Edinburgh & the Lothians bus network speculations & ideas

[TheEastCoaster]

Ideally this is how the 400 should run and not divert into Wester Hailes itself

To be fair, the 400 offers a link from Wester Hailes for the likes of Colinton, Oxgangs and Gilmerton so it can be forgiven that it serves Clovenstone.

The X40 will be the "faster way" but obviously still offer connections at Westside Plaza and be Wester Hailes direct connection to West Lothian

 

[overthewater]

When it comes to this new X40 timetable, Lothian country would have set the timetable and suggested the revised route, however the council would have had the final say to approve it.

 

[stevenedin]

Its been established long ago they’re not coming back, especially now with the 31 losing its sunday service and more than likely McGills handing the 20, 63, 68 to Lothian

Maybe this is why Lothian brought those street airs to marine. They may convert them to diesel to operate 68

 

[danielhogg2005]

Maybe this is why Lothian brought those street airs to marine. They may convert them to diesel to operate 68

Or even 20 and/or 63

 

[Jordan Adam]

Maybe this is why Lothian brought those street airs to marine. They may convert them to diesel to operate 68

Seems like a bit of a pie in the sky idea, especially for just one route that isn't particularly significant. If they were planning to convert them to diesel it surely would've been done by now?

 

[stevenedin]

Seems like a bit of a pie in the sky idea, especially for just one route that isn't particularly significant. If they were planning to convert them to diesel it surely would've been done by now?

Maybe if they are to buy new or second hand buses it may work out more expensive and they at need extra buses. You never know they could be for the X40. I guess we will need to wait and see.

 

[LothianBusesPh]

You never know they could be for the X40. I guess we will need to wait and see.

You are acting like it is actually happening, which it isn't.

 

[stevenedin]

You are acting like it is actually happening, which it isn't.

Something will happen to them eventually whether they are getting scrapped, sold or fixed so anything could happen.

 

[FlybeDash8Q400]

You are acting like it is actually happening, which it isn't.

Still waiting on 195-198. No other credible options to be honest. 4 buses for a likely route requirement of 3? Seems too good to miss. Yes, they need work, but Eclipse2’s are pretty much perfect for this.

I still think we’ll see all of 841-850 head west too for frequency increases, extra spares and crucially for the 72. We could see some of the ex London’s work the X40, but I feel this would be unnecessary. Those better in the knowledge should hopefully be able to answer this, but am I right in saying B5LH’s will be basically forbidden from the X40 owing to the limiter? They’re limited to 42mph if I’m right in saying and the A720 has the 70mph speed limit. Doesn’t sound like a great idea.

For others asking about the costs of having the extra bus on the X40. I think the likely greatly increased usage within Edinburgh will offset its costs.

 

[stevenedin]

Still waiting on 195-198. No other credible options to be honest. 4 buses for a likely route requirement of 3? Seems too good to miss. Yes, they need work, but Eclipse2’s are pretty much perfect for this.

I still think we’ll see all of 841-850 head west too for frequency increases, extra spares and crucially for the 72. We could see some of the ex London’s work the X40, but I feel this would be unnecessary. Those better in the knowledge should hopefully be able to answer this, but am I right in saying B5LH’s will be basically forbidden from the X40 owing to the limiter? They’re limited to 42mph if I’m right in saying and the A720 has the 70mph speed limit. Doesn’t sound like a great idea.

For others asking about the costs of having the extra bus on the X40. I think the likely greatly increased usage within Edinburgh will offset its costs.

I’m sure that 195-198 will almost definitely (in my opinion) move west, possibly 199 as well. Also are there some spare 7900s which could be moved as well? (although I wouldn’t wish them on anyone lol).

As has been previously stated on one of these, I doubt that 926-934 will ever see a comeback and I’m not sure if we will see 935 again either but anything is possible.

It is possible that some of the ex London Lothian buses in the old Lothian livery could be repainted and transferred maybe next year once new buses arrive.

 

[LothianBusesPh]

I feel we have too many singles but too little at the same time. Lothian need to move them sooner rather than later if they are to go back in service. If they start repainting them, in theory they only need to repaint 2 before launch, (ideally all 4 though, and 3 would be needed if you wanted a spare that wasn't a double deck), and give 199 Lothian Country vinyls, but at the same time 199 is needed at East Coast Buses, which means 199 is out of the question, unless they swap 199 with one of 195-198 and then repaint that bus at a later date?

 

[buslad1988]

I feel we have too many singles but too little at the same time. Lothian need to move them sooner rather than later if they are to go back in service. If they start repainting them, in theory they only need to repaint 2 before launch, (ideally all 4 though, and 3 would be needed if you wanted a spare that wasn't a double deck), and give 199 Lothian Country vinyls, but at the same time 199 is needed at East Coast Buses, which means 199 is out of the question, unless they swap 199 with one of 195-198 and then repaint that bus at a later date?

I’d imagine they’ll just stick standard Lothian Country deckers on the X40 rather than the hassle and cost of repainting singles.

Having deckers on the route will also make it stand out to potential new customers… and if those passengers come then the capacity is already there.

 

[stevenedin]

I’d imagine they’ll just stick standard Lothian Country deckers on the X40 rather than the hassle and cost of repainting singles.

Having deckers on the route will also make it stand out to potential new customers… and if those passengers come then the capacity is already there.

I think that this would be a good idea if they do this. At least at first until they see what the usage is.

 

[ScotRail158725]

Maybe this is why Lothian brought those street airs to marine. They may convert them to diesel to operate 68

It's almost impossible to convert an electric bus to diesel; this theory certainly has no chance of happening.

I’d imagine they’ll just stick standard Lothian Country deckers on the X40 rather than the hassle and cost of repainting singles.

They’ve got enough spare at Lothian Country for this to happen, especially if the ex Motorcoach Geminis are moving then there will be more than enough to cover all the work without bringing any singles over.

 

[LothianBusesPh]

They’ve got enough spare at Lothian Country for this to happen, especially if the ex Motorcoach Geminis are moving then there will be more than enough to cover all the work without bringing any singles over

That's what I think will and should happen but I was giving a point of view on if they were to use Singles.

 

[Busman757]

Its almost impossible to convert an electric bus to diesel, this theory certainly has no chance of happening


They’ve got enough spare at Lothian Country for this to happen, especially if the ex Motorcoach Geminis are moving then there will be more than enough to cover all the work without bringing any singles over

I’ve heard at the moment the plan is to use the 800’s at the moment (they are currently at Seafield having Lothian Country branding applied) with more of the 500’s going over at a later date.

 

[stevenedin]

I’ve heard at the moment the plan is to use the 800’s at the moment (they are currently at Seafield having Lothian Country branding applied) with more of the 500’s going over at a later date.

551-570?

 

[LothianBusesPh]

551-570?

This comment has confused me as I doubt any of them are leaving Lothian's main fleet anytime soon, especially considering they have just been repainted (though Lothian don't really care about that.)

 

[TheEastCoaster]

This comment has confused me as I doubt any of them are leaving Lothian's main fleet anytime soon, especially considering they have just been repainted (though Lothian don't really care about that.)

Think this is in the wrong Lothian Forum.

Let's flashforward a few months from now, the X40 and 72 are comfortable additions to the Lothian Country network, the X40 gets more city passengers making use of it with the Ridacard and day ticket options and the 72 sparks usage for Winchburgh residents.

Question is what happens next afterwards, assuming LCB can take the 20 and 63 from McGills, the question being is will they?

There is the question being that if the 72 becomes a hit, will they extend it to Queensferry and see if it connects with the 43?

 

[stevenedin]

Think this is in the wrong Lothian Forum.

Let's flashforward a few months from now, the X40 and 72 are comfortable additions to the Lothian Country network, the X40 gets more city passengers making use of it with the Ridacard and day ticket options and the 72 sparks usage for Winchburgh residents.

Question is what happens next afterwards, assuming LCB can take the 20 and 63 from McGills, the question being is will they?

There is the question being that if the 72 becomes a hit, will they extend it to Queensferry and see if it connects with the 43?

I can see them being a hit. Some journeys could even start as a 72 and turn into a 43 to save a lot of dead mileage.

I think also Broxburn to Livingston passengers will use the 72 as well as they only really have the 23 and X24 now.

 

[FlybeDash8Q400]

There is the question being that if the 72 becomes a hit, will they extend it to Queensferry and see if it connects with the 43?

Really what is the benefit of this though? The X51 already offers an end to end connection in some capacity and also serves Kirkliston. I’d say to set up a connection with the 63 is probably a more realistic idea.

Much like Ratho, you’d be asking West Lothian Council to subsidise an Edinburgh Council problem.

If you look at the local economies, nothing really jumps out at me for large volumes of people to go between the intermediate places and South Queensferry. Yes sure there’s a few smaller things, but nothing major. Therefore for West Lothian Council to justify paying the costs for an extension far outweighs the benefits and potential return.

I’d rather see the 72 eventually extend to the Airport. Compared to the South Queensferry example with the X51, the 902 only offers a handful of connections and with respect the Airport has a much bigger passenger traffic flow than South Queensferry ever will. I’m talking purely just to go to South Queensferry. The Airport as we all know is a large centre of employment and has large volumes of traffic. An Airport extension would likely work as a commercial extension, but would also be something within the remit of West Lothian Council.

 

[danielhogg2005]

If the 72 gains enough passangers then it should have a frequency increase to every 30 minutes Monday to Saturday, the X40 I think should be fine as an hourly service but that's my opinion.

I’d rather see the 72 eventually extend to the Airport.

I think the 72 is fine as it is, if Lothian Country where to ever add a West Lothian connection with the Airport they would most Likely try make it fit in with Skylink under a number like the 500 or 600 but that will most likely not happen, the journey time will most likely be too long anyway and Citylink 902 Service gets to the Airport in 20-30 and with it stopping in Livingston Centre it connects to basically all local services in West Lothian.

 

[FlybeDash8Q400]

I think the 72 is fine as it is, if Lothian Country where to ever add a West Lothian connection with the Airport they would most Likely try make it fit in with Skylink under a number like the 500 or 600 but that will most likely not happen, the journey time will most likely be too long anyway and Citylink 902 Service gets to the Airport in 20-30 and with it stopping in Livingston Centre it connects to basically all local services in West Lothian.

I think you’re missing my point. The 72 would connect Uphall, Broxburn, Winchburgh and Kirkliston with the Airport and not so much Livingston. The route merely extends to Livingston to offer the contracted connections at the request of the council. In West Lothian’s case, if you’re travelling to the Airport you want a direct route too and not one bus to get another. In this example you’d likely end up driving. If you’re travelling from close to Livingston Centre or the Fastlink you would almost certainly use the 902 over an extended 72, but that wouldn’t be the 72’s purpose in that area.

Do I think any extension is likely? I agree, probably not. Adding in Deer Park is all I could realistically see happening going forward.

 

[overthewater]

I don't think the 72 will be touch until next year and Lothian will just let the route bed in.

Personnel Lothian would be better off trying to solve the 43, that service is getting worse by the week and shouldn't take an hour to get end to end in this day and age. More and more people seem to be trying to catch the Stagecoach services at the Bridge tolls.

 

[TheEastCoaster]

Really what is the benefit of this though? The X51 already offers an end to end connection in some capacity and also serves Kirkliston. I’d say to set up a connection with the 63 is probably a more realistic idea.

Much like Ratho, you’d be asking West Lothian Council to subsidise an Edinburgh Council problem.

Well unless Lothian Country end up getting the 63 at some point I won't hold my breath on the possibility of an extension, even if the X51 does the job.

If it works out or not I can't comment. Technically the 7 already offers a link direct to West Lothian and Queensferry but if that ends up getting lost along the long what will replace it?

 

[overthewater]

Well unless LCB end up getting the 63 at somepoint I won't hold my breath on the possibility of an extension, even if the X51 does the job!

If it works out or not I can't comment, technically the 7 already offers a link direct to West Lothian and Queensferry but if that ends up getting lost along the long what will replace it?

Nothing will replace the 7, the only reason the 7 was kept was because Edinburgh council paid for that section. The only issue with the X51 is, it does not operate at 7am or at 8pm so to useful journeys will disappear once the 7 goes.

 

[FlybeDash8Q400]

Well unless Lothian Country end up getting the 63 at some point I won't hold my breath on the possibility of an extension, even if the X51 does the job.

Overall I do think any changes of an extension are pretty low. However, I do expect the service to be well used and if all goes to plan maybe a frequency increase comes along in a couple of years time?

 

[DespacitoPlayz]

I think the 72 is fine as it is, if Lothian Country where to ever add a West Lothian connection with the Airport they would most Likely try make it fit in with Skylink under a number like the 500 or 600 but that will most likely not happen, the journey time will most likely be too long anyway and Citylink 902 Service gets to the Airport in 20-30 and with it stopping in Livingston Centre it connects to basically all local services in West Lothian.

I agree! I think if there was an extension to the 72 (if it was a big hit) then it wouldn't be until 2024, even 2025 to an extent. I personally think the 72 is excellent and will help Kirkliston/Winchburgh get a sufficient connection to Livingston Centre/Bus Station!

 

[dcsprior]

The new development at Old Craighall includes a P&R which presumably intended as a new bus terminus.

Does it?

I know there's land reserved for that purpose, but I thought it was future-proofing rather than actually being built along with the development.

 

[TheEastCoaster]

I agree! I think if there was an extension to the 72 (if it was a big hit) then it wouldn't be until 2024, even 2025 to an extent. I personally think the 72 is excellent and will help Kirkliston/Winchburgh get a sufficient connection to Livingston Centre/Bus Station!

Well yeah, I do think it's all a matter of how well used the 72 will get! and I'm holding out hope that it will be a hit along with the X40