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Class 701 'Aventra' trains for South Western Railway

OneTrackMinded

OneTrackMinded

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Goldfish62 said:
That's a new one on me as a reason for not having seat-back tables! More like it was simply down to cost.
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No apparently this is actually a thing. I spoke to a driver once about the tray tables and they specifically mentioned something about the cleaning requirement that comes with them.
I would say it was a mixture of both, cost and the cleaning. At least we got a table in some capacity at all unlike on the 707s where there is nothing.
 
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Dr_Intoxicated

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I am sure I heard that SWR claimed that it slowed up unloading at stations at a time when they were trying to shave seconds off dwell times. Passengers waiting until the last moment to stow tables and struggling to exit

Some of the earlier discussions on dwell times.
Ethano92 said:
They'll likely have vinyl flooring I suspect but carpet would be preferred in walk through trains, it would help sound not travel as far through the train. From what i've seen: no arm rests, seats without spacers in between for a wide aisle (although there will be a space between the wall and window seat so you can fit your arm, a design flaw on the 700s)no tables to help station dwell times and supposedly no seat back tables too?

Either way I'm sure they'll be liked, especially by regular 455 commuters in summer. Aventura air con appears to be more forceful than any other new trains I've been on but that's anecdotal so can't say for certain.
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Dr_Intoxicated said:
I don't buy the effect of seat back tables on dwell times. Experienced commuters have the table stowed ready for exit.

(Edit). Also the extra width gained by removing seat spacers, CA 15cm does not make up for the loss of comfort, indeed passengers sitting sidewise with their legs in the aisle because the seats are too close takes up much more room
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Goldfish62 said:
Indeed. The supposed issue of tables increasing dwell times was proven to be nonsense when DfT sanctioned fitting of tables to the later build 700s.

Ian Walmsley in Modern Railways has covered the impact of removing seat spacers as you correctly highlight.
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Domh245 said:
What they do impact though is 'churn' - seatback tables slow people getting in and out of seats, and given that churn was one of the higher priorities in the suburban rolling stock design process it's not surprising to see they've not been fitted.
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Bletchleyite said:
Interesting - I didn't know that. The Avanti seating plans and their seat selector doesn't show that being the case either!

Why is that?
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OneTrackMinded said:
It's a shame SWR didn't fit these with tray tables like on the 458s, I think many would have preferred that over the mini tables. Although the mini tables are bigger than a tray table could ever be.
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Goldfish62

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Dr_Intoxicated said:
I am sure I heard that SWR claimed that it slowed up unloading at stations at a time when they were trying to shave seconds off dwell times. Passengers waiting until the last moment to stow tables and struggling to exit

Some of the earlier discussions on dwell times.
Click to expand...
That old chestnut. The same claim was made about the 700s. Then tables were fitted to the later builds. Any business case to have earlier units retrofitted was killed off by Covid.
 
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norbitonflyer

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Goldfish62 said:
Perhaps (037 on today) was the small bit of good news we've been promised. :lol:
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Not really news - it was on as recently as last Tuesday.

I expect the promised news, like everything to do with this project, has been delayed. We might get a word later this month - but just the one: the rest of the announcement will be delivered next year.
 
SEtrains

SEtrains

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701020, 701021, 701055, 701505, 701506, 701513 and 701514 are now accepted by swr.
Missing units:
001-003, 005, 007-008, 010, 053, 057-060, 501-504, 517-530 (30 units)
Accepted units:
60 units
 
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OneTrackMinded

OneTrackMinded

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Those close to the 701 project, does anyone know why the decision was made not to place open buttons on the doors themselves like on the 710? Since one of the aims of this stock was reducing dwell time, I'm surprised this wasn't something that was put into practice. (710 on left, 701 on right)
442479526_122173305182083619_2933982109442781215_n.jpg442416161_122173305230083619_645566132743763745_n.jpg
 
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60159

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SEtrains said:
701020, 701021, 701055, 701505, 701506, 701513 and 701514 are now accepted by swr.
Missing units:
001-003, 005, 007-008, 010, 053, 057-060, 501-504, 517-530 (28 units)
Accepted units:
62 units
Click to expand...
Is it not 60/30?
 
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Benjwri

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OneTrackMinded said:
Those close to the 701 project, does anyone know why the decision was made not to place open buttons on the doors themselves like on the 710? Since one of the aims of this stock was reducing dwell time, I'm surprised this wasn't something that was put into practice. (710 on left, 701 on right)
View attachment 158483View attachment 158484
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I imagine money will be the answer. Presumably the door buttons on a 710 are wireless.
 
H

hwl

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7,450
OneTrackMinded said:
Those close to the 701 project, does anyone know why the decision was made not to place open buttons on the doors themselves like on the 710? Since one of the aims of this stock was reducing dwell time, I'm surprised this wasn't something that was put into practice. (710 on left, 701 on right)
View attachment 158483View attachment 158484
Click to expand...
Probably reliability - Historically buttons on doors are less reliable...

Benjwri said:
Presumably the door buttons on a 710 are wireless.
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Highly unlikely - the wiring to the button on the doors is more complicated and historically likely to give issues - the doors have non wireless pressure sensors behind the rubber strip anyway so very likely to be wired as safety critical wireless is "interesting".
 
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dingdinger

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Talking of door buttons I have noticed both on a 701 and 710s when they are heavily loaded and someone is leaning on the button the doors do not open and the out of use light is displayed. However once the passenger stops leaning on the button they are able to be released. I've seen it happen a few times. Has anyone else noticed this?
 
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kw12

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12 Jan 2017
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With Automatic Braking and Door Opening will doors be opened automatically (as with class 700 at certain stations), avoiding the need for passengers to press a door open button? Or does ABDO just release doors, for passengers to open?
 
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Waterlemon

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kw12 said:
With Automatic Braking and Door Opening will doors be opened automatically (as with class 700 at certain stations), avoiding the need for passengers to press a door open button? Or does ABDO just release doors, for passengers to open?
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I would hope it doesnt open all doors automatically as the air con would struggle on hot/cold days. Would be ideal if you could "arm" the doors by pressing the button a few seconds before the train stops and have them open as soon as they unlock.
 
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Goldfish62

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Waterlemon said:
I would hope it doesnt open all doors automatically as the air con would struggle on hot/cold days. Would be ideal if you could "arm" the doors by pressing the button a few seconds before the train stops and have them open as soon as they unlock.
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The Class 700s manages just fine with all doors opening, as does the S Stock. At busy stations it's likely that all doors are going to be opened anyway, irrespective of whether it's automatic or by passengers pressing a button.
 
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Peter Sarf

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SEtrains said:
701020, 701021, 701055, 701505, 701506, 701513 and 701514 are now accepted by swr.
Missing units:
001-003, 005, 007-008, 010, 053, 057-060, 501-504, 517-530 (28 units)
Accepted units:
62 units
Click to expand...
Check your arithmetic 28 => 30.
No idea if 7 have been accepted by SWR, certainly 5 x 701/0s have been used so they must be accepted ?.
Not sure what the other "Accepted units:" references ?. - is that what Rock Rail have set up charges for ?.
 
PG

PG

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OneTrackMinded said:
Those close to the 701 project, does anyone know why the decision was made not to place open buttons on the doors themselves like on the 710? Since one of the aims of this stock was reducing dwell time, I'm surprised this wasn't something that was put into practice. (710 on left, 701 on right)
View attachment 158483View attachment 158484
Click to expand...
I can't quite make out from your photo what the circular device is near the top of the left side leaf of the 701 doors?
 
Andy1673

Andy1673

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norbitonflyer said:
Not really news - it was on as recently as last Tuesday.

I expect the promised news, like everything to do with this project, has been delayed. We might get a word later this month - but just the one: the rest of the announcement will be delivered next year.
Click to expand...
Likely next Monday we`ll see the first full day 701 diagram (2U09-2U16-2U19-2U26-2U29-2U36-2U39-2U46-2U49-2U56-2U59-2U66) Waterloo to Windsor
And another pair of 458s will be replaced by the pair of 450s
 
N

norbitonflyer

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Andy1673 said:
Likely next Monday we`ll see the first full day 701 diagram (2U09-2U16-2U19-2U26-2U29-2U36-2U39-2U46-2U49-2U56-2U59-2U66) Waterloo to Windsor
And another pair of 458s will be replaced by the pair of 450s
Click to expand...
If a 701 works at all on Monday, it will be the first Bank Holiday that one has done so.

Andy1673 said:
No 27 May (platform allocation at WAT on RTT and absence of midday 5C39 and 5Y89 off/to Wimbledon)
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It looks like the same unit will operate all those services, but that doesn't mean it will be a 701.
 
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