D345 / 40145

[DarloRich]

Has the above loco been returned to it's owning group from LSL?

 

[Trainfan344]

Yes. The whole affair is very sad.

 

[Iskra]

Yes. The whole affair is very sad.

Can you elaborate?

 

[Charlie Smythe]

Can you elaborate?

I think, don't quote me though as I am not sure, that the owning group and LSL may have fallen out tiny bit hence why 40145 is no longer with LSL.

 

[Trackman]

Can you elaborate?

I posted about it here

edit: In the answer to the original question it's still with LSL AFAIK.

 

[Iskra]

I posted about it here

edit: In the answer to the original question it's still with LSL AFAIK.

Thanks!

 

[Trackman]

Thanks!

No probs.
I think it's something do with the LSL repaint, a lot of members were unhappy about it IIRC.

 

[Iskra]

No probs.
I think it's something do with the LSL repaint, a lot of members were unhappy about it IIRC.

I can understand that tbf, as nice as it looks, it looked good in blue and there is already a green one in service. Luckily, I travelled 145 in Blue before it was repainted.

 

[Trackman]

I can understand that tbf, as nice as it looks, it looked good in blue and there is already a green one in service. Luckily, I travelled 145 in Blue before it was repainted.

The way I see it before the repaint- they did prep work including extensive bodywork repairs, tested electrical systems plus GSMR etc,, refurbed grills, air horns, builders plates, re-sealed all the windows and so on.
.... You do not bite the hand that feeds.

 

[Iskra]

The way I see it before the repaint- they did prep work including extensive bodywork repairs, tested electrical systems plus GSMR etc,, refurbed grills, air horns, builders plates, re-sealed all the windows and so on.
.... You do not bite the hand that feeds.

I can understand that, and this is the issue with one operation being so dominant in the locomotive preservation market.

 

[43096]

I can understand that, and this is the issue with one operation being so dominant in the locomotive preservation market.

The bigger issue is with gobby people on Facebook and the like shouting their mouth off. This was, it seems, on a Facebook site affiliated to the CFPS and has got back to LSL who understandably were less than impressed so the deal was terminated, seemingly mutually.

 

[Skymonster]

The

The bigger issue is with gobby people on Facebook and the like shouting their mouth off. This was, it seems, on a Facebook site affiliated to the CFPS and has got back to LSL who understandably were less than impressed so the deal was terminated, seemingly mutually.

The CFPS comes across as a bit sloped-shouldered to me. It basically told members “too bad” and to suck it up when the loco got repainted and leased to LSL, and members couldn’t all get tickets for the mainline charter. Now it is blaming members for the lease ending early. I’d have thought it was CFPS’ fault that the contract with LSL wasn’t sufficiently watertight, enabling LSL to walk away after a few folks had whinged on Facebook. As far as I can tell, the S in CFPS stands for society, and as such the opinions of its membership should be at least as important as commercial matters. Anyway, best I can tell the deal was due to expire at the end of February, and with seemingly no booked charter work for the loco before then they loss can’t be too great.

 

[Charlie Smythe]

The

The CFPS comes across as a bit sloped-shouldered to me. It basically told members “too bad” and to suck it up when the loco got repainted and leased to LSL, and members couldn’t all get tickets for the mainline charter. Now it is blaming members for the lease ending early. I’d have thought it was CFPS’ fault that the contract with LSL wasn’t sufficiently watertight, enabling LSL to walk away after a few folks had whinged on Facebook. As far as I can tell, the S in CFPS stands for society, and as such the opinions of its membership should be at least as important as commercial matters. Anyway, best I can tell the deal was due to expire at the end of February, and with seemingly no booked charter work for the loco before then they loss can’t be too great.

I can see the members' view in this, their loco has been painted in a colour they don't approve off and they can't get tickets behind said loco. On the other hand, that doesn't justify mouthing off on Facebook to LSL or anyone else for that matter.

You would have thought that it would have been in the CFPS' best interest to maintain a good relationship with a major charter industry such as LSL but clearly not.

 

[Trackman]

The

The CFPS comes across as a bit sloped-shouldered to me. It basically told members “too bad” and to suck it up when the loco got repainted and leased to LSL, and members couldn’t all get tickets for the mainline charter. Now it is blaming members for the lease ending early. I’d have thought it was CFPS’ fault that the contract with LSL wasn’t sufficiently watertight, enabling LSL to walk away after a few folks had whinged on Facebook. As far as I can tell, the S in CFPS stands for society, and as such the opinions of its membership should be at least as important as commercial matters. Anyway, best I can tell the deal was due to expire at the end of February, and with seemingly no booked charter work for the loco before then they loss can’t be too great.

Very well summed up.
The members are calling for heads to be rolled and want an EGM, apparently there wasn't an AGM last year - I'm not saying it's an excuse but Zoom, Microsoft teams anyone?
Also you mention the lease expiry date, I also thought it was the 1st March - with a view to an extension . I think it's a case of not extending the lease rather that termination plus that would have legal consequences.

Edit Update:
40 145 went back today

 

[47827]

Although I'm not planning to take sides and am not linked to to the group in any form, it's a shame to see the situation land up this way and whether he acted rightly or wrongly the chairman (or indeed any other party did) JS is an old industry friend (along with a few others on the engineering side recent and past) I've dealt with in the past and found him very committed indeed. I hope they find another way of returning their loco to mainline service later in the year now its back on form and that those involved as members or in its management find an alternative to simply giving up after their years of hard work.

 

[mjc]

I can see the members' view in this, their loco has been painted in a colour they don't approve off and they can't get tickets behind said loco. On the other hand, that doesn't justify mouthing off on Facebook to LSL or anyone else for that matter.

You would have thought that it would have been in the CFPS' best interest to maintain a good relationship with a major charter industry such as LSL but clearly not.

But it’s not ‘their’ loco, it’s the society’s; admittedly that’s a fine line, as the society is its members but it’s also an organisation of itself which acts through appointed individuals. It they want the loco to be their private pet then they’ll need to put their hands in the pockets to continue to fund it, and find someone with the skills and licensing to operate it on the mainline if they want to ride behind it. The deal with LSL may have required compromise but that’s part of life. And getting upset over a repaint? It’s hardly a permanent issue!

 

[Alanko]

Can't help but think we'll see 40145 pootling about with a few tatty Mk 1s on a heritage line for a while then laid up with an expensive repair bill, sooner or later.

LSL seem to have the drive, determination and money to do very interesting things. Cutting them off seems like a daft decision.

 

[47827]

Can't help but think we'll see 40145 pootling about with a few tatty Mk 1s on a heritage line for a while then laid up with an expensive repair bill, sooner or later.

LSL seem to have the drive, determination and money to do very interesting things. Cutting them off seems like a daft decision.

I'm not taking sides but the CFPS managed a decade and a half of mainline running pre LSL and if they can regroup, learn from the experience and past experiences, and do something similar to the past (albeit taking into account how certain things have moved on such as what on board behaviour is acceptable these days compared to 20 years ago) there's no reason why by the second half of the year they can't pull something together. They did have previous decent relationships with other industry parties that still exist and have worked with other promoters plus done a few in house jobs. I do have confidence it's not the end as for whatever happened with LSL the loco is in decent shape after its time there.

 

[matt]

I'm not taking sides but the CFPS managed a decade and a half of mainline running pre LSL and if they can regroup, learn from the experience and past experiences, and do something similar to the past (albeit taking into account how certain things have moved on such as what on board behaviour is acceptable these days compared to 20 years ago) there's no reason why by the second half of the year they can't pull something together. They did have previous decent relationships with other industry parties that still exist and have worked with other promoters plus done a few in house jobs. I do have confidence it's not the end as for whatever happened with LSL the loco is in decent shape after its time there.

Yes previously the Forty has run with West Coast Railways and prior to that DB Cargo (EWS back then) operated it on Pathfinder trips amongst others.

 

[43096]

But it’s not ‘their’ loco, it’s the society’s; admittedly that’s a fine line, as the society is its members but it’s also an organisation of itself which acts through appointed individuals. It they want the loco to be their private pet then they’ll need to put their hands in the pockets to continue to fund it, and find someone with the skills and licensing to operate it on the mainline if they want to ride behind it. The deal with LSL may have required compromise but that’s part of life. And getting upset over a repaint? It’s hardly a permanent issue!

You can bet those that have been shouting off are "sleeping" members, i.e. those who pay their £25 annual membership (or whatever it is) and then do nothing else to support the group. Other than, of course, shouting their gobs off about what colour it's painted and not liking the stock on a railtour. Given all the work that goes on by a hard-working few - unpaid and in their own time, in case anyone's forgotten - to keep their locos operational, I have no time for the whingers.

 

[47827]

Yes previously the Forty has run with West Coast Railways and prior to that DB Cargo (EWS back then) operated it on Pathfinder trips amongst others.

Correct. There are a couple more licensed operators I think might consider it too that have drivers who have signed it or 40s in the past.

 

[nedchester]

I'm not taking sides but the CFPS managed a decade and a half of mainline running pre LSL and if they can regroup, learn from the experience and past experiences, and do something similar to the past (albeit taking into account how certain things have moved on such as what on board behaviour is acceptable these days compared to 20 years ago) there's no reason why by the second half of the year they can't pull something together. They did have previous decent relationships with other industry parties that still exist and have worked with other promoters plus done a few in house jobs. I do have confidence it's not the end as for whatever happened with LSL the loco is in decent shape after its time there.

Agreed.

I find it bizarre that people are criticising people expressing their opinions on social media about LSL and CFPS by expressing opinions themselves on fora such as this.

I am a former member of the CFPS committee and there is a lot of uninformed comment going on.