Yep, the question was just how much, we now seemingly have CR's official answer.Thought it was known ages ago there was a big overrun ?
Yep, the question was just how much, we now seemingly have CR's official answer.Thought it was known ages ago there was a big overrun ?
Agreed but there will be a good books worth of story at the end of this and a lot of complexity that RF comments don't handle well...There usually a number of complex reasons for delays so those tutting and drawing conclusions over the cause are almost certainly doing so without much insight.
Don't expect much of an explanation now, every single company involved in the project will now be issuing statements via their solicitors.
I tell you this, in my line of work, any delay means heads will roll. It should well be the case with Crossrail and this latest news.
Keeping to railway topics the Reading station rebuild took nearly a year less than the initial prognostications following a re-phasing of the stage works.This country just can't build anything on time can it?
There's always an exception to prove a rule though, isn't there?Manchester Airport Metrolink line opened about a year ahead of schedule.
Keeping to railway topics the Reading station rebuild took nearly a year less than the initial prognostications following a re-phasing of the stage works.
I may be reading more into your post than you intend - but the sub-text is that you imply that these things are done on time abroad. Again, staying in the transport world I would point you at the Stuttgart 21 and the Berlin-Brandenberg Airport sagas, both in Germany.
Building things is difficult - and building complex systems is even more so. You should try it some time.
in my line of work, any delay means heads will roll. It should well be the case with Crossrail and this latest news.
When does it officially become The Elizabeth line?
Modern Railways (September, p95) reflects that the original Crossrail Chairman and CEO left earlier in the year, before cost overrun and delays were acknowledged.
I doubt that rolling whatever number of heads would make you feel better will help the job of re-phasing the work that remains and getting it completed.
Is there any chance they're underpromising deliberately and might actually beat their revised goal and open in June or something?
Crossrail and many other recent rail projects have been both late and over budget. Where are the penalty clauses? What recompense are the financial institutions and governments (and therefore the taxpayer) going to get for the delays? I tell you this, in my line of work, any delay means heads will roll. It should well be the case with Crossrail and this latest news.
Also trains in Germany are always on time, except when they really are not.....
I work in the real world - and a bit closer to this (and other) projects' coalface than you might think.
Man, I work in the Oil and Gas Industry, on multi-billion dollar projects with investors from Governments, Financial Institutions, and many Engineering and Construction Companies all putting money into projects from Offshore Oil and Gas production platforms, Pipelines, Treatment plants and Cryogenic Facilities and Oil Refineries,
For what it's worth, The Guardian reports Andrew Adonis predicting the opening may not be until 2020: https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news...rail-opening-postponed-until-autumn-next-yearI think everyone was expected a few months of delay but 9+ months is pretty surprising, especially given it's also pushing back the Shenfield and Reading branch services even further. Is there any chance they're underpromising deliberately and might actually beat their revised goal and open in June or something?
Critics accused the government of smuggling out bad news before the return of parliament and questioned why Crossrail executives had been rewarded with new jobs.
Andrew Adonis, the former chair of the national infrastructure commission, said: “It’s clearly a further massive catastrophe for Chris Grayling, who didn’t say a word in public about the scale of the crisis. He himself moved Sir Terry Morgan to be chair of HS2 and that was soon after Andrew Wolstenholme, the chief executive, left.
“The biggest infrastructure project in Europe, in a state of crisis, lost both its leaders with Grayling being awol throughout. To me it’s utterly inexplicable. How can it give anyone confidence that HS2 will be delivered?”
Lord Adonis said the full scale of the problems had yet to emerge, with the industry talking of major issues with signalling systems, and predicted the opening could now be delayed until 2020.
Crossrail bosses, paid some of the largest salaries in the public sector, had long boasted that the complex project was being delivered on time and on budget, but this summer the government and TfL were forced to increase the £14.8bn budget by another £650m. Design, construction and engineering has lasted 10 years with different infrastructure contracts, new trains and three signalling systems.
I may be reading more into your post than you intend - but the sub-text is that you imply that these things are done on time abroad. Again, staying in the transport world I would point you at the Stuttgart 21 and the Berlin-Brandenberg Airport sagas, both in Germany.
Building things is difficult - and building complex systems is even more so. You should try it some time.
Same here, maybe it was a known unknown. Think the "shock" announcement of George Michael being gay when my reaction was "I thought everyone knew, why is this news?"Thought it was known ages ago there was a big overrun ?
I assume this means for absolute timetabling chaos at Liverpool street as the new west Anglia and geml timetable would have been based around crossrail being operational in May
Not sure GA will be ready with their units by May will they ?
Emirates Stadium was completed on time and within budget. Though some might add that their trophy room remains incomplete.Same here, maybe it was a known unknown. Think the "shock" announcement of George Michael being gay when my reaction was "I thought everyone knew, why is this news?"
Emirates Stadium was completed on time and within budget. Though some might add that their trophy room remains incomplete.
How on earth can it be said that this is money wasted on London and the South East? What’s the betting that when it does open it won’t be long before we start hearing about overcrowding? London and the South East have only waited about three decades for this project.
The Northern Hub is very rapidly turning into a great non-event. We've seen that Grayling is certainly not committed to it, and there's not much evidence of great Network Rail enthusiasm either. Whereas that budget overrun on Crossrail will just be meekly accepted as part of the cost of giving London what it needs.The budget overrun on Crossrail is greater than the entire budget of the Northern Hub project, which, incidentally, has a better BCR.
Of course, the boiled egg is refusing to commit to completing one of the biggest pieces of the latter, the Piccadilly–Oxford Road Capacity Improvement, thus making the high-profile Ordsall Chord a white elephant.
From what we gathered the bits many ascribe to being difficult were completed OK a while ago. All the under-London tunnelling got done fine, and the station carcasses likewise. It's the bits that should be more straightforward that seem to be an issue.I do know that coming up with a budget and delivery schedule for such a mega-project seems to be a hostage to fortune - there's no simple benchmark for something of this size under central London (the Jubilee Line extension is the closest I guess
The original budget on CR was £15.9bn cut in value engineering, lowering construction inflation rates*, descoping etc. to £14.8bn (but DfT put aside a contingency of £400m at the same time ) and the budget post July now at £15.4bn with Dft coughing up £450m compared to their contingency of £400m they decided on 7 years ago, so the cost to DfT is only £50m more at the moment.The budget overrun on Crossrail is greater than the entire budget of the Northern Hub project, which, incidentally, has a better BCR.
Of course, the boiled egg is refusing to commit to completing one of the biggest pieces of the latter, the Piccadilly–Oxford Road Capacity Improvement, thus making the high-profile Ordsall Chord a white elephant.
In fairness, it's a lot fuller than the majority of Premier League sides! (I am a neutral by the way).Emirates Stadium was completed on time and within budget. Though some might add that their trophy room remains incomplete.
There are continuing problems with the rolling stock as well. It seems we are still incapable of building trains that work out of the box. Seriously. Why ever is a train (and especially those delivered after the first ones) delivered by the manufacturer on Friday afternoon not in revenue service the following Monday morning? That's what happens with airliners.
From what we gathered the bits many ascribe to being difficult were completed OK a while ago. All the under-London tunnelling got done fine, and the station carcasses likewise.
SilverStreet said: ↑
I assume this means for absolute timetabling chaos at Liverpool street as the new west Anglia and geml timetable would have been based around crossrail being operational in May
The GA changes are TSR 2 May 2019 then TSR 3 May 2020. The changes May 2019 are minor: (i) Southend V 3 - 4 TPH off peak, (ii) Hertford East 2 -3 TPH off peak, (iii) Norwich to Stansted Apt direct hourly, (iv) Liv St - Ips hourly semi-fast extended to Norwich, (v) Meridian Water opens and STAR 2 TPH starts.
So May 2019 changes at Liv St are minor - off peak only.
The big change is TSR 3 May 2020, when whole timetable due for recast. That needs some Liv St platforms to be extended which I read was planned for June/July 2019 when Shenfield to Liv St should have been thinned out after Crossrail opened. But what happens on GA is all up in the air anyway as Network Rail have not committed to any of the platform extensions that are needed to allow 10 car 720s to operate, and no proposed timetables for May 19 or May 20 have been published so whether they are deliverable at all is not clear.
But yes delay to Crossrail may well delay necessary infrastructure works at LivSt which will make it even less likely GA will deliver on franchise commitments