Competition heats up between Transdev and Connexions

[theblackwatch]

Transdev is to trial contactless fare capping, which is claims is the first in the north of England, after receiving funding from Transport for the North’s “Innovation Initiative” package. More details about this "amazing ticket technology" is at https://www.strayfm.com/news/local-...d-bus-company-to-test-touch-and-go-ticketing/

Bus operator Transdev Blazefield is to be the first in the North of England to trial “touch and go” contactless fare capping on its services.

• They won financial backing from Transport for the North.
• They're the first in the North of England to trial the new technology.
• Contactless payment capping is already an integral part of everyday life for thousands of commuters in London.

The Harrogate-based company has won financial backing from strategic transport body Transport for the North (TfN) to pilot the ground-breaking technology across bus routes in Yorkshire.

A successful competitive bid was submitted by Transdev for £50,000 worth of funding from Transport for the North’s “Innovation Initiative” package, created to deliver early benefits and opportunities to introduce new smart travel technology.

Transdev already offers contactless card payments on all its buses across Yorkshire, using the latest “Ticketer” ticket machines installed during 2018, with payments handled via the industry-leading “Littlepay” processing platform.

The Harrogate-based bus operator will now work in partnership with both suppliers to conduct parallel tests of two types of contactless fare capping on selected bus services in Yorkshire – one using a separate card reader, and the other using existing ticket machines.

Personally, I find it a bit disappointing that they are going for something gimmiky like this when they still can't offer a through ticket for when your journey involves a change of bus, such as when I travelled from Leeds to Starbeck the other Saturday. We do have a limited number of buses which run direct on that route, but as there wasn't one for another 4 hours, I had to catch one from Leeds to Harrogate and another to Starbeck, necessitating me buying two tickets rather than one. Transdev's twitter answer was that I could get a through ticket in the form of a Daytripper - that would have cost me more than my 2 singles!

 

[Stan Drews]

Transdev is to trial contactless fare capping, which is claims is the first in the north of England, after receiving funding from Transport for the North’s “Innovation Initiative” package. More details about this "amazing ticket technology" is at https://www.strayfm.com/news/local-...d-bus-company-to-test-touch-and-go-ticketing/



Personally, I find it a bit disappointing that they are going for something gimmiky like this when they still can't offer a through ticket for when your journey involves a change of bus, such as when I travelled from Leeds to Starbeck the other Saturday. We do have a limited number of buses which run direct on that route, but as there wasn't one for another 4 hours, I had to catch one from Leeds to Harrogate and another to Starbeck, necessitating me buying two tickets rather than one. Transdev's twitter answer was that I could get a through ticket in the form of a Daytripper - that would have cost me more than my 2 singles!

Presumably that would be one of the potential benefits that such a trial might bring. Through fares create some very complicated fare triangles, which aren’t always compatible with the software used by many of the modern apps etc.
It seems to be one of the main things passengers ask for (outside of London), so not sure I’d class it as a gimmick.

 

[theblackwatch]

Presumably that would be one of the potential benefits that such a trial might bring. Through fares create some very complicated fare triangles, which aren’t always compatible with the software used by many of the modern apps etc.
It seems to be one of the main things passengers ask for (outside of London), so not sure I’d class it as a gimmick.

The through fare shouldn't be so complex for them - I can buy one if my bus runs through, so the fare exists! I'm not convinced the trial will bring this benefit, given that the news item at http://harrogatebus.co.uk/news.jsp?newsID=2563 only seems to refer to 'weekly fares'. I'll be pleased if it does, but it shouldn't need a £50K trial to be able to sell a single ticket that involves a change of bus.

 

[SCH117X]

Think the weekly fares reference is to getting charged for its use which presumably is on a weekly basis.

 

[johntea]

If you had shown the Harrogate to Starbeck driver your ticket from Leeds and asked nicely they would have probably charged you nowt suppose it depends who you get though at the end of the day!

 

[theblackwatch]

If you had shown the Harrogate to Starbeck driver your ticket from Leeds and asked nicely they would have probably charged you nowt suppose it depends who you get though at the end of the day!

I never thought of trying that! To be honest, the majority of drivers I encounter at both Transdev and Connexions in Harrogate are decent freindly folk - unlike some other areas of the country where it seems the passenger is a nuisance.

 

[SCH117X]

Meanwhile despite Starbeck being down to 3 Versas (if the last WYIS list is to be believed) no guesses what was the first vehicle I saw on a Harrogate "Electric" service this evening. Also I keep on seeing an afternoon V32 school bus despite it having been withdrawn at half term!

 

[SCH117X]

Bit of a U turn seemingly coming up; having replaced the Double Decker's on the 760, sorry I mean 60, sorry I mean Aireline with Versas Transdev are now trailing Wright Streetdeck HEV demonstrator SK18TKX on the route. It worked the 1515 from Keighley today.

 

[Deerfold]

Bit of a U turn seemingly coming up; having replaced the Double Decker's on the 760, sorry I mean 60, sorry I mean Aireline with Versas Transdev are now trailing Wright Streetdeck HEV demonstrator SK18TKX on the route. It worked the 1515 from Keighley today.

The 1010 from Keighley and 1015 from Leeds were both operated by double deckers today too - I'm not sure if they're having higher pre-Christmas loads as well as the trial.

 

[Bungle965]

More new buses for Transdev it seems.

Investment confirmed for 22 brand new low-emission buses in 2019, built right here in the UK, as we continue creating buses that people want to be seen on... and continue our vision of attracting more people to amazing buses across the north.

Sam

 

[Alexbus12]

More new buses for Transdev it seems.

Sam

Hmmm, no doubt 18 for the X43 and then probably 4 for Rosso to displace vehicles which are reaching the tender limit next year.

 

[Alexbus12]

Saying that, 15 Deckers are needing replacing at Rosso next year to make them in line for TFGM school tenders.. Unlikely they'll buy buses dedicated to schools tho

 

[Bungle965]

Hmmm, no doubt 18 for the X43 and then probably 4 for Rosso to displace vehicles which are reaching the tender limit next year.

Expecting Volvo/Wright double decker & 4 from Optare then?
Sam

 

[Bungle965]

Saying that, 15 Deckers are needing replacing at Rosso next year to make them in line for TFGM school tenders.. Unlikely they'll buy buses dedicated to schools tho

I was going to suggest the ones displaced from the X43 could go to Rosso, but I believe that they are on a lease aren't they?
Sam

 

[Stan Drews]

I was going to suggest the ones displaced from the X43 could go to Rosso, but I believe that they are on a lease aren't they?
Sam

They are, and as the initial leases are 7 years, I think it might be 2020 before they are replaced. More likely to be 12/62 plates being replaced next year.

 

[158756]

They are, and as the initial leases are 7 years, I think it might be 2020 before they are replaced. More likely to be 12/62 plates being replaced next year.

From 2012, I count that they've got the 8 Versas at Harrogate, already supposed to be replaced by the electrics, 2 at Burnley, 7 B7RLEs in Blackburn, and 5 (now ex -?) Coastliner deckers.

That adds up to 22, so it wouldn't be a surprise if it's a straight swap. They need to be doing a lot more than just replacing vehicles at the end of leases though. Those 12/62 reg buses would be very useful for shifting some of the older stuff from the fleet.

 

[Andyh82]

Thinking about each depot

Coastliner - won’t be for here
York - not here
Harrogate - not here either, everything is modern or refurbished
Keighley - there are very slight whispers about the 60, and there are also still some B10BLEs in use, but that would be by cascade i would expect

Burnley - Mainline ok, locals have just received refurbished B10BLEs which I expect will see a few years before being replaced. The Witch Way will get new buses soon.

Blackburn - Doubtful they’ll get anything new, but may be the in the running for some cascades

Rosso - Blackburn is ok, Burnley is getting refurbished B7RLEs, is there anything at Rochdale still worthy of brand new buses rather than cascades?

 

[Bungle965]

Keighley - there are very slight whispers about the 60, and there are also still some B10BLEs in use, but that would be by cascade i would expect

I think it's pretty much accepted that the 60 needs double deckers, the Versa's on it currently are not suitable.
Sam

 

[SCH117X]

From 2012, I count that they've got the 8 Versas at Harrogate, already supposed to be replaced by the electrics, 2 at Burnley, 7 B7RLEs in Blackburn, and 5 (now ex -?) Coastliner .

There are now only 3 Versas at Harrogate (209,210 and 213) - five have moved to York (207,208,211,212 and 214) along with 216 from Burnley. 211 has been repainted into the new York livery while 212 has been repainted red and black! The 2012 Versas were promoted as being lower emission when new with the Harrogate fleet having a press launch at Harlow Carr Gardens to portray their green credentials so it may be they will be retained.

 

[SCH117X]

Thinking about each depot
Harrogate - not here either, everything is modern or refurbished

Theres a couple of B10BLEs still in use - 306 and 307 and they are trailing the B8RLE.

 

[AB93]

It would appear that, having finally come round to the reality that the Mini Pointer Darts were causing a disastrous amount of breakdowns on the service and then sourcing two leased Enviro200MMCs for the route, Transdev have now lost the Selby - York 42 service.

NYCC have awarded a new full time (not emergency after Utopia collapsed) contract, to Arriva Yorkshire.
This is from 29th April 2019.


Cue mass hysteria and a petition to save Transdev: https://www.thepetitionsite.com/en-gb/175/981/741/save-transdev-42-route/
Seems to be some confusion arising from this that the service is to be axed when it's just changing operators.

 

[SCH117X]

The petition acknowledges the service is not being axed
"Recently arriva have been awarded the tender for the 42/42s route. A lot of locals who use this service are upset that a company who have failed to keep the route open in the past are now taking it back. We all feel that transdev have better served our community than arriva has. We feel strongly that transdev should keep the route. The busses are reliable and the drivers go the extra mile for their customers. Much more than arriva has every done." Ironically as I type this it has 42 supporters

 

[Stan Drews]

It will be interesting to see what level of service will be provided under the new contract, and who has won all the other NYCC routes put out to tender in the same batch.

 

[Swimbar]

The petition acknowledges the service is not being axed
"Recently arriva have been awarded the tender for the 42/42s route. A lot of locals who use this service are upset that a company who have failed to keep the route open in the past are now taking it back. We all feel that transdev have better served our community than arriva has. We feel strongly that transdev should keep the route. The busses are reliable and the drivers go the extra mile for their customers. Much more than arriva has every done." Ironically as I type this it has 42 supporters

So presumably they no longer want Arriva to operate the Saturday Evening and Sunday Services!

 

[AB93]

The petition acknowledges the service is not being axed
"Recently arriva have been awarded the tender for the 42/42s route. A lot of locals who use this service are upset that a company who have failed to keep the route open in the past are now taking it back. We all feel that transdev have better served our community than arriva has. We feel strongly that transdev should keep the route. The busses are reliable and the drivers go the extra mile for their customers. Much more than arriva has every done." Ironically as I type this it has 42 supporters

Indeed it does - but since when has everyone signing a petition actually read what it's about? lol

For example, some of the petition responses:
"Village would be too cut off from York especially for older people and those that do not drive."

"I don't use this bus much now, but I know how important it is to the people that use it, they NEED THIS BUS SERVICE!!"
At least this person is honest that they don't really use the service!


My favourite so far though has to be:
"I feel Arriva only care about making money, hence the reason when it didn't make money they have it up in the past. Transdev have much more friendly drivers, clean buses and a better timetable. They aren't in this for the money."

 

[SCH117X]

It will be interesting to see what level of service will be provided under the new contract, and who has won all the other NYCC routes put out to tender in the same batch.

That info should be accessible but given its NYCC then it is not as they only have a 7+ year old cobweb page

"Transport service providers - frequently asked questions
Where can I find published tender results?
Below is a list of tender results for both home to school and local bus services in North Yorkshire.

• Home to school - Craven October 2011 (pdf / 17 KB)
• Home to school - Hambleton October 2009 (pdf / 16 KB)
• Home to school - Harrogate October 2010 (pdf / 19 KB)
• Home to school - miscellaneous October 2010 (pdf / 14 KB)
• Home to school - Richmondshire October 2010 (pdf / 20 KB)
• Home to school - Ryedale October 2011 (pdf / 20 KB)
• Home to school - Scarborough October 2009 (pdf / 17 KB)"

https://www.northyorks.gov.uk/transport-service-providers

 

[Alexbus12]

That info should be accessible but given its NYCC then it is not as they only have a 7+ year old cobweb page

"Transport service providers - frequently asked questions
Where can I find published tender results?
Below is a list of tender results for both home to school and local bus services in North Yorkshire.

• Home to school - Craven October 2011 (pdf / 17 KB)
• Home to school - Hambleton October 2009 (pdf / 16 KB)
• Home to school - Harrogate October 2010 (pdf / 19 KB)
• Home to school - miscellaneous October 2010 (pdf / 14 KB)
• Home to school - Richmondshire October 2010 (pdf / 20 KB)
• Home to school - Ryedale October 2011 (pdf / 20 KB)
• Home to school - Scarborough October 2009 (pdf / 17 KB)"

https://www.northyorks.gov.uk/transport-service-providers

When I last enquired with TFGM about tenders on their website (Maybe different to NYCC) but they said that everything is published on the government tender page now.

 

[SCH117X]

Had a good illustration of Connexions poor timetabling yesterday through a work enforced car trip to Starbeck yesterday in the morning peak - on the return the A59 was at least moving in fits and starts rather than being a complete standstill. At Starbeck their was an X1 behind me and still behind me at Granby Corner (the stop for the hospital) 13 minutes later (the timetable gives it 2 minutes!) having not attracted any custom from passengers awaiting a Transdev bus.
Interesting their was stream of empty non-Transdev school buses heading the otherway; I know Connexions got some adverse press from parking them on roads in Harrogate so I wonder where they are parking them now.

 

[Stan Drews]

Interesting their was stream of empty non-Transdev school buses heading the otherway; I know Connexions got some adverse press from parking them on roads in Harrogate so I wonder where they are parking them now.

Perhaps being a local operator in Harrogate has some advantages ...like a local depot!

 

[Swimbar]

But if we are to believe a communication delivered to Greenfields today the local Councillor recently met with both the Harrogate Bus Company and Connexions to try and improve services in the Hookstone area. 'The Harrogate Bus Company, for the third time, flatly refused to help'
So much for the local operator!