E-Tickets v Print at Home Tickets?

[Wallsendmag]

Fine looks like I'll be using the forum a lot less in future as less well informed users are so certain of the rubbish they're spouting.

 

[Haywain]

dangerous nonsense such as this

Whilst I am inclined to agree that it would have been better not mentioned, the line you quote is a very long way from being ‘dangerous nonsense’. It is, very clearly, a joke.

 

[westv]

Whilst I am inclined to agree that it would have been better not mentioned, the line you quote is a very long way from being ‘dangerous nonsense’. It is, very clearly, a joke.

Bill Gates told me it was true.

 

[_toommm_]

Then I think it would have been better if you hadn't mentioned it at all, especially when it gives rise to dangerous nonsense such as this:

For clarity, I’ve had both jabs, and I’m the furthest from an anti-vaxxer you can get. It was clearly satire.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Then I think it would have been better if you hadn't mentioned it at all, especially when it gives rise to dangerous nonsense such as this:

I think that was what is commonly known as "a joke".

 

[Wallsendmag]

I think that was what is commonly known as "a joke".

Serious sense of humor failure on someones part.

 

[JB_B]

To be fair to @MikeWh, earlier today I had a "chat" with a gang of Anti-Vaxxers protesting outside a vaccination centre near me - they're fun to laugh at from a distance but face-to-face nothing erodes your sense of humour quicker. If I'd seen post #15 straight after, I could easlily have posed something similar.

 

[mmh]

Fine looks like I'll be using the forum a lot less in future as less well informed users are so certain of the rubbish they're spouting.

To be fair, you did rather encourage non-serious replies with your "something is coming, but it's Top Secret so if I told you I'd have to kill you!" approach!

So, to be more serious, I hope whatever an s-ticket is leads to improved standardisation. Unfortunately I'm too cynical to automatically assume it will though!

 

[alistairlees]

To be fair, you did rather encourage non-serious replies with your "something is coming, but it's Top Secret so if I told you I'd have to kill you!" approach!

So, to be more serious, I hope whatever an s-ticket is leads to improved standardisation. Unfortunately I'm too cynical to automatically assume it will though!

It’s another standard. The rail industry is great at creating new standards - after all, it gives people something to do - but terrible at getting rid of old ones. See ‘self print’, which I’ve been trying to kill of for 5+ years. Or m-tickets (similar). Etc.

 

[Haywain]

It’s another standard. The rail industry is great at creating new standards - after all, it gives people something to do - but terrible at getting rid of old ones. See ‘self print’, which I’ve been trying to kill of for 5+ years. Or m-tickets (similar). Etc.

About that ‘like’ button…

 

[mmh]

About that ‘like’ button…

Snap, I just wanted one too!

 

[Wallsendmag]

It’s another standard. The rail industry is great at creating new standards - after all, it gives people something to do - but terrible at getting rid of old ones. See ‘self print’, which I’ve been trying to kill of for 5+ years. Or m-tickets (similar). Etc.

Exactly

 

[Hadders]

Meanwhile how many more years will ToD soldier on for...

 

[CyrusWuff]

I can't help but feel this XKCD comic is relevant at this point:

 

[infobleep]

It’s another standard. The rail industry is great at creating new standards - after all, it gives people something to do - but terrible at getting rid of old ones. See ‘self print’, which I’ve been trying to kill of for 5+ years. Or m-tickets (similar). Etc.

Is the problem software suppliers or is it management higher io in a company resisting change? Or maybe something else?

I've come across software suppliers not modernising. So you can get something beneficial and time saving but can't make use of it as the software doesn't support it.

 

[Joe Paxton]

Then I think it would have been better if you hadn't mentioned it at all, especially when it gives rise to dangerous nonsense such as this:

I suspect you might be reading _toommm_'s suggestion with a seriousness that was never intended!

 

[Wallsendmag]

To be fair, you did rather encourage non-serious replies with your "something is coming, but it's Top Secret so if I told you I'd have to kill you!" approach!

So, to be more serious, I hope whatever an s-ticket is leads to improved standardisation. Unfortunately I'm too cynical to automatically assume it will though!

It's still out for consultation so isn't finalised

 

[alistairlees]

Meanwhile how many more years will ToD soldier on for...

I’m working on it!

Is the problem software suppliers or is it management higher io in a company resisting change? Or maybe something else?

I've come across software suppliers not modernising. So you can get something beneficial and time saving but can't make use of it as the software doesn't support it.

No, the problem is not software suppliers. It is those that create and manage standards - RDG and the TOCs.

 

[mmh]

It’s another standard. The rail industry is great at creating new standards - after all, it gives people something to do - but terrible at getting rid of old ones. See ‘self print’, which I’ve been trying to kill of for 5+ years. Or m-tickets (similar). Etc.

A perfect example of this is something I just saw at a station I passed through. Three wheelchair ramps clamped to the wall with stickers on them saying which class of train each was for.

If, and it's a big if, it happens, by the time electronic / mobile ticketing has been standardised it'll be near obsolete as the rest of the world will have moved on to some new invention.

 

[Haywain]

I’m working on it!

You’re not alone!

No, the problem is not software suppliers. It is those that create and manage standards - RDG and the TOCs.

TIS suppliers do play a part - there have to be overlapping standards to allow them all time to achieve accreditation for new standards. Some suppliers can be quite slow, especially if their customers are reluctant to pay.

 

[alistairlees]

You’re not alone!

TIS suppliers do play a part - there have to be overlapping standards to allow them all time to achieve accreditation for new standards. Some suppliers can be quite slow, especially if their customers are reluctant to pay.

Different versions of each standard, I think you mean? Normally 12 months is allowed to upgrade to the latest standard.

The customers you refer to be would be the TOCs and RDG, which change the standards. It seems reasonable that, if they ask suppliers to make changes, they should pay for these? If they don't want to pay, then best not to make changes?

Many suppliers do much work for free, before anyone gets the wrong end of the stick. This is how the eTicket standard was created - it was a collaboration between two TIS suppliers and three of their TOC customers to create a new standard, with each contributing its time freely and collaboratively. The result was the most successful and cost-effective roll out of a new fulfilment type ever - with really positive customer feedback. I think we should follow that model when doing new things. It is usually not followed though.

 

[plugwash]

I guess what everyone is wondering is what are the perceived or real problems with the current e-ticket system that a new standard is needed for fix.

 

[Wallsendmag]

If we can kill off ToD it’ll go a long way towards the end of CCST

 

[py_megapixel]

I guess what everyone is wondering is what are the perceived or real problems with the current e-ticket system that a new standard is needed for fix.

The thing is, from a passenger perspective (which is the only perspective I have, as I do not work in the industry), there aren't really any. The advantage of an e-ticket is that the standard is separate from the medium - an E-ticket can appear on any mobile computing device, can be put onto paper of any size as long as the barcode and text are readable, and will be compatible with almost anything else you might want to fulfill a ticket to in the future as long as it can render a reasonably high resolution image. I find it a little strange that more TOCs haven't switched their ticket offices over to selling printed e-tickets.

We will wait and see what reason there is for this new standard (judging by the way the railway has liked to describe things, I will be exceptionally unsurprised if the S in S-ticket stands for 'smart'). I can't really think of anything that could majorly improve on a world where everything is issued as some form of e-ticket, beyond possibly a harmonisation of the underlying formats between smartcards and paper/screens, which could speed things up by allowing a smartphone with an NFC chip to use that instead of a barcode. But again, we will have to wait and see.

 

[mmh]

If we can kill off ToD it’ll go a long way towards the end of CCST

Nobody's ever explained to me why CCST needs to go.

 

[Bletchleyite]

If we can kill off ToD it’ll go a long way towards the end of CCST

What we need is a system of totally format agnostic e-tickets, so if you book one you can print it at a TVM if you want, for example. And if you buy a ticket at a TVM or booking office it is an e-ticket.

 

[py_megapixel]

Nobody's ever explained to me why CCST needs to go.

• The stock is expensive to produce
• The tickets are not recyclable as paper due to the magstripe
• The magstripe can be erased by being next to something magnetic, unlike a barcode
• Unlike e-tickets, the magstripe doesn't encode a unique identifier for each ticket, which makes it harder to detect fraud
• CCST readers in ticket gates are expensive and fail too often.

There are probably a million other reasons too, but those are the ones I can immediately think of

 

[alistairlees]

• The stock is expensive to produce
• The tickets are not recyclable as paper due to the magstripe
• The magstripe can be erased by being next to something magnetic, unlike a barcode
• Unlike e-tickets, the magstripe doesn't encode a unique identifier for each ticket, which makes it harder to detect fraud
• CCST readers in ticket gates are expensive and fail too often.

There are probably a million other reasons too, but those are the ones I can immediately think of

Basically: it’s completely proprietary. And that means expensive to produce, maintain and integrate. Embracing more open standards is the way to go.

What we need is a system of totally format agnostic e-tickets, so if you book one you can print it at a TVM if you want, for example. And if you buy a ticket at a TVM or booking office it is an e-ticket.

We don't need anything involving integration with TVMs. They are expensive enough as it is.

The thing is, from a passenger perspective (which is the only perspective I have, as I do not work in the industry), there aren't really any. The advantage of an e-ticket is that the standard is separate from the medium - an E-ticket can appear on any mobile computing device, can be put onto paper of any size as long as the barcode and text are readable, and will be compatible with almost anything else you might want to fulfill a ticket to in the future as long as it can render a reasonably high resolution image. I find it a little strange that more TOCs haven't switched their ticket offices over to selling printed e-tickets.

We will wait and see what reason there is for this new standard (judging by the way the railway has liked to describe things, I will be exceptionally unsurprised if the S in S-ticket stands for 'smart'). I can't really think of anything that could majorly improve on a world where everything is issued as some form of e-ticket, beyond possibly a harmonisation of the underlying formats between smartcards and paper/screens, which could speed things up by allowing a smartphone with an NFC chip to use that instead of a barcode. But again, we will have to wait and see.

Basically it's eTickets for higher value products, like seasons.

 

[Haywain]

We don't need anything involving integration with TVMs. They are expensive enough as it is.

Hear hear.

 

[Vespa]

I preferred to print eTickets and I usually print two sets, one and spare just in case and I take a photo of it, it requires no batteries and better than a card ticket which you don't want to lose even if you take a photo of it like I do.

Never fancied electronic mobile tickets, heard of passengers being charged when their phone fails or battery runs flat, then you have to go through the faff to get your money back, it is NOT a customer friendly system.