ECRs and ROCs - any transfer updates?

[59CosG95]

Hi all,
So far, AIUI, the following ECRs (Electrical Control Rooms) have been transferred to their ROCs (Rail Operating Centres):

• LNE (York): Yes (at York ROC)
• EM (Derby/East Mids Control Centre): No (MML still at York ROC. Due date of transfer to Dery ROC/EMCC unknown)
• Anglia (Romford): Yes (at Romford ROC; signalling not due to transfer yet AIUI. Date unknown)
• LNW(S) (Rugby): Yes (at Rugby ROC)
• LNW(N) (Manchester Ashburys): No (AIUI the AC in the NW is still controlled from Crewe ECR. Due date of transfer unknown. Merseyrail DC done from Sandhills)
• Scotland (Glasgow Cowlairs): No (AIUI the Scottish AC is still controlled from Cathcart ECR. Due date of transfer unknown)
• Kent (Gillingham): No (DC still split between Lewisham, Paddock Wood & Canterbury. Due date of transfer unknown)
• Sussex (Three Bridges): No (DC still split between Selhurst & Brighton. Due date of transfer unknown)
• Wessex (Basingstoke): No (DC still split between Raynes Park & Eastleigh. Due date of transfer unknown)
• Western (Didcot/Thames Valley Signalling Centre): Yes (at Didcot ROC/TVSC)
• Wales (Cardiff/Wales ROC): No (SWML from Severn Tunnel still Didcot controlled. Core Valley Lines to be controlled from Taff's Well AFAIK.)

Does anyone know any more?

 

[Haywain]

the following ECRs have been transferred to their ROCs:

What does this mean? You have a post full of abbreviations without explanation.

 

[snowball]

I too was wondering what ECRs are, but ROCs are Railway Operating Centres, which among other things are mega-signaboxes. A few years ago the plan was that over several decades, the control of all points and signals would be transferred to about a dozen ROCs. (I think the proposed number started at about 14 but went down to about 11 over the course of a few years.)

In some areas the ROC programme is proceeding, though reduced in speed. In others it seems to have been modified so that some major signalling centres not on the ROC list will keeep going for a long time. The need to integrate Network Rail facilities with TOC facilities has come into view since the original plan.

 

[swt_passenger]

ECR is electrical control room. Remote control of the traction power. In the original big consolidation plan they were supposed to be co-located with the ROCs at some stage.

 

[pdeaves]

In others it seems to have been modified so that some major signalling centres not on the ROC list will keeep going for a long time

And, for interest's sake, some places like Tyneside have become ROCs when they weren't originally going to.

 

[SilentGrade]

The electrical control for East Midlands was planned to transfer to Derby this year.

 

[Geeves]

I presume if the ECR moved from York to Derby are they not just moving an empty desk? Unless the South MML is at York?

 

[swt_passenger]

I presume if the ECR moved from York to Derby are they not just moving an empty desk?

Not if they’re already controlling Farringdon to Corby - (which they are).

 

[Geeves]

Ha, I just edited my own post, is it really controlled from York? You learn something everyday!

 

[swt_passenger]

Ha, I just edited my own post, is it really controlled from York? You learn something everyday!

Yes, I just looked it up. Of course the dual electrified stretch is controlled by York and Lewisham. Hope they’ve a reliable phone line…

 

[Elecman]

Hi all,
So far, AIUI, the following ECRs (Electrical Control Rooms) have been transferred to their ROCs (Rail Operating Centres):

• LNE (York): Yes (at York ROC)
• EM (Derby/East Mids Control Centre): No (MML still at York ROC. Due date of transfer to Dery ROC/EMCC unknown)
• Anglia (Romford): Yes (at Romford ROC; signalling not due to transfer yet AIUI. Date unknown)
• LNW(S) (Rugby): Yes (at Rugby ROC)
• LNW(N) (Manchester Ashburys): No (AIUI the AC in the NW is still controlled from Crewe ECR. Due date of transfer unknown. Merseyrail DC done from Sandhills)
• Scotland (Glasgow Cowlairs): No (AIUI the Scottish AC is still controlled from Cathcart ECR. Due date of transfer unknown)
• Kent (Gillingham): No (DC still split between Lewisham, Paddock Wood & Canterbury. Due date of transfer unknown)
• Sussex (Three Bridges): No (DC still split between Selhurst & Brighton. Due date of transfer unknown)
• Wessex (Basingstoke): No (DC still split between Raynes Park & Eastleigh. Due date of transfer unknown)
• Western (Didcot/Thames Valley Signalling Centre): Yes (at Didcot ROC/TVSC)
• Wales (Cardiff/Wales ROC): No (SWML from Severn Tunnel still Didcot controlled. Core Valley Lines to be controlled from Taff's Well AFAIK.)

Does anyone know any more?

Rugby has NOT moved is still located in the original ECR building

 

[Horizon22]

Kent doesn't really have a ROC, with Gillingham & Ashford controlling much of Kent signalling, with some also at Three Bridges, whilst Control are in Blackfriars.

 

[Bald Rick]

And, for interest's sake, some places like Tyneside have become ROCs when they weren't originally going to.

Tyneside isn’t a ROC...

 

[pdeaves]

Tyneside isn’t a ROC...

Quote from 15 January 2022-dated weekly notice:

RE-CONTROL OF SIGNALLING
FROM 05:00 HOURS MONDAY 27th DECEMBER
From 0500hrs on Monday 27th December 2021 the area controlled by Tyneside IECC will have the Signalling Control System renewed.
Tyneside IECC will be renamed and become known as Tyneside ROC

Network Rail says it's a ROC

 

[zwk500]

Quote from 15 January 2022-dated weekly notice:



Network Rail says it's a ROC

Do you know if this is intended to be permanent (and therefore a modification of the original plan for York to control the entire ECML in England) or if it's a stepping stone to eventual transfer into York?

 

[bramling]

Tyneside isn’t a ROC...

From what I gather, the people working there seem to be of the understanding that it now is.

It may be a case of semantics? Given that the original IECC interface is being replaced, so it can’t truthfully claim to be “Tyneside IECC” any more.

 

[Bald Rick]

Quote from 15 January 2022-dated weekly notice:



Network Rail says it's a ROC

Well I stand corrected, apologies! Albeit not for another 9 days

 

[pdeaves]

Well I stand corrected, apologies! Albeit not for another 9 days

Took place over the Christmas break, past tense.

 

[Bald Rick]

Took place over the Christmas break, past tense.

So it is. I’m having a bad day/week/year !

 

[John Webb]

Interesting re East Midlands electrical control currently being at York and then moving to Derby. What happens to the south end of the MML as their signalling is to remain at West Hampstead albeit with the latter being re-equipped with workstations as a replacement for the current eNtrance-eXit panel dating from the late 1970s?

 

[59CosG95]

Interesting re East Midlands electrical control currently being at York and then moving to Derby. What happens to the south end of the MML as their signalling is to remain at West Hampstead albeit with the latter being re-equipped with workstations as a replacement for the current eNtrance-eXit panel dating from the late 1970s?

ISTR that the reason for the retention of West Hampstead was that the local knowledge of Thameslink routing during disruption would be lost if everything was recontrolled to Derby.
I think the only other routes in the East Mids to the west of the ECML which aren't Derby controlled are the North Staffs route (North Staffs Jn - Stoke-on-Trent), the Ivanhoe route (Knighton Jn - Burton-on-Trent via Coalville), the LNW side of the Lichfield-Burton route via Alrewas, and the Helpston-Syston section of the Leicester-Peterborough route.

I'm not sure how this would work with Lincoln SCC in the future, but that's a topic for another thread.

 

[rower40]

ISTR that the reason for the retention of West Hampstead was that the local knowledge of Thameslink routing during disruption would be lost if everything was recontrolled to Derby.

Ditto the reason for not re-locating the new Tyneside desks to the York ROC. It's quite a long commute from Newcastle to York.

 

[swt_passenger]

In the current Modern Railways “Trackwatch” column there’s a long list of line and location renamings, all associated with “Tyneside ROC”. A full page height list in fact. Presumably as control areas enlarge there’s always going to be a need for things like loops and sidings to have more geographically accurate names, and to avoid duplication?

 

[Nicholas Lewis]

Hi all,
So far, AIUI, the following ECRs (Electrical Control Rooms) have been transferred to their ROCs (Rail Operating Centres):

• LNE (York): Yes (at York ROC)
• EM (Derby/East Mids Control Centre): No (MML still at York ROC. Due date of transfer to Dery ROC/EMCC unknown)
• Anglia (Romford): Yes (at Romford ROC; signalling not due to transfer yet AIUI. Date unknown)
• LNW(S) (Rugby): Yes (at Rugby ROC)
• LNW(N) (Manchester Ashburys): No (AIUI the AC in the NW is still controlled from Crewe ECR. Due date of transfer unknown. Merseyrail DC done from Sandhills)
• Scotland (Glasgow Cowlairs): No (AIUI the Scottish AC is still controlled from Cathcart ECR. Due date of transfer unknown)
• Kent (Gillingham): No (DC still split between Lewisham, Paddock Wood & Canterbury. Due date of transfer unknown)
• Sussex (Three Bridges): No (DC still split between Selhurst & Brighton. Due date of transfer unknown)
• Wessex (Basingstoke): No (DC still split between Raynes Park & Eastleigh. Due date of transfer unknown)
• Western (Didcot/Thames Valley Signalling Centre): Yes (at Didcot ROC/TVSC)
• Wales (Cardiff/Wales ROC): No (SWML from Severn Tunnel still Didcot controlled. Core Valley Lines to be controlled from Taff's Well AFAIK.)

Does anyone know any more?

Raynes Pk and Selhurst ECR's were commissioned in 1952 so have done pretty well as they were deemed life expired decades ago with Canterbury in 1960. Paddock Wood was modernised in early 1980's.

 

[Elecman]

LNW (South) is NOT based at Rugby ROC but still in its original location in the old EMD

 

[Peregrine 4903]

Kent doesn't really have a ROC, with Gillingham & Ashford controlling much of Kent signalling, with some also at Three Bridges, whilst Control are in Blackfriars.

I thought the orignial plan was for eventually all of Kent to be controlled from Three Bridges, effectively combining the Kent and Sussex routes into the South East route. Almost certainly has changed now.

 

[Horizon22]

I thought the orignial plan was for eventually all of Kent to be controlled from Three Bridges, effectively combining the Kent and Sussex routes into the South East route. Almost certainly has changed now.

I think initially yes, but as you say that's since stalled somewhat and would be decades in the making. Kent doesn't really have an identifiable entre like many other routes

 

[Peregrine 4903]

I think initially yes, but as you say that's since stalled somewhat and would be decades in the making. Kent doesn't really have an identifiable entre like many other routes

There will be more of Kent transferring over to TBROC as the VICASC resignalling continues. Nothing else planned to transfer to TBROC from both Kent or Sussex as far as I'm aware anytime soon.

 

[Horizon22]

There will be more of Kent transferring over to TBROC as the VICASC resignalling continues. Nothing else planned to transfer to TBROC from both Kent or Sussex as far as I'm aware anytime soon.

No and a lot of North Kent signalling is still relatively recent anyway.

 

[High Dyke]

ISTR that the reason for the retention of West Hampstead was that the local knowledge of Thameslink routing during disruption would be lost if everything was recontrolled to Derby.
I think the only other routes in the East Mids to the west of the ECML which aren't Derby controlled are the North Staffs route (North Staffs Jn - Stoke-on-Trent), the Ivanhoe route (Knighton Jn - Burton-on-Trent via Coalville), the LNW side of the Lichfield-Burton route via Alrewas, and the Helpston-Syston section of the Leicester-Peterborough route.

I'm not sure how this would work with Lincoln SCC in the future, but that's a topic for another thread.

Don't forget the outpost of Allington signal box. Still going strong sandwiched between Doncaster PSB (ECML) and East Midlands Control Centre (EMCC).