Class 730 LNR & WMR Delivery/test Updates

[TT-ONR-NRN]

Other than the interiors not being that suitable for a journey like Euston to Birmingham.

Agreed - but I’d argue more so than the 350/2s.

 

[SCDR_WMR]

Other than the interiors not being that suitable for a journey like Euston to Birmingham.

In what way not suitable? Granted less seating but far more space and ease with luggage

 

[Bletchleyite]

In what way not suitable? Granted less seating but far more space and ease with luggage

And in the end Euston to Brum isn't the primary use case, it's a budget tag along on a primarily local service. If you want rock bottom prices you can't be too fussy about the seats.

 

[Peter Sarf]

And in the end Euston to Brum isn't the primary use case, it's a budget tag along on a primarily local service. If you want rock bottom prices you can't be too fussy about the seats.

Agreed 730s are OK. In fact I already prefer most 350 versions over a 390 so cannot see the point of paying Avanti fares.

 

[Kite159]

Narrow seats with no armrests & poor legroom.

Although the DfT will probably approve as it will encourage more take-up of the faster Avanti fares

 

[TT-ONR-NRN]

Agreed 730s are OK. In fact I already prefer most 350 versions over a 390 so cannot see the point of paying Avanti fares.

This point of view will never cease to amaze me.

 

[Class15]

This point of view will never cease to amaze me.

It’s personal opinion, which I also agree with. Your opinion is that 390s are more comfortable, and I don’t have an issue with that at all. But @Peter Sarf and I have a different opinion.

Aware that I put the wrong user in, corrected.

 

[TT-ONR-NRN]

It’s personal opinion, which I also agree with. Your opinion is that 390s are more comfortable, and I don’t have an issue with that at all. But @Peter Sarf and I have a different opinion.

Aware that I put the wrong user in, corrected.

Correct, I’m well aware of that, so you don’t need to be so mind-numbingly patronising. I never said it was wrong, and as I famously hate people presenting opinions as fact I wouldn’t ever see it as wrong either.

 

[Roger B]

This point of view will never cease to amaze me.

I agree with Peter and Class15!
The refurbishment of the 390s has been detrimental in most factors that are important to me. The alignment of seats to windows is poor; the high and wide seatbacks makes it even more difficult to get a view out of any window - there are relatively few seats in a standard carriage where you can sit with a good forward-facing view of out a window (and operators have had the gall to promote them with adds showing happy faces looking out of the window!). Added to other factors (admittedly not impacted by refurbishment) - ie the ratio of window length to carriage length, which must be one of the lowest in the UK; and the windows not being very tall add to the sense of being enclosed within a metal tube.
For several years I've been travelling between Manchester and London via Sheffield - the EMT voyagers seem wide and airy in comparison, with better alignment of seats to windows, and more space and plenty of choices for a decent forward view - and you get an earlier arrival into London on an off-peak ticket, and can enjoy outstanding views of the Peak District en route - what's not to like?
That said, I had my first ride on a 807 the other day - from Milton Keynes Central to Crewe day. Wow! Beats a Pendo hands down in pretty-much every way. I'd far rather the journey took me a little longer if there was a prospect of actually enjoying the journey, rather than a slightly shorter journey time in spent in a cramped and claustrophobic Pendo. My preferred option will now be 197 to Crewe, with an 807 onwards to Euston. How I'd love the Manchester to Euston via Crewe to become an 807 - though I suspect that won't happen, not least because of insufficient 1st class provision in the peaks.
But each to their own, as you rightly say.

 

[TT-ONR-NRN]

How I'd love the Manchester to Euston via Crewe to become an 807

You leave my London train alone

 

[MattSGB]

I have to say, I really prefer a 350 to a 730 on a Wolverhampton/Walsall stopper. The 350s always seemed to have some seats free even at peak times, but now I am more likely to have to stand on a 730. Also, I have only been on a single journey where the toilet was functional (the display screens say when it is out-of-use), which on that occasion was occupied by a fare-dodger who mistakenly thought that tickets are checked on-board. WMR have confirmed that there is a toilet issue on the units at present. I dread to think what the last trains home from the Christmas market would have been like with no functioning toilet.

I'm sure that a six-car 730 is a massive improvement on cross-city services, but personally I quite dislike them compared to the 350s.

 

[DBS92042]

730212 has moved to Rugby station (same siding used previously for the WMR 730/0s) today from Camden CS. The start of some driver/guard/LNR staff training?

 

[Silverlinky]

730212 has moved to Rugby station (same siding used previously for the WMR 730/0s) today from Camden CS. The start of some driver/guard/LNR staff training?

No training just yet. WMT just want to keep hold of the location. They have used it since WM 730/0 training and then for 350/2 storage. Putting something (anything) in there allows them to keep renewing the access arrangement for that particular bay so its available for when it is next needed, be that for training or storage. It (212) worked as 5W30 today and was disposed of at Rugby as you say.

There is 10 car testing tonight, 5Q30 does a trip between Camden and Northampton (0022-0128) and returns as 5Q31 (0327-0503)

 

[DBS92042]

No training just yet. WMT just want to keep hold of the location. They have used it since WM 730/0 training and then for 350/2 storage. Putting something (anything) in there allows them to keep renewing the access arrangement for that particular bay so its available for when it is next needed, be that for training or storage. It (212) worked as 5W30 today and was disposed of at Rugby as you say.

There is 10 car testing tonight, 5Q30 does a trip between Camden and Northampton (0022-0128) and returns as 5Q31 (0327-0503)

Thanks for clarifying that, I hadn't even considered that they needed to have something in the siding to keep the access arrangement!

 

[3973EXL]

730220

Realtime Trains | 5Q58 1049 Crewe C.S. to Old Dalby | 07/01/2025

Real-time train running information for 5Q58 1049 departure from Crewe C.S. to Old Dalby on 07/01/2025. From Realtime Trains, an independent source of train running info for Great Britain.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

730209

Realtime Trains | 5Q23 1015 Wembley Inter City Depot to Belmont Down Yard | 09/01/2025

Real-time train running information for 5Q23 1015 departure from Wembley Inter City Depot to Belmont Down Yard on 09/01/2025. From Realtime Trains, an independent source of train running info for Great Britain.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

 

[Silverlinky]

Further testing next week Monday night to Wednesday night inclusive

Mon 5Q30 10 car testing Camden-Euston-Northampton-North Junction and return as 5Q31
Tues 5Q30 10 car testing Camden-Euston-Northampton and return as 5Q31
Weds 5Q30 5 car testing Camden-Euston-Northampton and return Northampton-Bletchley-Tring reverse-Bletchley-Euston-Camden as 5Q31

 

[SCDR_WMR]

Presumably this is the platform tolerance and safety testing that was done on the northern section (Cre-Nun) last Autumn rather than driver training

 

[Merle Haggard]

Presumably this is the platform tolerance and safety testing that was done on the northern section (Cre-Nun) last Autumn rather than driver training

Bit odd as the 730s are never intended to run via Northampton (Euston - Northampton - Birmingham becoming the reserve of the remaining 350s) and that part of their network is not even shown on the LNw route maps over the doorways.

 

[Russel]

Agreed 730s are OK. In fact I already prefer most 350 versions over a 390 so cannot see the point of paying Avanti fares.

I'm looking forward to the 730s on the Trent Valley, it'll make LNWR my go-to option to get to London.

The 20-30 minute time saving on Avanti doesn't cancel out the feeling of nausea I've started to get every time I travel on a 390 of late due to the unbearable heat.

 

[SCDR_WMR]

Bit odd as the 730s are never intended to run via Northampton (Euston - Northampton - Birmingham becoming the reserve of the remaining 350s) and that part of their network is not even shown on the LNw route maps over the doorways.

They will on Sunday mornings when the mainline is shut. Which is how they operate 350s from Crewe currently

 

[Merle Haggard]

They will on Sunday mornings when the mainline is shut. Which is how they operate 350s from Crewe currently

Thanks, but if next Sunday's plan is the norm it's not simple. RTT shows the Euston - Crewe trains diverted via Northampton as being (almost) all stops South of Northampton, so more an extension of the Euston - Northampton (which will remain 350s) to Crewe rather than a diversion of the Euston - Crewe service (which of course only calls at Milton Keynes South of Rugby). Although I can recall Euston - Crewe services in the past being diverted via Northampton but not calling there I'm not sure whether that was forward planned or due to an unexpected blockage of the Old Line.

 

[SCDR_WMR]

Thanks, but if next Sunday's plan is the norm it's not simple. RTT shows the Euston - Crewe trains diverted via Northampton as being (almost) all stops South of Northampton, so more an extension of the Euston - Northampton (which will remain 350s) to Crewe rather than a diversion of the Euston - Crewe service (which of course only calls at Milton Keynes South of Rugby). Although I can recall Euston - Crewe services in the past being diverted via Northampton but not calling there I'm not sure whether that was forward planned or due to an unexpected blockage of the Old Line.

I'm not totally sure why it has that stopping pattern, it's the same on the 1st one off Crewe too meaning almost 3hrs journey time. Unless the fasts aren't available at all south of Rugby.

I can understand why you'd see it as an extension to the stoppers rather than the Trent Valley service with extra stops. At least the timings could be tighter with the 730s

 

[Russel]

I'm not totally sure why it has that stopping pattern, it's the same on the 1st one off Crewe too meaning almost 3hrs journey time.

I got the first Trent Valley service one Sunday in November, I forgot how much longer the journey feels going via Northampton!

 

[wickham]

5Q72 0747 Derby to Wembley IC Depot is running today (Fri 10.01.25), started a bit late but is on the way. Is this a hauled Class 730 or something else?

 

[3973EXL]

5Q72 0747 Derby to Wembley IC Depot is running today (Fri 10.01.25), started a bit late but is on the way. Is this a hauled Class 730 or something else?

730236

 

[TomH1994]

I saw a 6 car 730 WMR branded at Milton Keynes this morning heading to Euston. Are they still further ahead with the WMR 3 car ones than the LNWR 5 car ones?
I saw two seperate out of service 5 car 730’s at rugby this morning. Probably for testing I’d imagine

 

[Peter Sarf]

I saw a 6 car 730 WMR branded at Milton Keynes this morning heading to Euston. Are they still further ahead with the WMR 3 car ones than the LNWR 5 car ones?
I saw two seperate out of service 5 car 730’s at rugby this morning. Probably for testing I’d imagine

The 730/0s are more or less all in service (I think all have been used but some drift off for modifications).
There have been four (now five ?) pairs of 730/0s on Euston to South WCML (Tring, Milton Keynes and Bletchley) services. I have seen all but one of them that way. They will be replaced by 730/2s probably this year.
Soho does not have capacity for all 48 730/0s and I think the new depot/stabling at Bescot will cover the excess when/if it gets built/finished.

It is all discussed deep in previous posts on this thread.

 

[Merle Haggard]

I got the first Trent Valley service one Sunday in November, I forgot how much longer the journey feels going via Northampton!

Indeed, it's a whole 2 miles 26 chains further via Northampton. Pity none of the £100 000 000 ( or was it £1 000 000 000?) West Coast upgrade money was spent on increasing the 75 mph linespeed on the New Line.

 

[boxerdog]

Indeed, it's a whole 2 miles 26 chains further via Northampton. Pity none of the £100 000 000 ( or was it £1 000 000 000?) West Coast upgrade money was spent on increasing the 75 mph linespeed on the New Line.

I believe it was going to have an upgrade in line speed to 90mph (I think) probably around 10 years ago. I think there was too much work to be done to the trackbed, as allegedly it's very difficult to maintain, possibly due to being clay. I believe that's what I was told a 'little' while ago.

 

[Halish Railway]

Indeed, it's a whole 2 miles 26 chains further via Northampton. Pity none of the £100 000 000 ( or was it £1 000 000 000?) West Coast upgrade money was spent on increasing the 75 mph linespeed on the New Line.

South of Northampton to Hanslope junction was increased from 75mph to 100mph. I believe that the signalling is only three aspect and might not have sufficient spacing to enable 100mph running, even with a MU differential.