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Could HS2 lead to airport closures or consolidations? If so where/how?

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HST43257

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Presumably the people working there don't think their jobs are worthless. Airports are always hubs of economic activity attracting businesses with easy connections to the rest of the world. It would be a brave MP who supported the closure of their local airport.
But surely somewhere like London Ashford Airport or Tees Valley just is not needed. Politics can’t rule our transport system.
 
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class26

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But surely somewhere like London Ashford Airport or Tees Valley just is not needed. Politics can’t rule our transport system.
Ultimately isn`t it down to market forces to determine if these airports should stay open or close? That is as long as local politicians don`t throw endless amounts of tax payers money at lost causes
 

Bald Rick

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But surely somewhere like London Ashford Airport or Tees Valley just is not needed. Politics can’t rule our transport system.

Not needed for what? Airports like that do a whole lot of business that doesn’t involve passengers flying on scheduled flights.
 

Meglos

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are you seriously suggesting the airport for the UK`s second largest city would close ?
There are more long haul services than many imagine. Before covid there was -
3 x daily Emirates to Dubai including the A380
1 x daily Qatar to Doha
1 x daily Air India to Delhi
Pakistan airways frequency fluctuating
2 x daily to Turkish Istanbul

plus many of the European carriers that do not serve such airports as Stansted or Luton
Yes I do believe BHX will suffer, and could ultimately fail. Notice that no US carriers are in the list. So far it has proven impossible for westbound services to make a profit out of BHX. If you want to travel west from the West Midlands you have to either travel into Europe (Air France via Paris, KLM via Amsterdam, and Lufthansa via Frankfurt/Munich), down the M40 to Heathrow (LHR), or up the M6 to Manchester (MAN). HS2 just makes it easier to get to LHR/MAN from Birmingham. The European carriers who you mention also serve Heathrow, generally with a more frequent service.

Emirates/Qatar & Turkish are largely flights to the Far East via Middle Eastern hubs. Post COVID the predictions from the aviation industry bodies (IATA/ICAO) is that hubs will suffer as customers choose direct flights over changing on route.


No chance. Birmingham Airport will be a big winner from HS2.

What will Birmingham Airport gain? New services from East Midlands hub, Chesterfield, Sheffield, Leeds and York. Leeds & York already have direct services into Manchester Airport. I don't see huge amount of traffic suddenly coming from the first three.

Birmingham International is already connected to the WCML, so maybe a bit of time shaved off of Crewe & Wigan, but it will still be as quick to get to Manchester Airport from these places.

In addition it will make it easier to get from the western Birmingham suburbs to get to Heathrow, than now. Many travellers already travel into New Street, to connect to Birmingham International for the airport. Once HS2 is open, the number of flight destinations available via interchanging at OOC will become an hour closer than now.
 

Bald Rick

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What will Birmingham Airport gain? New services from East Midlands hub, Chesterfield, Sheffield, Leeds and York. Leeds & York already have dir

As I mentioned upthread, it will be closer (in time terms) to London’s West End than Stansted. It won’t be that much longer than getting to Heathrow for some parts of West London (OOC to Intechange will be 32 minutes). And at some times of day it may well be just as cheap as getting to Stansted. Yes LHR will be quicker, but it’s also serving different markets. If, say, you want a cheap flight to Ireland, or India, or Eastern Europe, Birmingham may well be overall cheaper and quicker than getting to a London airport.

Also I wouldn’t rule out a BHX-North America route starting up again post HS2 (or even before) - there’s going to be a revolution in low cost transatlantic travel once the A321neo XLR is in service.
 

matacaster

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I really struggle to understand the point of Leeds Bradford airport. It is extraordinarily difficult to get to by public transport (with cases and other holiday paraphenalia). The proposed railhead around Horsforth is going to be bleak - might be better if it actually reached the airport in a tunnel. The roads are often very busy and its slow access from both Leeds and Bradford. Its runway is fairly short and affected by adverse weather conditions - fog and wind. Manchester already has all the required infrastructure (apart from covered walkway access to one of the terminals)and plenty of capacity - It also has excellent, and acceptably quick even now, rail access. The rationale for keeping Leeds Bradford appears to be political - if there's an airport for Manchester, we must have one for Leeds regardless of other sensible factors.
 

edwin_m

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As I mentioned upthread, it will be closer (in time terms) to London’s West End than Stansted. It won’t be that much longer than getting to Heathrow for some parts of West London (OOC to Intechange will be 32 minutes). And at some times of day it may well be just as cheap as getting to Stansted. Yes LHR will be quicker, but it’s also serving different markets. If, say, you want a cheap flight to Ireland, or India, or Eastern Europe, Birmingham may well be overall cheaper and quicker than getting to a London airport.

Also I wouldn’t rule out a BHX-North America route starting up again post HS2 (or even before) - there’s going to be a revolution in low cost transatlantic travel once the A321neo XLR is in service.
London to Dublin is a very busy air route. The shorter flying distance from Birmingham, or shorter still from Manchester, means there is an environmental reason to encourage passengers to use HS2 and one of those airports rather than a London area airport.
 

camflyer

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As I mentioned upthread, it will be closer (in time terms) to London’s West End than Stansted. It won’t be that much longer than getting to Heathrow for some parts of West London (OOC to Intechange will be 32 minutes). And at some times of day it may well be just as cheap as getting to Stansted. Yes LHR will be quicker, but it’s also serving different markets. If, say, you want a cheap flight to Ireland, or India, or Eastern Europe, Birmingham may well be overall cheaper and quicker than getting to a London airport.

Also I wouldn’t rule out a BHX-North America route starting up again post HS2 (or even before) - there’s going to be a revolution in low cost transatlantic travel once the A321neo XLR is in service.

Plus Heathrow is full and any third runway is looking less likely than ever so if there is going to be any expansion in the UK-US/Canada market then Birmingham would be a good choice especially for those in N/NW London.
 

Bald Rick

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London to Dublin is a very busy air route. The shorter flying distance from Birmingham, or shorter still from Manchester, means there is an environmental reason to encourage passengers to use HS2 and one of those airports rather than a London area airport.

Indeed. Dublin is a great example.

BHX - Dublin is 25/30 minutes quicker than LHR - Dublin, and arguably less chance of delay. Anyone who is starting their journey in a part of London that needs needs to go via Old Oak (and change, or on a service that calls there) to get to Heathrow Central terminal area will find it takes only about 10 minutes longer to the BHX terminal. If you are going to T5, it will be about the same as getting to BHX. When you factor in the flight time, BHX will be noticeably quicker.

Then BHX to Dublin is typically £20 cheaper return, partly through the airline, partly through Heathrow’s charges which the airlines pass on. So, if you can get a ticket on HS2 for less than £20* more than your ticket to Heathrow, why wouldn’t you go to Birmingham?

*entirely possible at some times of day, I imagine.


It’s also entirely possible that a low cost Transatlantic airline starts a service from BHX, and does a deal with HS2 to block book seats on a connecting service from London at a big discount. Leave Euston at 1115 / OOC 1121, arrive BHX 1205 (including transfer) for a 1400ish flight, arrive NY / Boston / Chicago Orlando in time for tea. Could be a lot cheaper.
 
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37424

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I really struggle to understand the point of Leeds Bradford airport. It is extraordinarily difficult to get to by public transport (with cases and other holiday paraphenalia). The proposed railhead around Horsforth is going to be bleak - might be better if it actually reached the airport in a tunnel. The roads are often very busy and its slow access from both Leeds and Bradford. Its runway is fairly short and affected by adverse weather conditions - fog and wind. Manchester already has all the required infrastructure (apart from covered walkway access to one of the terminals)and plenty of capacity - It also has excellent, and acceptably quick even now, rail access. The rationale for keeping Leeds Bradford appears to be political - if there's an airport for Manchester, we must have one for Leeds regardless of other sensible factors.
Well I'm sure Airports are political in many ways, but for instance My Dad and his partner used to use it to fly to their villa in Spain, much easier to get someone to give them a lift or get a taxi to Leeds/Bradford from where we live than go to Manchester and my Dad wasn't going to faff around with public transport at his age with all the cases etc. Leeds/Bradford is also located close to the more affluent areas of West and North Yorkshire, a friend of my Dad used to commute to London frequently from Leeds/Bradford he lived fairly close to the Airport and much more convienent for him than catching a train from Leeds.

Would the world end if Leeds/Bradford or Robin Hood closed no, but I doubt the local council's would see it that way.

I'm not sure they were even still running services to London before covid I think domestic routes have struggled for viability, mainly Europe and Northern Ireland So I doubt HS2 will have that much impact on Leeds/Bradford, in fact if becomes much quicker and easier to get to Heathrow with HS2 then that could have a negative impact on Manchester.

The one thing Leeds/Bradford Airport is good for is if you want to hire a car on a weekend when the city centre Hire Car Offices are shut.
 
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