Class 701 'Aventra' trains for South Western Railway: progress updates

[PG]

There is a known issue with door air on the Aventra platform which is causing a lot of issues at the moment. Fixes are being developed and will be rolled out in due course.

Do you know if this is affecting other TOCs as well as SWT?

 

[Goldfish62]

Do you know if this is affecting other TOCs as well as SWT?

It has certainly affected the 345s in the past, among many other issues. Don't know if it's still a problem with them.

So not just confined to SWR.

 

[OneTrackMinded]

There is a known issue with door air on the Aventra platform which is causing a lot of issues at the moment. Fixes are being developed and will be rolled out in due course.

They’re finally working on a fix? Great news. Although I don’t understand what is meant by “door air”. Surely that wouldn’t apply to an electronically driven system like what is present on the Aventras?

 

[bb21]

They’re finally working on a fix? Great news. Although I don’t understand what is meant by “door air”. Surely that wouldn’t apply to an electronically driven system like what is present on the Aventras?

I won't say "finally" . They have been working on it since the other Aventra fleets came into service, however the 701s only started experiencing them of late. There is a fix but it isn't as simple as just implementing the same ones on all Aventra fleets. Without getting into the technical side too much, it is to do with air pressure in the system, which causes a spurious object being detected, and warmer weather will bring higher usage of air-conditioning, which builds up more air, or so I was of the understanding from my source. The previous door issues from weeks ago weren't related to this one.

It has certainly affected the 345s in the past, among many other issues. Don't know if it's still a problem with them.

So not just confined to SWR.

Correct. 345s and 720s both suffered from it AIUI.

 

[boiledbeans2]

Was at the country London-end of Clapham Junction today, watching a Shepperton-bound 701 enter the station.

Wow, it entered the platform at such speed, that I thought it wasn't going to stop at the station!
Driver probably slammed full brakes and brought it to stop exactly at the right position, as if it was a LU train on ATO. No inching forward/creeping in the last bit.

I already knew SWR drivers pushed their trains hard. On the Clapham Junction overbridge, you can always hear the Class 455 motors/gearbox howling while decelerating, in contrast to the SE-land, where their drivers crawl into the stations with their 465s.

But wow, I'm sure the 701s could shorten journey times! When fully rolled out of couse...

EDIT: corrected country-end to London-end

 

[TRAX]

There is a known issue with door air on the Aventra platform which is causing a lot of issues at the moment.

Aren’t the doors on the Aventra fully electric ?

 

[Goldfish62]

Was at the country-end of Clapham Junction today, watching a Shepperton-bound 701 enter the station.

Wow, it entered the platform at such speed, that I thought it wasn't going to stop at the station!
Driver probably slammed full brakes and brought it to stop exactly at the right position, as if it was a LU train on ATO. No inching forward/creeping in the last bit.

I already knew SWR drivers pushed their trains hard. On the Clapham Junction overbridge, you can always hear the Class 455 motors/gearbox howling while decelerating, in contrast to the SE-land, where their drivers crawl into the stations with their 465s.

But wow, I'm sure the 701s could shorten journey times! When fully rolled out of couse...

I've noticed this with 701s. The drivers are clearly confident with the braking. Add in the almost instantaneous door release and it's really going to help, certainly in respect of maintaining punctuality.

 

[DMckduck]

I've noticed this with 701s. The drivers are clearly confident with the braking. Add in the almost instantaneous door release and it's really going to help, certainly in respect of maintaining punctuality.

I've noticed the doors being released far too quickly in some instances, I wonder what the SWR driving policy states referencing arrival into station, platform checks and door release.

 

[Goldfish62]

I've noticed the doors being released far too quickly in some instances, I wonder what the SWR driving policy states referencing arrival into station, platform checks and door release.

You'd better report it then if you're concerned. It sounds like you have some safety role in the railways.

What are these platform checks that the drivers have to undertake, given that they've drawn alongside the platform in the last few seconds?

 

[DMckduck]

You'd better report it then if you're concerned. It sounds like you have some safety role in the railways.

What are these platform checks that the drivers have to undertake, given that they've drawn alongside the platform in the last few seconds?

Train Secured/Brake applied
Correct SCM for formation
Correct side door release

I would hazard a guess, that some part of that process is being disregarded with instant door release.

3-5 seconds for those checks would be ballpark I reckon, maybe DOO drivers could chime in on this one?

 

[Goldfish62]

Train Secured/Brake applied
Correct SCM for formation
Correct side door release

I would hazard a guess, that some part of that process is being disregarded with instant door release.

3-5 seconds for those checks would be ballpark I reckon, maybe DOO drivers could chime in on this one?

If that's that case then many drivers on GWR, Southern and Southeastern, all of which I regularly use, are in breach. And you'd have a fit if you travelled on the Underground.

 

[absolutelymilk]

Train Secured/Brake applied
Correct SCM for formation
Correct side door release

I would hazard a guess, that some part of that process is being disregarded with instant door release.

3-5 seconds for those checks would be ballpark I reckon, maybe DOO drivers could chime in on this one?

What does SCM stand for?

 

[Nimbus020]

Appreciate that this isn't directly about the 701s (although maybe pointing to the need to get the 701s into service as quickly as possible) - is solo '455' 455 858 still blocking Plat 1 @ Surbiton? (since early this morning) - many thanks

 

[Bumpkin]

What does SCM stand for?

Stop Car Mark

 

[norbitonflyer]

Appreciate that this isn't directly about the 701s (although maybe pointing to the need to get the 701s into service as quickly as possible) - is solo '455' 455 858 still blocking Plat 1 @ Surbiton? (since early this morning) - many thanks

OTT shows 2F10 (0632 Woking to Waterloo, due at Surbiton at 0656) still at platform 1 at 1215, with a 1Z99 behind it - possibly a rescue train? Hampton Court services have been cancelled all morning (as up Hampton Court services can only access platform 1 at Surbiton ) and no services calling at Berrylands (as there is no Up fast/Up slow crossover between Surbiton and Berrylands - Control do not seem to have taken the seemingly obvious measure of adding Berrylands calls to the down Woking or Cobham line stoppers)

 

[Highview]

I've just watched the 8 car rescue train being attached to the 4 car in platform 1.

 

[swtrains]

They have just added a replacement bus service calling at Berrylands, Surbiton, Thames Ditton, Hampton Court.
2J29 is running, first one not to be cancelled since this morning, so the line should be clear soon.

 

[Big Jumby 74]

Hampton Court services have been cancelled all morning (as up Hampton Court services can only access platform 1 at Surbiton )

May be things have changed, or perhaps the easy option taken, but Hampton Court shuttles (were) able to run over the down line using p4 at Surbiton. Suspect it's a case of minimum cost in crew provision etc is dictating things these days?

 

[norbitonflyer]

May be things have changed, or perhaps the easy option taken, but Hampton Court shuttles (were) able to run over the down line using p4 at Surbiton. Suspect it's a case of minimum cost in crew provision etc is dictating things these days?

I think they still could, but that ties up platform 4 whilst they are turning round, so meaning all down calling trains have to use platform 3. With all up trains having to use the up fast, that would probably going to make the overall timetable even harder to recover.

 

[Nimbus020]

I think they still could, but that ties up platform 4 whilst they are turning round, so meaning all down calling trains have to use platform 3. With all up trains having to use the up fast, that would probably going to make the overall timetable even harder to recover.

5F10 was 455 Nos 858, 729 & 716 according to RTT - 1st time I've seen a 12-car 455 formation on RTT

 

[bahnause]

You'd better report it then if you're concerned. It sounds like you have some safety role in the railways.

What are these platform checks that the drivers have to undertake, given that they've drawn alongside the platform in the last few seconds?

DOO driver from the continent here:

Select door release during approach, the doors open automatically when the train stops.
The train secures itself (holding brake).
If I stop at the 200m board, it is because I am convinced that my train is 200m long. Even a second check will not change this. The same applies to the platform side, selecting this during entry even helps me, because the platform is in plain sight. After stopping at the end of the platform, this is no longer necessarily the case.

 

[Ethano92]

DOO driver from the continent here:

Select door release during approach, the doors open automatically when the train stops.
The train secures itself (holding brake).
If I stop at the 200m board, it is because I am convinced that my train is 200m long. Even a second check will not change this. The same applies to the platform side, selecting this during entry even helps me, because the platform is in plain sight. After stopping at the end of the platform, this is no longer necessarily the case.

Interesting to hear from a driver on the continent. I was going to make the point that doors release so fast on many DOO trains I’ve used in France and Germany it must be automatic but I wasn’t sure.

I know it’s no good comparing metro operations to mainline but some lines on the Paris metro have the door interlock release before the train has come to a stop. Occasionally it’s to the point people wait for the train to slow a little more before stepping off even though the doors are already fully open in front of them. Just a funny comparison to the UK’s intense attitude to Health and Safety.

 

[NSEWonderer]

From what I can see from the Waterloo LTP diagrams, 701 diagrams will as follow on the daily circuits from these headcodes, please remember that these all won't go over to 701s from next Monday.

2H05
2H87 -> 2H94 -> 2R15
1D12 and so on alternating with 2J services
2O03
2O05
2D15 and so on alternating with 2J services
2D28 and so on alternating with 2J services
1H90 -> 2R55
2V53 (seems to be on a new circuit as currently it's included in the 2S diagrams which seem to have no 701s on them yet)
2H97 -> 2H64
2M71

Expected 701 Diagrams From May Timetable:

No.1: 701 Diagram
Starts at Clapham Sidings - 5O05 -> 2O05 -> 2K09 -> 2O17 -> 2K21 -> 2O29 -> 2K33 -> 2O41 -> 2K45 -> 2V53 -> 5V53 - Ends At Feltham Depot

No.2: 701 Diagram
Starts at Clapham Yard Sidings – 5D11 → 1D12 → 2J13 → 2J20 → 2D19 → 2D32 → 2J33 → 2J40 → 2D39 → 2D52 → 2J53 → 2J60 → 2D59 → 2D72 → 2J73 → 2J98 → 5Y75 – Ends at Wimbledon Park Depot Siding

No.3: 701 Diagram
Starts at Feltham Depot – 5U04 → 2U04 → 2H85 → 2H92 → 2H91 → 5H91 → 5H90 → 1H90 → 2R55 → 5R55 – Ends at Feltham Depot

No.4: 701 Diagram
Starts at Feltham Depot – 5U08 → 2U08 → 2U11 → 2U18 → 2U21 → 2U28 → 2U31 → 2U38 → 2U41 → 2U48 → 2U51 → 2U58 → 2U61 → 2U68 → 2U71 → 2U78 → 5U78 – Ends at Feltham Depot

No.5: 701 Diagram
Starts at Feltham Depot – 5U07 → 2U07 → 2U14 → 2U17 → 2U24 → 5Y88 → 5Y83 → 5U45 → 2U45 → 2U52 → 2U55 → 2U62 → 2U65 → 2U72 → 2U73 – Ends at Waterloo

No.6: 701 Diagram
Starts at Strawberry Hill Depot – 5O01 → 2O01 → 1D05 → 1D14 → 2J15 → 2J22 → 1D21 → 1D30 → 2J31 → 2J38 → 1D37 → 1D46 → 2J47 → 2J54 → 2D53 → 2D64 → 2J65 → 2J72 → 2M71 → 2M96 → 5M96 – Ends at Waterloo

No.7: 701 Diagram
Starts at Strawberry Hill Depot – 5H89 → 2H90 → 2H89 → 2H96 → 5Y82 → 5H93 → 2H93 → 2H60 → 2H59 → 2H68 → 2H67 → 2H76 → 2H77 → 5H84 – Ends at Strawberry Hill Depot

No.8: 701 Diagram
Starts at Strawberry Hill Depot – 5H08 → 2H08 → 2H07 → 2H16 → 2H15 → 2H24 → 2H23 → 2H32 → 2H31 → 2H40 → 2H39 → 2H48 → 2H47 → 2H56 → 2H55 → 5H64 → 2U69 → 2U76 → 2K77 → 5K77 – Ends at Strawberry Hill Depot

No.9: 701 Diagram
Starts at Strawberry Hill Depot – 5H05 → 2H05 → 2H14 → 2H13 → 2H22 → 2H21 → 2H30 → 2H29 → 2H38 → 2H37 → 2H46 → 2H45 → 2H54 → 2H53 → 2H62 → 2H61 → 2H70 → 2H69 → 2H78 → 5Y41 – Ends at Clapham Yard Sidings

No.10: 701 Diagram
Starts at Waterloo – 2O03 → 2K07 → 2O15 → 2K19 → 2O27 → 2K31 → 2O39 → 2K43 → 2O51 → 2K55 → 2O63 → 2K67 → 5Y37 – Ends at Clapham Yard Sidings

No.11: 701 Diagram
Starts at Waterloo – 2H87 → 2H94 → 2R15 → 5Y87 → 5Y87 → 5V49 → 5V49 → 2V49 → 2H97 → 2H64 → 2H63 → 2H72 → 2H71 → 5H80 – Ends at Strawberry Hill Depot

No.12: 701 Diagram
Starts at Wimbledon Park Depot Siding – 5D89 → 5D89 → 5D90 → 2D90 → 2J09 → 2J16 → 2D15 → 2D28 → 2J29 → 2J36 → 2D35 → 2D48 → 2J49 → 2J56 → 2D55 → 2D68 → 2J69 → 2J76 → 5Y65 → 5Y65 – Ends at Wimbledon Park Depot Siding

No.13: 701 Diagram
Starts at Wimbledon Park Depot Siding – 5U09 → 5U09 → 2U09 → 2U16 → 2U19 → 2U26 → 2U29 → 2U36 → 2U39 → 2U46 → 2U49 → 2U56 → 2U59 → 2U66 → 5Y92 → 5Y92 – Ends at Wimbledon Park Depot Siding

No.14: 701 Diagram
Starts at Wimbledon Pk Depot Siding – 5J90 → 5J90 → 5J92 → 5J92 → 2J92 → 5J93 → 5Y52 → 5Y52→ 5O53 → 5O53 → 2053 → 2K57 → 2O65 → 2K69 → 2O77 → 5O77 – Ends at Strawberry Hill Depot

 

[stuu]

Train Secured/Brake applied
Correct SCM for formation
Correct side door release

I would hazard a guess, that some part of that process is being disregarded with instant door release.

3-5 seconds for those checks would be ballpark I reckon, maybe DOO drivers could chime in on this one?

I assume you never travelled on a C stock on the Underground - drivers would open the doors a fraction before the train stopped

 

[vuzzeho]

I assume you never travelled on a C stock on the Underground - drivers would open the doors a fraction before the train stopped

Still do it on the Victoria line today!

 

[TT-ONR-NRN]

Expected 701 Diagrams From May Timetable:

No.12: 701 Diagram
Starts at Wimbledon Park Depot Siding – 5D89 → 5D89 → 5D90 → 2J09 → 2J16 → 2D15 → 2D38 2D28 → 2J39 2J29 → 2J54 2J36 → 2D53 2D35 → 2D34 2D48 → 2J48 2J49 → 2J66 2J56 → 2D55 → 2D56 → 2D68 → 2J69 → 2J76 → 5Y65 → 5Y65 – Ends at Wimbledon Park Depot Siding

No.14: 701 Diagram
Starts at Wimbledon Pk Depot Siding – 5Y90 → 5Y92 → 2J92 → 2J93 → 5Y52 → 5O53 → 2O53 → 2K57 → 2O56 2O65 → 2K69 → 2O77 → 5O77 – Ends at Strawberry Hill Depot

Thanks so much for this, hugely appreciated. I hope you won't be offended but I believe there were a couple of incorrect head codes for Diagram 12 and 14, if I'm not very much mistaken, which I've identified here.

 

[NSEWonderer]

Thanks so much for this, hugely appreciated. I hope you won't be offended but I believe there were a couple of incorrect head codes for Diagram 12 and 14, if I'm not very much mistaken, which I've identified here.

Cheers! few corrections needed on that haha, typed it up in a rush. Should all be amended now, thanks again!

 

[TT-ONR-NRN]

Cheers! few corrections needed on that haha, typed it up in a rush. Should all be amended now, thanks again!

You're very welcome and thanks much for posting.

So for those wishing to catch 701s, the following departures from Waterloo should be booked 701 from the timetable change:

00:01 Strawberry Hill via Richmond
05:30 Teddington via Richmond
05:57 Shepperton via Richmond
06:00 Teddington via Richmond
06:15 Shepperton via Richmond
06:33 Windsor & Eton Riverside via Richmond
06:57 Strawberry Hill via Kingston
07:03 Windsor & Eton Riverside via Richmond
07:06 Hampton Court
07:27 Strawberry Hill via Kingston
08:06 Hampton Court
08:12 Shepperton via Kingston
08:13 Strawberry Hill via Richmond
08:30 Teddington via Richmond
08:33 Windsor & Eton Riverside via Richmond
08:45 Hounslow via Richmond
08:54 Guildford via Epsom
09:00 Teddington via Richmond
09:03 Windsor & Eton Riverside via Richmond
09:33 Windsor & Eton Riverside via Richmond
09:54 Guildford via Epsom
09:57 Strawberry Hill via Kingston
10:12 Shepperton via Kingston
10:27 Strawberry Hill via Kingston
11:30 Teddington via Richmond
11:33 Windsor & Eton Riverside via Richmond
12:00 Teddington via Richmond
12:03 Windsor & Eton Riverside via Richmond
12:06 Hampton Court
12:12 Shepperton via Kingston
12:57 Strawberry Hill via Kingston
13:06 Hampton Court
13:27 Strawberry Hill via Kingston
13:54 Guildford via Epsom
14:03 Windsor & Eton Riverside via Richmond
14:12 Shepperton via Kingston
14:30 Teddington via Richmond
14:33 Windsor & Eton Riverside via Richmond
14:54 Guildford via Epsom
15:00 Teddington via Richmond
15:33 Windsor & Eton Riverside via Richmond
15:57 Strawberry Hill via Kingston
16:12 Shepperton via Kingston
16:27 Strawberry Hill via Kingston
16:33 Windsor & Eton Riverside via Richmond
17:03 Windsor & Eton Riverside via Richmond
17:06 Hampton Court
17:07 Hounslow via Brentford
17:30 Teddington via Richmond
18:00 Teddington via Richmond
18:03 Windsor & Eton Riverside via Richmond
18:06 Hampton Court
18:07 Twickenham via Brentford
18:12 Shepperton via Kingston
18:43 Shepperton via Richmond
18:45 Hounslow via Richmond
18:54 Guildford via Epsom
18:57 Strawberry Hill via Kingston
19:27 Strawberry Hill via Kingston
19:33 Windsor & Eton Riverside via Richmond
19:54 Guildford via Epsom
20:03 Windsor & Eton Riverside via Richmond
20:12 Shepperton via Kingston
20:30 Teddington via Richmond
20:33 Windsor & Eton Riverside via Richmond
20:42 Shepperton via Kingston
21:00 Teddington via Richmond
21:57 Strawberry Hill via Kingston
22:03 Windsor & Eton Riverside via Richmond
22:06 Hampton Court
22:12 Shepperton via Kingston
22:27 Strawberry Hill via Kingston
22:33 Windsor & Eton Riverside via Richmond
22:42 Shepperton via Kingston
23:00 Chessington South
23:06 Hampton Court

 

[NSEWonderer]

You're very welcome and thanks much for posting.

So for those wishing to catch 701s, the following departures from Waterloo should be booked 701 from the timetable change:

00:01 Strawberry Hill via Richmond
05:30 Teddington via Richmond
05:57 Shepperton via Richmond
06:00 Teddington via Richmond
06:15 Shepperton via Richmond
06:33 Windsor & Eton Riverside via Richmond
06:57 Strawberry Hill via Kingston
07:03 Windsor & Eton Riverside via Richmond
07:06 Hampton Court
07:27 Strawberry Hill via Kingston
08:06 Hampton Court
08:12 Shepperton via Kingston
08:13 Strawberry Hill via Richmond
08:30 Teddington via Richmond
08:33 Windsor & Eton Riverside via Richmond
08:45 Hounslow via Richmond
08:54 Guildford via Epsom
09:00 Teddington via Richmond
09:03 Windsor & Eton Riverside via Richmond
09:33 Windsor & Eton Riverside via Richmond
09:54 Guildford via Epsom
09:57 Strawberry Hill via Kingston
10:12 Shepperton via Kingston
10:27 Strawberry Hill via Kingston
11:30 Teddington via Richmond
11:33 Windsor & Eton Riverside via Richmond
12:00 Teddington via Richmond
12:03 Windsor & Eton Riverside via Richmond
12:06 Hampton Court
12:12 Shepperton via Kingston
12:57 Strawberry Hill via Kingston
13:06 Hampton Court
13:27 Strawberry Hill via Kingston
13:54 Guildford via Epsom
14:03 Windsor & Eton Riverside via Richmond
14:12 Shepperton via Kingston
14:30 Teddington via Richmond
14:33 Windsor & Eton Riverside via Richmond
14:54 Guildford via Epsom
15:00 Teddington via Richmond
15:33 Windsor & Eton Riverside via Richmond
15:57 Strawberry Hill via Kingston
16:12 Shepperton via Kingston
16:27 Strawberry Hill via Kingston
16:33 Windsor & Eton Riverside via Richmond
17:03 Windsor & Eton Riverside via Richmond
17:06 Hampton Court
17:07 Hounslow via Brentford
17:30 Teddington via Richmond
18:00 Teddington via Richmond
18:03 Windsor & Eton Riverside via Richmond
18:06 Hampton Court
18:07 Twickenham via Brentford
18:12 Shepperton via Kingston
18:43 Shepperton via Richmond
18:45 Hounslow via Richmond
18:54 Guildford via Epsom
18:57 Strawberry Hill via Kingston
19:27 Strawberry Hill via Kingston
19:33 Windsor & Eton Riverside via Richmond
19:54 Guildford via Epsom
20:03 Windsor & Eton Riverside via Richmond
20:12 Shepperton via Kingston
20:30 Teddington via Richmond
20:33 Windsor & Eton Riverside via Richmond
20:42 Shepperton via Kingston
21:00 Teddington via Richmond
21:57 Strawberry Hill via Kingston
22:03 Windsor & Eton Riverside via Richmond
22:06 Hampton Court
22:12 Shepperton via Kingston
22:27 Strawberry Hill via Kingston
22:33 Windsor & Eton Riverside via Richmond
22:42 Shepperton via Kingston
23:00 Teddington via Richmond
23:06 Hampton Court

No problem and Indeed they will be, won't be instantly as swr444 mentioned but it will be quicker than previous diagram introductions as more drivers are getting through the training and more units are trialing for passenger readiness.

 

[boiledbeans2]

Still do it on the Victoria line today!

And Bakerloo - a manual-driven line.