ESR - AWS cancelling board location

[MrsCake21]

Hi all,

With reference to an ESR, on a bi-di line, can I ask where the cancelling board goes? There are 2 aws warning alerts. One for the emergency indicator and one for the warning board. So coming in the opposite direction, where would you get the cancelling board? After the 2nd one?

What is the distance between the 2 warnings?

Can a ESR be spate boarded when finished ? Would you require 3 spate boards? 2 for the warnings and 1 for the speed itself?

If an ESR lasts more than 3 days, does it get re-issued on the late notice board?

Thanks

 

[Tilting007]

Rule book will show 200m but it should be 4 secs at Linespeed.

ESR won’t be SPATE. It would be removed.

ESR should be in the late notice case as soon as it is issues.

 

[driver9000]

When an ESR is no longer needed it is removed and a cancellation notice is issued.

 

[Tomnick]

Hi all,

With reference to an ESR, on a bi-di line, can I ask where the cancelling board goes? There are 2 aws warning alerts. One for the emergency indicator and one for the warning board. So coming in the opposite direction, where would you get the cancelling board? After the 2nd one?

What is the distance between the 2 warnings?

Can a ESR be spate boarded when finished ? Would you require 3 spate boards? 2 for the warnings and 1 for the speed itself?

If an ESR lasts more than 3 days, does it get re-issued on the late notice board?

Thanks

There should be two cancelling indicators, one normally approx 180m (or minimum 45m) beyond the magnet for the warning board, and the other the same distance beyond the magnet for the emergency indicator.

 

[greatkingrat]

In practice, particularly on bi-directional lines, the ESRs are set up incorrectly more often than not!

 

[MrsCake21]

Rule book will show 200m but it should be 4 secs at Linespeed.

ESR won’t be SPATE. It would be removed.

ESR should be in the late notice case as soon as it is issues.

And 2 cancelling indicators?

 

[Tilting007]

And 2 cancelling indicators?

One for each magnet so normally two…

 

[dk1]

In practice, particularly on bi-directional lines, the ESRs are set up incorrectly more often than not!

Yes I notice that quite a bit. Not many including myself bother to report it.

 

[800301]

Yes I notice that quite a bit. Not many including myself bother to report it.

It always makes you wonder when one appears and then removed and then comes back with speed board in the same location but everything else different, with ATP there are times it will warble at you before you’ve even passed the warning board

 

[Annetts key]

It always makes you wonder when one appears and then removed and then comes back with speed board in the same location but everything else different, with ATP there are times it will warble at you before you’ve even passed the warning board

Don't mention the chaos and confusion when a ESR or TSR is implemented near a signal AWS or within an ATP area... It took years for our local P.Way to get their heads around the requirements. Then we had to educate control as well...

With ATP the standard required the signal on approach to the warning board to be configured to "do" the unsupervised ESR stuff in the cab. Sometimes the previous signal as well.

Even with a programmed TSR (a supervised speed restriction), sometimes the commencement board or the termination board were not put in the same place that the planning documents stated. The ATP of course was programmed to the details in the planning documents. More than once the boards had to be moved.

Once, the P.Way got a bit carried away and did too much work (yeah, I know, unlikely but it happened). The termination board was some distance beyond where the work was supposed to have ended. Hence the ATP was giving the driver a target speed above that of the TSR speed.

This was the only time where I could confirm that the ATP was giving the train a higher speed than what was marked on the ground. That gave us a dilemma. Immediately new parameter plugs (chips) were ordered. But they take two to three days to get to us. So what to do in the meantime?

 

[800301]

This was the only time where I could confirm that the ATP was giving the train a higher speed than what was marked on the ground. That gave us a dilemma. Immediately new parameter plugs (chips) were ordered. But they take two to three days to get to us. So what to do in the meantime?

Leaving Swindon P1 and 3 in the Up Direction ATP will step up quite some time before you’ve cleared the junction but from what I’ve been told it’s always been that way

 

[Pyewipecarshed]

If an ESR lasts more than 3 days, does it get re-issued on the late notice board?

The 72 hour limit in the notice case doesn't apply to ESRs. They are displayed either until the problem is repaired and the speed limit lifted, or until they can be published in the Weekly Operating Notice as a temporary speed restriction. In the latter case the ESR is converted to a TSR with removal of the Emergency Indicator ("dalek") on the start date of the relevant WON.

 

[Falcon1200]

Don't mention the chaos and confusion when a ESR or TSR is implemented near a signal AWS or within an ATP area... It took years for our local P.Way to get their heads around the requirements. Then we had to educate control as well...

TSR and ESR arrangements were, and probably still are, a never-ending source of potential confusion to all involved! Control sometimes had to educate those outside (to be fair, more often PW rather than S&T staff) on what could and could not be done...