Crossrail - Through Running confirmed for November

[matt_world2004]

Isnt the hardware for 4g in the station and tunnels already there its just been disabled because of interference with the signalling system . Meaning the appropriate software update for the trains should see 4g being turned on overnight.

 

[MikeWh]

It's actually P1-7. If for whatever reason a HeX is diverted to one of the higher platforms, congrats cheaper fare!

I'd be interested if you know whether there is a technical limitation that means P1-7 have to be together. The contra problem which certainly occured during the pandemic was when the first TfL-Rail (as it was then) departed from a low platform and passengers were stung with a HEx fare for a most stations calling service. This was compounded when complaints were ignored even though the first HEx didn't run until all the passengers had exited the platforms at Heathrow.

 

[Horizon22]

I'd be interested if you know whether there is a technical limitation that means P1-7 have to be together. The contra problem which certainly occured during the pandemic was when the first TfL-Rail (as it was then) departed from a low platform and passengers were stung with a HEx fare for a most stations calling service. This was compounded when complaints were ignored even though the first HEx didn't run until all the passengers had exited the platforms at Heathrow.

I don’t believe there’s a technical issue, it’s just more that the lower platforms tend to be for services that run on the Main Line and the higher platforms tend to be those that run on the Relief lines. It was therefore I suppose deemed more likely that HeX would be on those platforms if diverted away from 6/7. I imagine this was set up years ago.

In reality, P8/9 are the least intensively used (currently) so are often put there during disruption. Although it probably happens only for about 1% of trains maybe.

And you’ve rightly highlighted the reverse issue - during engineering works Heathrow Connect / TfL Rail / Elizabeth line passengers getting overcharged until it’s managed with the stand alone readers.

I’m not sure how Victoria for Gatwick Express manage this or whether they are much more strict about P13/14

 

[jeremyjh]

I don’t believe there’s a technical issue, it’s just more that the lower platforms tend to be for services that run on the Main Line and the higher platforms tend to be those that run on the Relief lines. It was therefore I suppose deemed more likely that HeX would be on those platforms if diverted away from 6/7. I imagine this was set up years ago.

In reality, P8/9 are the least intensively used (currently) so are often put there during disruption. Although it probably happens only for about 1% of trains maybe.

And you’ve rightly highlighted the reverse issue - during engineering works Heathrow Connect / TfL Rail / Elizabeth line passengers getting overcharged until it’s managed with the stand alone readers.

I’m not sure how Victoria for Gatwick Express manage this or whether they are much more strict about P13/14

There's a gate on the ticketed side between the Gatwick Express platforms and the remainder of the Southern platforms mostly used by slower services. This can be opened to allow people from non-Express trains that end up there to be directed through barriers that will charge the correct fare. If the Express were to arrive on a different platform, then I guess Oyster and contactless users would be in luck.

 

[Horizon22]

There's a gate on the ticketed side between the Gatwick Express platforms and the remainder of the Southern platforms mostly used by slower services. This can be opened to allow people from non-Express trains that end up there to be directed through barriers that will charge the correct fare. If the Express were to arrive on a different platform, then I guess Oyster and contactless users would be in luck.

Thanks. Anyway this is all going to be a moot point (except for the very select few early morning and late night services) in a week or so.

 

[matt_world2004]

I remember a tfl rail coming into platform 7 once and the MTR/GwR staff getting really angry at people touching out at platform 7 even though there was significant congestion at the 11-10 platforms where they were expecting us to touch out.

 

[Horizon22]

I remember a tfl rail coming into platform 7 once and the MTR/GwR staff getting really angry at people touching out at platform 7 even though there was significant congestion at the 11-10 platforms where they were expecting us to touch out.

Probably because you'd be getting overcharged.

 

[matt_world2004]

Probably because you'd be getting overcharged.

For most intermediate stops on the gwml you shouldn't get charged any more. .

 

[DynamicSpirit]

I've just taken a first proper look at the timetable. Can't help noticing that half the trains skip Acton Main Line and, further West, Iver and Taplow. But in general, the services that skip each of those stations tend to take just as long over the corresponding bit of track as the trains that stop there. For example, on Mon-Fri daytime, all trains take 5 minutes between West Drayton and Langley, irrespective of whether they stop at Iver. Similarly, it's usually 10 minutes from Paddington to Ealing Broadway irrespective of whether the train stops at Action Main Line (In this case with the exception that the xx:25 and xx:55 departures from Paddington skip Action Main Line but still take longer - 13 minutes).

If skipping a station doesn't save any time, then it seems a bit daft to skip it: You're just reducing the service at that station, with no benefit to anyone else.

 

[Acton1991]

I've just taken a first proper look at the timetable. Can't help noticing that half the trains skip Acton Main Line and, further West, Iver and Taplow. But in general, the services that skip each of those stations tend to take just as long over the corresponding bit of track as the trains that stop there. For example, on Mon-Fri daytime, all trains take 5 minutes between West Drayton and Langley, irrespective of whether they stop at Iver. Similarly, it's usually 10 minutes from Paddington to Ealing Broadway irrespective of whether the train stops at Action Main Line (In this case with the exception that the xx:25 and xx:55 departures from Paddington skip Action Main Line but still take longer - 13 minutes).

If skipping a station doesn't save any time, then it seems a bit daft to skip it: You're just reducing the service at that station, with no benefit to anyone else.

Totally agree (although I am slightly biased!). I wonder whether these skip journeys are sped up in the May timetable change, however? Ideally I'd like to see more trains stop at AML - lots of redevelopment happening around the station and therefore increased patronage.

 

[345 050]

I've just taken a first proper look at the timetable. Can't help noticing that half the trains skip Acton Main Line and, further West, Iver and Taplow. But in general, the services that skip each of those stations tend to take just as long over the corresponding bit of track as the trains that stop there. For example, on Mon-Fri daytime, all trains take 5 minutes between West Drayton and Langley, irrespective of whether they stop at Iver. Similarly, it's usually 10 minutes from Paddington to Ealing Broadway irrespective of whether the train stops at Action Main Line (In this case with the exception that the xx:25 and xx:55 departures from Paddington skip Action Main Line but still take longer - 13 minutes).

If skipping a station doesn't save any time, then it seems a bit daft to skip it: You're just reducing the service at that station, with no benefit to anyone else.

The Acton Main Line stop is a bit of a moot point at the moment. I agree at the moment it doesn't matter if the train calls there, the timetable does not line up, so all trains have a fairly hefty amount of slack. However, I would expect the May 2023 TT to tidy most of this up, and it should make sense again.

Thinking out loud I wonder if Old Oak Common stops have been taken into account in the timetable already and all services have some spare time to future proof for this too?

The Iver-Taplow saga is a bit different however. Previously there were semi fast EL services, in the peak only, which skipped Iver, Langley and Taplow. Now it looks like ALL services now skip Taplow or Iver throughout the day. I assume the boffins who wrote the timetable worked out that not a lot of people do that journey, so they can save time for all of the services, whilst no breaking too many trips.

 

[1972Stock]

How are you guys getting to the first Westbound Shenfield train (0711) on Sunday? It seems the 0632 from Liverpool Street has been cancelled, and there are no other services until 0656 and that wouldn't make it on time.

 

[Kilopylae]

However, it is a bit of a shame that crossrail wasn't able to serve Canary Wharf before diverging, but let's leave that thought there...

Wouldn't that have just duplicated an already fast Jubilee line route and screwed over Whitechapel?

I would think that, apart from, possibly, the peaks, the chances of finding a seat are pretty good as the there will be more Elizabeth Line trains than Main Line ones.

Mhm, but it's a much less comfortable seat.

 

[345 050]

How are you guys getting to the first Westbound Shenfield train (0711) on Sunday? It seems the 0632 from Liverpool Street has been cancelled, and there are no other services until 0656 and that wouldn't make it on time.

Taxi from nearby. It looks like the First train from Heathrow will be quite a bit easier to get to in comparison. Even coming in from Colchester etc I don't think you could make it to Shenfield in time. So I imagine there probably won't be that many people - there's a Premier Inn in Brentwood...

Wouldn't that have just duplicated an already fast Jubilee line route and screwed over Whitechapel?


Mhm, but it's a much less comfortable seat.

More for the passengers from the East benefit. Yes, although Whitechapel wasn't in the original plan either, and was added as a result of lobbying from local politicians I believe. Also, no reason it couldn't have done Whitechapel, Canary Wharf and then Stratford. But I'm going off topic, so I'll stop now, before a new thread is created........

 

[1972Stock]

0711

Taxi from nearby. It looks like the First train from Heathrow will be quite a bit easier to get to in comparison. Even coming in from Colchester etc I don't think you could make it to Shenfield in time. So I imagine there probably won't be that many people - there's a Premier Inn in Brentwood...

Where do you think Geoff Marshall will go? I really want to meet him . Technically the Shenfield train is quite a lot earlier than the Heathrow one and Geoff went to Abbey Wood on Opening Day which was 3 minutes earlier and I'm pretty he sure he said that's why. Anyways, I'm still mad at TfL for cancelling it I hope I'm not the only one that's raging. Thanks

 

[JonathanH]

Anyways, I'm still mad at TfL for cancelling it I hope I'm not the only one that's raging.

Not really in their control, given the necessity of a late start to services due to the Network Rail strike the preceding day, which means trains can't get off depots before the Sunday shift starts.

 

[1972Stock]

Not really in their control, given the necessity of a late start to services due to the Network Rail strike the preceding day, which means trains can't get off depots before the Sunday shift starts.

Yea, I guess but they still cancelled it quite short notice - it was there yesterday. My dad will probably drive me. Anything on Geoff?

 

[JonathanH]

Where do you think Geoff Marshall will go?

Who knows?

For visual effect, standing on the platform at Stratford at 0745, taking a picture of the portal at Pudding Mill Lane, then boarding the first train to use the connection, is somewhat better than turning up at Paddington at 0752 for a train to Shenfield that is the first eastbound through the portal.

It isn't, of course, possible to do the first train through both portals as the first Abbey Wood to Heathrow train runs immediately ahead of the Shenfield starter through the core.

But equally, first train at Abbey Wood (0729) for Heathrow might be interesting. Too many permutations to choose from.

 

[1972Stock]

Who knows?

For visual effect, standing on the platform at Stratford at 0745, taking a picture of the portal at Pudding Mill Lane, then boarding the first train to use the connection, is somewhat better than turning up at Paddington at 0752 for a train to Shenfield that is the first eastbound through the portal.

It isn't, of course, possible to do the first train through both portals as the first Abbey Wood to Heathrow train runs immediately ahead of the Shenfield starter through the core.

But equally, first train at Abbey Wood (0729) for Heathrow might be interesting. Too many permutations to choose from.

Where do you think all the other train people will be? How crowded would it be at Shenfield? A possible option is to get the 0711 down from Shenfield to either Farringdon or LST and then get it back up to Stratford for the portal photo. It would be so much easier if the Shenfield train were the train before but alas, it is what it is.

 

[Oxfordblues]

As a Western Region Status Card holder, I wonder how far I'll be able to get to eastbound before I'm excessed. Is there a regional boundary on the Elizabeth Line? I'll be carrying an emergency Oyster card just in case!

 

[Watershed]

As a Western Region Status Card holder, I wonder how far I'll be able to get to eastbound before I'm excessed. Is there a regional boundary on the Elizabeth Line? I'll be carrying an emergency Oyster card just in case!

Unfortunately you can't go any further east than Paddington - this RSTL press release refers.

 

[Horizon22]

How are you guys getting to the first Westbound Shenfield train (0711) on Sunday? It seems the 0632 from Liverpool Street has been cancelled, and there are no other services until 0656 and that wouldn't make it on time.

Saturday is a strike day of course, so it is a late start up on Sunday morning due to no night turn signallers.

 

[Sunil_P]

Aiming to combine doing the new links from Stratford to Whitechapel and Paddington Low Level to Acton with visiting all four stations on the Marlow branch using PAYG. Marlow and Bourne End I visited back in 2011 in paper ticket days, but Cookham and Furze Platt I've never visited before. Doing those two would complete visiting all the current set of stations within the TfL Contactless PAYG area.

 

[345 050]

Who knows?

For visual effect, standing on the platform at Stratford at 0745, taking a picture of the portal at Pudding Mill Lane, then boarding the first train to use the connection, is somewhat better than turning up at Paddington at 0752 for a train to Shenfield that is the first eastbound through the portal.

It isn't, of course, possible to do the first train through both portals as the first Abbey Wood to Heathrow train runs immediately ahead of the Shenfield starter through the core.

But equally, first train at Abbey Wood (0729) for Heathrow might be interesting. Too many permutations to choose from.

Given that the first Reading departure for Abbey Wood is so much later than the first Shenfield departure, it looks like it might be possible to do both.

Is it possible to use contactless payment for GWR services between Paddington and Reading non-stop? I looked on the website and it doesn't say it's not valid, but it isn't clear if the intercity trains are included. Can anyone clear this up? Perhaps I should get paper ticket to avoid confusion. It also says Reservation Mandatory, is that still a rule on any TOC, or have they just not bothered to update this?

 

[Watershed]

Given that the first Reading departure for Abbey Wood is so much later than the first Shenfield departure, it looks like it might be possible to do both.

You can do the first trains in both directions through either the eastern or western portal - but not both sides.

Is it possible to use contactless payment for GWR services between Paddington and Reading non-stop?

Yes.

I looked on the website and it doesn't say it's not valid, but it isn't clear if the intercity trains are included. Can anyone clear this up?

All of the operators and services shown on the map are valid. There are special fares for certain journeys (Heathrow, Gatwick Express, HS1) but it's all valid.

Perhaps I should get paper ticket to avoid confusion. It also says Reservation Mandatory, is that still a rule on any TOC, or have they just not bothered to update this?

No need for a paper ticket, although depending on the circumstances (particularly any Railcards held) this can be cheaper. The only operator where reservations are actually mandatory is the Caledonian Sleeper; other operators just use it as a fudge to prevent journey planners from offering tickets on dates/trains where reservations haven't been released yet.

 

[1972Stock]

You can do the first trains in both directions through either the eastern or western portal - but not both sides.

Are you or anyone you know going to Shenfield or heathrow?

 

[cambsy]

How late will the Elizabeth line start up on morning of Thurs 8th Nov? And how will they run on GWR and Eastern end to Shenfield,until time table gets back to normal? And will morning peak be reduced running and frequency? I presume evening peak be fine?

 

[Watershed]

How late will the Elizabeth line start up on morning of Thurs 8th Nov? And how will they run on GWR and Eastern end to Shenfield,until time table gets back to normal? And will morning peak be reduced running and frequency? I presume evening peak be fine?

The timetable is shown in journey planners. There will be no services outside the Core before around 7am; exact first trains vary depending on the station in question.

The strikes have now been called off, so there's a possibility that the normal timetable might be reinstated for Thursday. No chance for anything before Tuesday though.

 

[miklcct]

What's the time needed for Elizabeth line and Jubilee to travel between Bond Street and Canary Wharf? Are there any circumstances where I can save time by switching from one to the other?

 

[Bigbru]

The timetable is shown in journey planners. There will be no services outside the Core before around 7am; exact first trains vary depending on the station in question.

The strikes have now been called off, so there's a possibility that the normal timetable might be reinstated for Thursday. No chance for anything before Tuesday though.

RMT have cancelled the strikes so should be normal running now.