR for training?

I don't think the transfer has been authorised yet, presumably still at idea stage, or more probably at the haven't agreed all the details stage.

From memory, it is rare for any new contracts to be announced in August when Parliament is in recess and many staff on holidays. So I could easily see nothing officially happening for another 5+ weeks.

 

[irish_rail]

I don't think the transfer has been authorised yet, presumably still at idea stage, or more probably at the haven't agreed all the details stage.

From memory, it is rare for any new contracts to be announced in August when Parliament is in recess and many staff on holidays. So I could easily see nothing officially happening for another 5+ weeks.

Just to add, there would be zero chance of starting 175 training right now during high summer as driver resources are stretched to the max anyway. Driver training from October ish is more doable. Out West we have a lot of extra work in the summer months, so suddenly removing several drivers a day for 175 training wouldn't be happening before late September absolute earliest.

 

[HamworthyGoods]

If these trains are just sitting around and available, why don’t they just get on with it and get them over to GWR for training? The situation of having some London trains running as 5 car IET’s is not good. I presume this is because 5 car IET’s are being used on Cardiff to south-west services?

Who is they?
If it was a private industry yes, however being pseudo nationalised this requires government sign off and this takes time.