Condition of some Scotrail stock (158s in particular)

[ld0595]

Are you mistaking the socketed units for the former Hull Trains ones? Although I think they are 170/3s?

I've been on 401 and 402 and they've definitely got power sockets and I agree that I can't see them leaving for a while.

 

[Clansman]

I've been on 401 and 402 and they've definitely got power sockets and I agree that I can't see them leaving for a while.

Rightly so, 401 and 402 are of the original batch. If they were interiorly done as you said then they would have the same original first class seats Saltired too? I've not seen any of them done up yet, only the other ones.

 

[cf111]

There's a refurbished 158 (not sure which one, sorry) going around with the new power sockets plated up - anyone know what happened to it?

 

[Clansman]

There's a refurbished 158 (not sure which one, sorry) going around with the new power sockets plated up - anyone know what happened to it?

There's a good few of them going around now. They've got new plug panels, not sure why they've gone for the weird pull of 2 USBs on some and a mixture on others. Should just be a sub topped with a plug socket. Anyhow, they mostly work Edinburgh services, mostly seen routes between Tweedbank and Perth, although work Sunday services to Aberdeen in conjunction with the 170s and occasionally to Inverness when First Class Inverness units aren't avalible.

 

[scotraildriver]

There's a good few of them going around now. They've got new plug panels, not sure why they've gone for the weird pull of 2 USBs on some and a mixture on others. Should just be a sub topped with a plug socket. Anyhow, they mostly work Edinburgh services, mostly seen routes between Tweedbank and Perth, although work Sunday services to Aberdeen in conjunction with the 170s and occasionally to Inverness when First Class Inverness units aren't avalible.

Because the 158 alternator and electrical system isn't capable of powering a 240v socket at every seat.

 

[JohnR]

They will be displaced on Intercity duties. They will take over local services already in place such as Perth/Dundee to Edinburgh/Glasgow, and the Fife Circle. The retention of 13 units means that they will also pave way for new stopping routes which will compliment the HST and free up the need for HSTs to call at intermediate stations as often as Intercity services do currently. The Class 170s, in conjunction with the remaining Class 158s in the central belt (aside from both Highland Lines) from 2018 will service on the following routes in total:

-Edinburgh to Perth/Dundee
-Edinburgh to (Fife Circle)
-Edinburgh to Tweedbank
-Glasgow QS to Perth/Dundee
-Glasgow QS to Anniesland (also in conjunction with Class 156s)
-Perth to Arbroath (All stops)
-Montrose to Inverurie/Insch (All stops)
-Kingussie to Elgin (All stops)

On the cycling side of things the HSTs will cater for and provide more bike space than the Class 170s. Once demoted to (the better suited overall) suburban and commuter duties, the Class 170s will probably no longer require more than 1 bike space, which would definitely not be the case if they were still working Intercity routes beyond 2018 (thankfully they're not).

I disagree regarding cycle use - most of it I see on the 170s is for shortish trips (ie using the bike at each end of a commute), rather than for long distance. You rarely see a Bike doing a Dundee-Glasgow trip, but you will see several try to squeeze on for Arbroath-Dundee.

 

[Clansman]

I disagree regarding cycle use - most of it I see on the 170s is for shortish trips (ie using the bike at each end of a commute), rather than for long distance. You rarely see a Bike doing a Dundee-Glasgow trip, but you will see several try to squeeze on for Arbroath-Dundee.

Fair enough. I was more meaning to emphasize the increase in much needed cycling capacity on board Intercity routes, but forgot to take into account shorter distance routes.

 

[Alba]

Wondered how many and which of the 40 Scotrail 158s to be refurbished have been completed. Press reports last September suggested around one a month was the target so presumably there should be be around 10 by now.

 

[scotraildriver]

Wondered how many and which of the 40 Scotrail 158s to be refurbished have been completed. Press reports last September suggested around one a month was the target so presumably there should be be around 10 by now.

Currently 12 done.

 

[Clansman]

Wondered how many and which of the 40 Scotrail 158s to be refurbished have been completed. Press reports last September suggested around one a month was the target so presumably there should be be around 10 by now.

There is about 12 going around now. The units to get done will presumably be all of the Inverness units, as they have RETB which is needed to work the Far North Line and West Highland Line therefor not worth while going off lease. 8 Class 158s are going off-lease - the exact same number of units which were cascaded from England a few years ago. So my guess is all of the Inverness and Haymarket units apart from the "English 8", is the most probable.

 

[ScotTrains]

I travelled 1st class on a few scotrail 158's a couple of months ago and noticed all the curtains have been removed. Does anyone know the reason for this? I've always found them useful, especially on sunny days. Also will the 158's be retaining 1st class when the HST's start running?

 

[43096]

There is about 12 going around now. The units to get done will presumably be all of the Inverness units, as they have RETB which is needed to work the Far North Line and West Highland Line therefor not worth while going off lease. 8 Class 158s are going off-lease - the exact same number of units which were cascaded from England a few years ago. So my guess is all of the Inverness and Haymarket units apart from the "English 8", is the most probable.

Not probable, it's certain. Units 158701-736/738-741 are being retained and refurbished, while units 158782/786/789/867-871 go off-lease for transfer to Northern.

 

[SC318250]

Do we know yet which 156 units are leaving Scotrail?

Thanks in advance

 

[Clansman]

I travelled 1st class on a few scotrail 158's a couple of months ago and noticed all the curtains have been removed. Does anyone know the reason for this? I've always found them useful, especially on sunny days. Also will the 158's be retaining 1st class when the HST's start running?

The curtains are still in place on the majority of units so maybe the curtains were to dirty or damaged? Scotrail 158s will not be retaining the first class accommodation as they now work the majority of Suburban and Commuter services where first class is not utilised, so replacing 14 "first class" seats and a border and replacing them with a possible 18 seats does seem the better option. 158s on Scotrail (except those 2 part of the English 8) have always had a dreadful first class. Same dreadful legroom as in standard class and a reading lamp with blocks your ability to place anything in front of you. When First were in power, first class on 158s were utilised on all journeys, from the Far North to Dunblane Commuter workings. Now, they are just limited to the odd Inverness Intercity services. I've always thought Scotrail could do with putting a first class section like SWT have (maybe slightly smaller), especially now that they will be working the West Highland Line which would definitely sell to tourists in the summer - although the 158s are as strapped for capacity as it is.
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Do we know yet which 156 units are leaving Scotrail?

Thanks in advance

Most probably the ones without RETB or the ones which haven't been Saltired? I'm not sure on the numbers but retaining the RETB units would allow the RETB system to be transferred to the 158s which will be replacing the 156s on West Highland duties. Since the 385s are coming next year and will be working to Dunblane in 2018 it looks likey that 156s will be a rare sight out of Glasgow Queen Street apart from Anniesland duties so the units based at Cockerhill depot that do not have RETB could be the ones up for off lease? I've always thought the 156s should be replaced on the likes of the Newcastle and Stranraer services out of Glasgow Central - The class 185s haven't a home to go to yet and they would be perfect on those routes (hint-hint )

 

[PHILIPE]

There are no units based at Eastfield depot. They visit there from Haymarket and Corkerhill.

 

[Clansman]

There are no units based at Eastfield depot. They visit there from Haymarket and Corkerhill.

Where are the RETB units based?

 

[PHILIPE]

Where are the RETB units based?

They would be IS ones for the Far North Lines.

 

[Clansman]

They would be IS ones for the Far North Lines.

I know about the 158s, but the context of the discussion was on the 156s

 

[PHILIPE]

I know about the 158s, but the context of the discussion was on the 156s

The whole discussion is about 158s as well as 156s. All Scotrail 156s are allocated to Corkerhill so I think that was easy to answer. They are required for Oban and Fort William.

 

[Clansman]

The whole discussion is about 158s as well as 156s.

The entire discussion is about the 158s, although the title I chose was to allow for the discussion on other stock. I highlighted the 158s as a potential starting point, hence why it is in the brackets.

The recent conversation was about the 156s. As SC318250 asked his question on which 156 units were being retained.

All Scotrail 156s are allocated to Corkerhill so I think that was easy to answer. They are required for Oban and Fort William.

Cheers, I'm not good when it comes to where the 156s are based. They will probably have the RETB stripped out and replaced on the 158s when they take over diagrams in 2018?

 

[Haig paxton]

The entire discussion is about the 158s, although the title I chose was to allow for the discussion on other stock. I highlighted the 158s as a potential starting point, hence why it is in the brackets.

The recent conversation was about the 156s. As SC318250 asked his question on which 156 units were being retained.



Cheers, I'm not good when it comes to where the 156s are based. They will probably have the RETB stripped out and replaced on the 158s when they take over diagrams in 2018?

The 156s with RETB are mostly in the old First livery. The Saltire trains are mostly ex SPT without RETB.

 

[Clansman]

The 156s with RETB are mostly in the old First livery. The Saltire trains are mostly ex SPT without RETB.

Have the unit numbers due for release been listed yet?

 

[PHILIPE]

Have the unit numbers due for release been listed yet?

With so much going on and this and that project slipping back, probably far too early yet.

 

[43096]

With so much going on and this and that project slipping back, probably far too early yet.

They probably are agreed - they'll be listed in the leasing contract as they will have different lease end dates - but they just haven't been made public yet.