ECML Power Supply Upgrade

[Richard123]

The planned ECML South upgrade to autotransformer feeding was (almost) entirely descoped to boosterless classic feeding. The requirement for insulated ATF runs because of possession arrangements with respect to the ECML's non-bidi paired-by-direction configuration may have been a factor in that.

There are some videos online on this.

The ECML south was planned to be fed by just two feeder stations, Corey's Mill and Essendine. AT was planned to carry this power all the way from Wood Green in London to Bawtry near Doncaster.

As planned timetables became more demanding they could not be supported by the original design, and the cost and impact were also becoming apparent. The strategy changed from two feeder stations supplying this area to seven. AT works around Corey's Mill were already started in the first phase from 2014 as this was the first area started to support Thameslink upgrade. That is the Welwyn to Hitchin section mentioned.

North of Bawtry was a separate power supply upgrade started in 2020, to a still more demanding timetable requirement.

Three interventions enabled the additional capacity:
Bawtry to near Durham was delivered by Hambleton Jn SFC, with existing feeding areas adjusted using the new power.
Just south of Durham to just north of Newcastle there was to be a second transformer at Benton FS.
Just north of Newcastle to Edinburgh was to be delivered by Marshall Meadows SFC, with feeding areas adjusted using the new power.

Of these Hambleton Jn SFC, and Benton FS are both in service, but work on Marshall Meadows stopped during Covid.

 

[Railperf]

Any news on the planned feeder at Innerwick - as TPE 802s running in diesel at the moment.

 

[59CosG95]

Any news on the planned feeder at Innerwick - as TPE 802s running in diesel at the moment.

The Scottish feeders (Portobello FS, Longniddry MPTSC, East Linton TSC, Innerwick FS and Reston TSC) have now been moved out of ECPSU and into a separate Scottish programme.
Don't think there's enough cash in the kitty for Innerwick just yet.

 

[GraphitProjekt]

Reston is a mid-point isnt it?

 

[GRALISTAIR]

Reston is a mid-point isnt it?

I have it down as a TSC - Track Sectioning Cabinet

 

[Railperf]

The Scottish feeders (Portobello FS, Longniddry MPTSC, East Linton TSC, Innerwick FS and Reston TSC) have now been moved out of ECPSU and into a separate Scottish programme.
Don't think there's enough cash in the kitty for Innerwick just yet.

Why did it get moved into another project?

 

[GRALISTAIR]

Why did it get moved into another project?

Possibly partly political? Scotland railways are devolved and decided by the Scottish government Transport for Scotland.

 

[Bald Rick]

Possibly partly political? Scotland railways are devolved and decided by the Scottish government Transport for Scotland.

Not political. just not needed for the service specification that was expected at the time.

 

[Trainbike46]

Not political. just not needed for the service specification that was expected at the time.

Sorry, it was not considered necessary to upgrade the power supply on the northern ECML, you know that railway where TPE has been running bimodes on diesel under the wires since 2019? The same railway where Lumo allegedly* can't expand their 5-car units to 10-car units because it would draw too much power from the overhead?

Am I missing something? because that seems kind of insane.

*This was reported in some local press based on what was said by an MP, so depending on how much you trust MPs or local press you may wish to take that story with a grain of salt.

 

[InOban]

Since the Freight operators are using diesel because it's cheaper than electricity, maybe there's no incentive to upgrade the electricity supply

 

[GraphitProjekt]

I have it down as a TSC - Track Sectioning Cabinet

hate to be the tedious one sorry!
But, it's apparently fitted with an OHNS. I have it as the midpoint between Marshall Meadows FS northerly feed and Innerwick FS south-facing feed

 

[Trainbike46]

Since the Freight operators are using diesel because it's cheaper than electricity, maybe there's no incentive to upgrade the electricity supply

You can't have it both ways though - either there is a shortage of electricity capacity (and it needs to be upgraded) or all bimodes should be able to run on electric the whole way. As long as TPE needs to run on diesel, I would say it is an impossible position to hold that the electricity supply doesn't need upgrading

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 9 May 2025 ==

I feel like I must be missing something, because my post above makes very little sense otherwise!

 

[GraphitProjekt]

(To be clear i fully agree with you, and your tone of outrage)
I think there was mention of some projected loss of a certain freight market in that area. Along with an excuse about 'no one travels post covid'. But i can't really recalll where i saw those.

In terms of FOCs not wanting to use electric traction. Why have gbrf invested in the class 99 sets? Do they expect to actually never use the electric capability/just for show? And also i believe Freightliner struck a deal for electricity charges that enables them to use their class 90s here and there?

 

[zwk500]

(To be clear i fully agree with you, and your tone of outrage)
I think there was mention of some projected loss of a certain freight market in that area. Along with an excuse about 'no one travels post covid'. But i can't really recalll where i saw those.

I suspect funding will have been the major factor, particularly for those signing the cheques.

In terms of FOCs not wanting to use electric traction. Why have gbrf invested in the class 99 sets? Do they expect to actually never use the electric capability/just for show? And also i believe Freightliner struck a deal for electricity charges that enables them to use their class 90s here and there?

FOCs want to use electric traction, it just wasn't viable for a period when energy prices were insanely high. The cost has now reduced and FL have presumably now got longer-term agreement for the price of traction electricity they pay for and therefore are able to plan their workings accordingly.

Electric freight still has awkward costs attached to it because nearly every potential freight flow that might have electric haulage would need at least one loco swap to/from Diesel. Class 99s (and 93s) address this issue very directly by having full bi-mode capability.

 

[GraphitProjekt]

I suspect funding will have been the major factor, particularly for those signing the cheques.

Even though Marshall Meadows was halted mid-construction!? Similar things have happened to the WCML PSU that was started in the early 2000s and is still unfinished with substations half built. I hope they can easily pick the project back up.

Electric freight still has awkward costs attached to it because nearly every potential freight flow that might have electric haulage would need at least one loco swap to/from Diesel. Class 99s (and 93s) address this issue very directly by having full bi-mode capability.

Yeah i believe Garston container port is the only port where an electric loco can propell a container train all the way under the crains.

 

[GRALISTAIR]

hate to be the tedious one sorry!
But, it's apparently fitted with an OHNS. I have it as the midpoint between Marshall Meadows FS northerly feed and Innerwick FS south-facing feed

It was this map that I used. I can't remember the source of the map now, sorry. That is why I said what I said. However, you obviously have more knowledge of the project than I do, so I will bow to your better knowledge.

 

[swt_passenger]

hate to be the tedious one sorry!
But, it's apparently fitted with an OHNS. I have it as the midpoint between Marshall Meadows FS northerly feed and Innerwick FS south-facing feed

The public online version of the Scotland Route sectional appendix does now show a Reston OHNS.

 

[GRALISTAIR]

The public online version of the sectional appendix does now show a Reston OHNS.

Good to know thanks. I had not rechecked. I will amend my records.

 

[swt_passenger]

Good to know thanks. I had not rechecked. I will amend my records.

I’d also note that it’s only an OHNS in the Scotland Route SA, in the LNE SA it’s only a GSP. Weird…

 

[takno]

I’d also note that it’s only an OHNS in the Scotland Route SA, in the LNE SA it’s only a GSP. Weird…

I don't think there's anything particularly automated about the SA generation. Stuff that's over the border is probably just put there for information, and will only get updated if anybody notices.

 

[zwk500]

I don't think there's anything particularly automated about the SA generation. Stuff that's over the border is probably just put there for information, and will only get updated if anybody notices.

There's nothing automated about the SA, AIUI.

 

[swt_passenger]

I don't think there's anything particularly automated about the SA generation. Stuff that's over the border is probably just put there for information, and will only get updated if anybody notices.

That figures. I was also amused to see that route SC147 is shown starting at a place called Berwick (Scotland)…

 

[GraphitProjekt]

It was this map that I used. I can't remember the source of the map now, sorry. That is why I said what I said. However, you obviously have more knowledge of the project than I do, so I will bow to your better knowledge.

no no! I absolutely don't. All i have is a tab open on railcodes.org and a copy of the P.W. Semmens book that discusses the original setup. Often documents don't bother listing whether a TSC is mid-point or not

The public online version of the Scotland Route sectional appendix does now show a Reston OHNS.

My understanding is that it's been there since the start. Railcodes say it was moved by one chain in 2016.

I’d also note that it’s only an OHNS in the Scotland Route SA, in the LNE SA it’s only a GSP. Weird…

(I almost got confused there! Of course, that is a "ground switch panel" for the crossovers — not a "grid supply point" which i initially read it as!)

I think the reason it doesn't show the OHNS is that the LNE SA is discussing the Line of Route "LN 600" which is (for whatever reason) defined as Shaftholme Junction (a little north of doncaster) to specifically Reston GSP and no further. While the Scottish SA is showing "SC 147" which is defined as Berwick station to Edinburgh Haymarket (west jnc) and so overlaps slightly with LN 600. The LNE SA also doesn't show Reston station either because it's slightly beyond where that Line of Route ends.

 

[buz33]

It was this map that I used. I can't remember the source of the map now, sorry.

I think it would have been from the Network Rail site.

 

[GRALISTAIR]

I think it would have been from the Network Rail site.

Brilliant. Thanks. That was it exactly.

 

[Bald Rick]

Sorry, it was not considered necessary to upgrade the power supply on the northern ECML, you know that railway where TPE has been running bimodes on diesel under the wires since 2019? The same railway where Lumo allegedly* can't expand their 5-car units to 10-car units because it would draw too much power from the overhead?

Am I missing something? because that seems kind of insane.

*This was reported in some local press based on what was said by an MP, so depending on how much you trust MPs or local press you may wish to take that story with a grain of salt.

I said it was not needed for the service specification that was expected at the time

Regarding Lumo and 10 car trains. Do you think it would be a good use of the limited railway capital budget to spend tens of millions on power upgrades specifically to enable a privately funded oprator to carry more passengers from London to Edinburgh?

 

[themiller]

I said it was not needed for the service specification that was expected at the time

Regarding Lumo and 10 car trains. Do you think it would be a good use of the limited railway capital budget to spend tens of millions on power upgrades specifically to enable a privately funded oprator to carry more passengers from London to Edinburgh?

Irrespective of the public/private argument, there should be sufficient capacity to run all trains in electric that want to run including potential freight and a reserve for unforeseen circumstances such as diversions. If the capacity isn’t provided, freight will stay diesel hauled and passenger trains will need to be hybrid!

 

[The Middle]

I said it was not needed for the service specification that was expected at the time

Regarding Lumo and 10 car trains. Do you think it would be a good use of the limited railway capital budget to spend tens of millions on power upgrades specifically to enable a privately funded oprator to carry more passengers from London to Edinburgh?

....and TPE to run in electric and ECML freight to run on the wires and Northern to run on electric to Morpeth (& beyond) and remove the 80% power restriction that currently exists on all electric services.....

 

[GraphitProjekt]

The project was halted mid-construction, so lots of the investment has already been spent just to create no benefit

 

[takno]

I said it was not needed for the service specification that was expected at the time

Regarding Lumo and 10 car trains. Do you think it would be a good use of the limited railway capital budget to spend tens of millions on power upgrades specifically to enable a privately funded oprator to carry more passengers from London to Edinburgh?

Personally I'd happily see the money spent on enabling double length Lumo sets and everything else on the line to run electric. It seems odd to spend a crazy amount of money on the southern ECML, and then limit the usefulness of that. Scotland seem to have moved on a bit from the point where they want to limit capacity with odd new stations on the line, but it seems like they would still rather mess around electrifying to Dalmeny instead of spending the money to make the electrification they already have work properly