• Our booking engine at tickets.railforums.co.uk (powered by TrainSplit) helps support the running of the forum with every ticket purchase! Find out more and ask any questions/give us feedback in this thread!

Crossrail - Construction updates and progress towards opening (now expected 24 May 2022)

Status
Not open for further replies.

Farang

Member
Joined
17 May 2018
Messages
68
The detail is in the Timetable Planning Rules https://content.tfl.gov.uk/ccos-tpr2022rev1.pdf

First Character Description
9 Passenger trains operating on the Crossrail Central Operating System
3 Empty Coaching Stock (ECS) movements between Paddington (Crossrail) and Westbourne Park; Priority ECS if specially authorised
5 Other ECS
6 Maintenance trains which can run up to 50mph

Second Character Description/ Destination
C To Chadwell Heath or Gidea Park
G Special service identifier (note: not for use in disruption)
N To Maidenhead
P ECS and maintenance trains to Plumstead Infrastructure Maintenance Facility
R To Reading
T To Hayes and Harlington and to Heathrow Airport
U To Abbey Wood via Canary Wharf
V ECS to Ilford Depot
W To Shenfield
Y To Paddington (Elizabeth Line) via Tottenham Court Road, To Old Oak Common and Westbourne Park sidings(incl. ECS and maintenance trains)

--------------------------------

Three new videos on YouTube show the thinking behind the architecture of the stations.


Design & Architecture Overview


Farringdon


Whitechapel

Thank you from me too - fascinating.
 
Sponsor Post - registered members do not see these adverts; click here to register, or click here to log in
R

RailUK Forums

kevin_roche

Member
Joined
26 Feb 2019
Messages
930
I saw that they were running some tests via Stratford last Sunday but had to run the trains to Chadwell Heath and Gidea Park to turn them around.
 

Horizon22

Established Member
Associate Staff
Jobs & Careers
Joined
8 Sep 2019
Messages
7,602
Location
London
The detail is in the Timetable Planning Rules https://content.tfl.gov.uk/ccos-tpr2022rev1.pdf

First Character Description
9 Passenger trains operating on the Crossrail Central Operating System
3 Empty Coaching Stock (ECS) movements between Paddington (Crossrail) and Westbourne Park; Priority ECS if specially authorised
5 Other ECS
6 Maintenance trains which can run up to 50mph

Second Character Description/ Destination
C To Chadwell Heath or Gidea Park
G Special service identifier (note: not for use in disruption)
N To Maidenhead
P ECS and maintenance trains to Plumstead Infrastructure Maintenance Facility
R To Reading
T To Hayes and Harlington and to Heathrow Airport
U To Abbey Wood via Canary Wharf
V ECS to Ilford Depot
W To Shenfield
Y To Paddington (Elizabeth Line) via Tottenham Court Road, To Old Oak Common and Westbourne Park sidings(incl. ECS and maintenance trains)

I wonder if they will also keep "P" for the running to Paddington (High Level) as they do currently from Hayes / Heathrow and whether they will have a character for running to Liverpool St (High Level) if they do still intend to run those peak extras.
 

kevin_roche

Member
Joined
26 Feb 2019
Messages
930
I wonder if they will also keep "P" for the running to Paddington (High Level) as they do currently from Hayes / Heathrow and whether they will have a character for running to Liverpool St (High Level) if they do still intend to run those peak extras.
On the west side, there are plenty of trains being turned around that can fill those gaps by continuing beyond the turnbacks. I'm sure there is scope within the Wales and West timetable planning rules if they do decide to do that, but I have been able to find the second letter rules in the much more complex instructions in the link below, which I won't quote because there is too much of it.


I see on Real Time Trains that there are trains planned to test between Paddington and Stratford on Sunday. They have a 15 minute gap then run 18 trains in the next 45 mins so simulating 24tph.

The weird thing is they are not following the timetable planning rules I mentioned earlier. They all have U as the second letter.

24tph_2022.01.30.PNG
 
Last edited:

345 050

Member
Joined
12 Aug 2021
Messages
237
Location
London
I would keep Bond Street off the critical path. Maybe this idea was floated to keep focus on the Bond Street work but I think it would be a mistake to add the potential delay of BS back in after all the effort to decouple it and set expectations that it will open later.
Based on all of the delays we have already seen, I can easily see Bond Street being dropped when they realise that something isn't quite right and it gets to June and they realise if they keep waiting for Bond Street they won't open in June......
 

matt_world2004

Established Member
Joined
5 Nov 2014
Messages
4,504
ItS first service day is always going to be a Sunday as it is quieter . Can't see them opening on the 21st April for that reason alone
 

YSTrains

On Moderation
Joined
13 Dec 2021
Messages
149
Location
London
Well looks like the new timetable has been released on Real Time trains. But please someone tell me why there are services to Westbourne Park?
 

alf

On Moderation
Joined
1 Mar 2021
Messages
356
Location
Bournemouth
Visiting London this weekend so watched 345s reversing in the
Westbourne turn backs.

Very irregular frequency from 10.45 to 11.30am when I had to go.

First in had 4 walking from cab to cab, all with driver’s backpacks.
Second had 2 lots of 4 staff, ie 8 aboard, half geared up as drivers so may be training.
Third only had 2 walking from end of end. It turned round in 3 mins & unless I missed a staff member it set off towards Paddington when the staff were still halfway through the train.

Is the infrastructure designed so that the 345 goes back to Pad Crossrail platform without any driver input?
Presumably it needs the driver to release/open the doors at Paddington platform.
 

rd749249

Member
Joined
15 Sep 2015
Messages
171
If you’re late into the turnbacks and your departure time is imminent, the train will start on its journey to Paddington without the driver in the leading cab, so long as the road is given. The doors will not release at Paddington until the driver keys-on.
 

345 050

Member
Joined
12 Aug 2021
Messages
237
Location
London
Looks like a lot of the tests today to Stratford either delayed or didn't run this afternoon. Anyone happen to know what happened?
 

londontransit

Member
Joined
26 May 2021
Messages
170
Location
London
Visiting London this weekend so watched 345s reversing in the
Westbourne turn backs.

Very irregular frequency from 10.45 to 11.30am when I had to go.

First in had 4 walking from cab to cab, all with driver’s backpacks.
Second had 2 lots of 4 staff, ie 8 aboard, half geared up as drivers so may be training.
Third only had 2 walking from end of end. It turned round in 3 mins & unless I missed a staff member it set off towards Paddington when the staff were still halfway through the train.

Is the infrastructure designed so that the 345 goes back to Pad Crossrail platform without any driver input?
Presumably it needs the driver to release/open the doors at Paddington platform.
Yes quite a few Class 345s about today - some entering the central core tunnels and some heading to Old Oak depot. A number of cancellations though according to RTT.
 

JN114

Established Member
Joined
28 Jun 2005
Messages
3,355
RfL are engaged in trial operations and scenarios across the weekend on the COS - it is likely that any delays/cancellations are as a result of whatever scenario is being played out.

I understand yesterday they undertook an evacuation exercise near Westbourne Park from a “failed” train, suspect similar may have occurred today.

I wouldn’t read one pixel into timing data for a rail line that is still in the trial phases; there is no way for a lay outsider to discern what is unintended unreliability and what is scenarios being played out as part of trials.
 

rebmcr

Established Member
Joined
15 Nov 2011
Messages
3,852
Location
St Neots
I wonder if they will manage the Stratford testing to the plan this weekend as the set of points between the down and up electric line which allows access to platform 5 at Stratford still appear to be out of use.

I saw that they were running some tests via Stratford last Sunday but had to run the trains to Chadwell Heath and Gidea Park to turn them around.
Is it impossible to use Stratford P8 for reversals?

I can see that Maryland P1 has the same access restrictions as Stratford P5; Maryland P2 is analogous to Stratford P8 anyway (and Maryland probably lacks driver facilities); and Chadwell Heath/Gidea Park both have convenient sidings. But I can't see what's 'wrong' with P8. If there was a substitute passenger service from the East, it would seem easier to terminate that in P5 and preferentially use P8 for testing.

Obviously there is a reason, I just can't figure out what that is. Perhaps a desire to confine any wrong-direction running to only the inbound movement?
 

fat_boy_pete

Member
Joined
16 Mar 2015
Messages
291
Location
Essex
Is it impossible to use Stratford P8 for reversals?

I can see that Maryland P1 has the same access restrictions as Stratford P5; Maryland P2 is analogous to Stratford P8 anyway (and Maryland probably lacks driver facilities); and Chadwell Heath/Gidea Park both have convenient sidings. But I can't see what's 'wrong' with P8. If there was a substitute passenger service from the East, it would seem easier to terminate that in P5 and preferentially use P8 for testing.

Obviously there is a reason, I just can't figure out what that is. Perhaps a desire to confine any wrong-direction running to only the inbound movement?
See https://www.railforums.co.uk/threads/class-345-progress.120221/page-156#post-5492667
 

matt_world2004

Established Member
Joined
5 Nov 2014
Messages
4,504
Visiting London this weekend so watched 345s reversing in the
Westbourne turn backs.

Very irregular frequency from 10.45 to 11.30am when I had to go.

First in had 4 walking from cab to cab, all with driver’s backpacks.
Second had 2 lots of 4 staff, ie 8 aboard, half geared up as drivers so may be training.
Third only had 2 walking from end of end. It turned round in 3 mins & unless I missed a staff member it set off towards Paddington when the staff were still halfway through the train.

Is the infrastructure designed so that the 345 goes back to Pad Crossrail platform without any driver input?
Presumably it needs the driver to release/open the doors at Paddington platform.
Likely some of the staff in the train are tfl staff observing and bombardier staff to help with technical issues. You can see bombardier staff on gwml services sometimes to help with technical issues.
 

kevin_roche

Member
Joined
26 Feb 2019
Messages
930
Another take on the latest Crossrail news from the BBC. Later part includes an interview with Seb Dance, Deputy Mayor for Transport.



---------------------
Edit 1st Feb

There is a PDF on the Crossrail Facebook page with a status report.


Some interesting information about the signalling system but not much is new.

Perfecting the software is an
evolutionary process which is why
Trial Running has been so important.
In October one of the last major
configurations of signalling software,
called ELR100, was installed, including
bug fixes which were identified through
Trial Running.
Over Christmas additional upgrades
to the Siemens signalling software
were commissioned and in the coming
months ELR200, the next major
software will be commissioned.
ELR200 is the software, that enables
the Elizabeth line to run 24 trains per
hour at peak and will include further
bug fixes identified whilst continuing
to build reliability.
 
Last edited:

ijmad

Established Member
Joined
7 Jan 2016
Messages
1,810
Location
UK
"80% chance of opening by the end of June"

Seems like optimism has have tumbled significantly...
 

Horizon22

Established Member
Associate Staff
Jobs & Careers
Joined
8 Sep 2019
Messages
7,602
Location
London
I have seen a source (unconfirmed) from somebody that claims to be internal that 27th March will be the start of service at around 0700 from Paddington - Abbey Wood. Any truth to this?
 

iphone76

Member
Joined
6 Nov 2010
Messages
917
Location
South Essex
I have seen a source (unconfirmed) from somebody that claims to be internal that 27th March will be the start of service at around 0700 from Paddington - Abbey Wood. Any truth to this?
We definitely haven't been told anything like this. Personally I can't see it myself.
 

Snow1964

Established Member
Joined
7 Oct 2019
Messages
6,290
Location
West Wiltshire
I have seen a source (unconfirmed) from somebody that claims to be internal that 27th March will be the start of service at around 0700 from Paddington - Abbey Wood. Any truth to this?

I am sure a March date was the earliest of the 3 working options in first half 2022 that has been in various Board and Elizabeth line committee reports.

There were some slightly delayed go / no go decisions due by end January which depended on progress. No idea if the go with March start has happened (or not), nothing has been announced as far as I’m aware.
 

kevin_roche

Member
Joined
26 Feb 2019
Messages
930
I have seen a source (unconfirmed) from somebody that claims to be internal that 27th March will be the start of service at around 0700 from Paddington - Abbey Wood. Any truth to this?

We definitely haven't been told anything like this. Personally I can't see it myself.

I think that may have been possible if the testing news had been better. There was disruption when the tests between Action Mainline and the COS took place and the recent attempt to test 24tph using trains starting at Stratford did not appear to go well. I'm basing my comment on what I saw on signalmaps.co.uk and on real time trains. I think both tests will have to be rescheduled and completed successfully before they will go ahead with opening.
 

JN114

Established Member
Joined
28 Jun 2005
Messages
3,355
There was disruption when the tests between Action Mainline and the COS took place and the recent attempt to test 24tph using trains starting at Stratford did not appear to go well. I'm basing my comment on what I saw on signalmaps.co.uk and on real time trains. I think both tests will have to be rescheduled and completed successfully before they will go ahead with opening.

I’ll reiterate what I said upthread on the supposed “failure” of the test running:-

I wouldn’t read one pixel into timing data for a rail line that is still in the trial phases; there is no way for a lay outsider to discern what is unintended unreliability and what is scenarios being played out as part of these trials.
 

kevin_roche

Member
Joined
26 Feb 2019
Messages
930
There is some additional news regarding possible opening dates following this month's TfL board meeting on the Ian Visits website.

The big tests will start on 13th February where they run mass evacuation drills, with upwards of a thousand staff being led down tunnels and out of access shafts or stations to rehearse how that will happen in practice and check if there are any safety processes that could be improved.

Those trials will run for 6 to 7 weeks, after which, in theory, the line would be certified by the regulators as safe to open.

Andy Byford though reiterated that even after the line is ready to open, he wants to run a couple of weeks of live service — a shadow running phase — with all the staff and systems running as if it had passengers to ensure one final rehearsal before opening.

That means the very earliest that the Elizabeth line could open would be mid-April, although realistically it may be a couple of weeks later, just to allow for final tweaks between the completion of Trial Operations and the start of shadow running.

With Easter weekend being 15th to 18th April and an earlier mention of a plan for a new version of the signalling software (ELR200) to be installed at Easter, it seems to me most likely that the earliest opening dates will be the end of April or early May.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Top