EWR, Universal and Wixams

[flitwickbeds]

If you had carte blanche with the area around Kempston Hardwick/Wixams and with the EWR project in the back of your mind, what would you do and why?

I see two options (other than the status quo, which will probably involve shuttle buses from Bedford/Flitwick to the park)

1
a) Build Wixams as planned, with all the limited access/services/flexibility that entails. AIUI there is only a matter of weeks left to secure s106 payments. Without that, the project is dead, and it's too late to replan anything now.
b) Build a new piece of track connecting the Midland Main Line and the Marston Vale Line, on land between Stewartby and Kempston Hardwick village. Curves both north and south onto both lines.
c) On the site of Kempston Hardwick Station, build a new terminating platform for 8 or even 12 car Thameslink trains. Rename this station Universal Studios Park.
d) Reduce Bedford Thameslink services from 4tph to 3tph, so every 20 minutes.
e) Introduce a 1tph Thameslink train calling (London core) - St Pancras - St Albans - Luton Parkway or Luton - Universal Studios Park and reverse
f) Introduce a 1tph Bedford to Universal Studios Park shuttle on the alternative half-hour

2
a) Cancel the current Wixams station and accept the s106 money is lost.
b) Make (more) s106 money a condition on Universal of building the park to do Wixams properly - 4 platforms, which means no service limitations.
c) Build a walkway from Wixams across the road straight into the park
d) Build a new track from just north of Broadmead Road on the Marston Vale Line connecting to both northbound and southbound junctions off the Midland Main Line
d) Close Kempston Hardwick and Bedford St Johns stations entirely as well as the track between Stewartby and Bedford, and instead route EWR trains through the new Wixams station and into Bedford on the existing (perhaps 6 tracked) Midland Main Line.

Thoughts?

 

[30907]

1d. The Thameslink service - and therefore the whole Brighton and Midland main lines - is based on 15/30 minute interval services, so you couldn't change to 3tph. You would have to overlay the fast service onto the existing timetable.

2d/e. You definitely don't want EWR services joining the Midland fast lines, so you would have to build a flyover/burrowing junction. The existing route may not be perfect but it does the job, though I realise Marston Vale-Luton might be quicker via Wixams.

 

[flitwickbeds]

1d. The Thameslink service - and therefore the whole Brighton and Midland main lines - is based on 15/30 minute interval services, so you couldn't change to 3tph. You would have to overlay the fast service onto the existing timetable.

I did consider suggesting the new Thameslink service to Universal kept the path and stopping pattern of the fourth train until Flitwick then went off to Universal (instead of Bedford) but that increases journey time from London to Universal.

You're right about the west side joining onto the fast lines, which I hadn't considered. Don't know if there's room for 6 tracks from that proposed junction to Bedford, if so the two new tracks could start on the west for EWR, the gradually slew everything into Bedford?

 

[AlastairFraser]

I see two options (other than the status quo, which will probably involve shuttle buses from Bedford/Flitwick to the park)

If the park is big enough, why not a tram linking the park, Wixams and Kempston Hardwick? Most of the route would be a blank slate, so shouldn't be that difficult to deal with utilities.

 

[Bald Rick]

If the park is big enough, why not a tram linking the park, Wixams and Kempston Hardwick? Most of the route would be a blank slate, so shouldn't be that difficult to deal with utilities.

Exactly. Or more likely, a regular people mover, like lots of other theme parks. The distance from Wixams to the park is likely to be less than the Alton Towers monorail, and an order of magnitude smaller than the monorails at Walt Disney World Resort in Orlando.

No need to spend hundreds of millions on rail infrastructure.

 

[AlastairFraser]

Exactly. Or more likely, a regular people mover, like lots of other theme parks. The distance from Wixams to the park is likely to be less than the Alton Towers monorail, and an order of magnitude smaller than the monorails at Walt Disney World Resort in Orlando.

No need to spend hundreds of millions on rail infrastructure.

Agreed.
However, the only issue with people movers is they seem to be extraordinarily expensive to build in this country, if you look at the recent Luton DART project!

 

[Bald Rick]

Agreed.
However, the only issue with people movers is they seem to be extraordinarily expensive to build in this country, if you look at the recent Luton DART project!

That was quite an outlier, being built almost entirely on viaduct or tunnel.

 

[AlastairFraser]

That was quite an outlier, being built almost entirely on viaduct or tunnel.

That's a fair point, although I can't think of any other recent UK new people mover tbf

 

[flitwickbeds]

Exactly. Or more likely, a regular people mover, like lots of other theme parks. The distance from Wixams to the park is likely to be less than the Alton Towers monorail, and an order of magnitude smaller than the monorails at Walt Disney World Resort in Orlando.

No need to spend hundreds of millions on rail infrastructure.

But, Wixams as it will currently be built, is a half-arsed job with many sacrifices to rail service, infrastructure flexibility, and land use simply to meet the s106 deadline and get anything built there.

This includes not stopping any trains there from 10pm every night, and many weekends.

 

[Stephen42]

But, Wixams as it will currently be built, is a half-arsed job with many sacrifices to rail service, infrastructure flexibility, and land use simply to meet the s106 deadline and get anything built there.

This includes not stopping any trains there from 10pm every night, and many weekends.

Most theme parks in this country shut well before 10pm, Alton Towers the latest is 9pm during the Halloween season and much more commonly 6pm.

If the theme park gets built, which is a big if, then can revisit the decision not to have fast line platforms with any money that provides. I wouldn't be surprised if it only slightly reduces the number of weekends as looks like full bus replacement is more common than Thameslink forced onto the fast lines. It might be more cost effective for Universal to commit to funding bus replacements calling at Wixams for days the park is open without service at the train station in that case.

 

[Bald Rick]

But, Wixams as it will currently be built, is a half-arsed job with many sacrifices to rail service, infrastructure flexibility, and land use simply to meet the s106 deadline and get anything built there.

This includes not stopping any trains there from 10pm every night, and many weekends.

But, this is nonsense. I’ll bet that if Wixams does get built, it has a service beyond 22:00 on day 1, and gets a service on almost as many weekends as Flitwick.

 

[dosxuk]

It would simply be crazy to try and build a station at this point which is suitable for use by the theme park.

There's no guarantee that the park will ever get built, or that the design won't mean a station built now isn't at completely the wrong location. It's a project, which if it goes ahead, will cost billions to build, with major infrastructure work required. Universal will want a station here, get them to pay for one which meets their requirements when they know what they need.

The best option is to build the "limited" station now. If the park goes ahead and it gets replaced using Universal's money then there's no loss. It'll be useful for the workers during the park construction phase anyway in it's limited form. If the park doesn't happen, then you've not lost out on having a station there.

 

[Energy]

Universal have released an information pack ready for consultation with the local residents, which contains some information on the planned transport connections. The document is well detailed but here are a few notable points.

Facilitating upgrades to local transport infrastructure

• The construction of Wixams railway station
• The delivery of a new station on the East West Rail line in close proximity to the resort
• Dedicated, direct slip roads from the A421 to accommodate circa 85% of our road traffic
• An upgraded Manor Road, to tie in with new railway bridge being delivered by Network Rail to replace the Manor Road level crossing
• Improvements and upgrade to the Active Travel Network

How would people travel to this site?

Our initial studies show that about 35% - 40% of visitors would travel to us by train [...] Around 10% of people would drive to the site, with a further 25% as passengers. The rest would come by bus, taxis or other methods of transport. We have built a comprehensive traffc model which has tested different scenarios, across both weekdays and weekends, and this shows the network can accommodate our demand. All car parking would be contained on-site and managed by Universal, and we are planning for around 4,200 spaces with an appropriate mix of electric vehicle charging points.

When would people travel to this site?

Most theme park arrivals occur in the morning, however, most departures are in the evening outside of the rush hour when demand has peaked on the surrounding transport networks. Travel to theme parks is often countercyclical, with people arriving on trains that would otherwise be relatively empty –trains leaving London in the morning is one key example of where the resort can make use of available existing capacity on the transport network.

The stations themselves are unknown other than that they will not exceed 30m in height.

All of this is subject to final sign off of the park.

 

[Bald Rick]

Interesting document.

It assuems that around the same number of people will arrvive by train (35-40%) as by cars that are parked there (35%), with an average of 3.5 people per car (10% drivers, 25% passengers). Parking provision is 4,200 spaces; unclear if this is all parking or just visitors. Assuming the latter, that implies a maximum of 14,700 visitors arriving by car on the very busiest days. Assuming a simila rnumber by train, with most across a 4 hour period in the morning (as their arrivals graphs show), thats around 5000 in bound per hour at the very busiest. And more usually rather less than this. In my opinion, that’s within the rail capacity that will exist by the time this opens (Thameslink and EWR)

 

[richieb1971]

I wonder if Wixams will stay a 2 platform station with no bays?

I also wonder if Kempston Hardwick will get bay platforms.

 

[Bald Rick]

I wonder if Wixams will stay a 2 platform station with no bays?

I also wonder if Kempston Hardwick will get bay platforms.

I would expect Kempston Hardwick to close, and a new station open closer to the park entrance. No point in bays.

 

[richieb1971]

I would expect Kempston Hardwick to close, and a new station open closer to the park entrance. No point in bays.

No bays implies no special services for shuttles from and to Bedford and reliance on EWR for Kempston Hardwick. I suppose Forders sidings can be adapated for such purposes. Not like its doing anything at the moment.

 

[wanderingriver]

Universal have released an information pack ready for consultation with the local residents, which contains some information on the planned transport connections. The document is well detailed but here are a few notable points.

Facilitating upgrades to local transport infrastructure


How would people travel to this site?


When would people travel to this site?


View attachment 155907

View attachment 155910

The stations themselves are unknown other than that they will not exceed 30m in height.

All of this is subject to final sign off of the park.

I wonder if they are going to do some sort of shuttle between Luton and the park. Even if they don’t, they’ll be more people flying into Luton to get to the park from abroad

Moderator note: discussion regarding Luton Airport (and convenience of other airpors) continues at:

Could Luton Airport see a large increase in passengers, and how convenient is it compared to other airports?

Moderator note: Split from https://www.railforums.co.uk/threads/ewr-universal-and-wixams.265356/page-2#post-6724317 Universal have released an information pack ready for consultation with the local residents, which contains some information on the planned transport connections. The document is...

www.railforums.co.uk

 

[Bald Rick]

No bays implies no special services for shuttles from and to Bedford and reliance on EWR for Kempston Hardwick. I suppose Forders sidings can be adapated for such purposes. Not like its doing anything at the moment.

No point in special shuttles from Bedford, with 4tph on the MML and at least 3tph on EWR.

 

[Energy]

I would expect Kempston Hardwick to close, and a new station open closer to the park entrance. No point in bays.

I think you're correct, my interpretation of the map is that Kempston Hardwick would be lost when the level crossing is replaced with a bridge (unclear whether it's a road overbridge or underbridge).


Image Description: An image from Google Maps of Kempston Hardwick and an image of the same area from Universal's plans.

No bays implies no special services for shuttles from and to Bedford and reliance on EWR for Kempston Hardwick. I suppose Forders sidings can be adapated for such purposes. Not like its doing anything at the moment.

Universal's document mentions a lot about using spare capacity on the rail network (e.g. early morning trains are very quiet leaving London as most passengers are inbound, a lot of Universal's traffic will be on these quiet trains). Dedicated shuttles seem very unlikely.

 

[richieb1971]

If shuttles are unlikely, then the 2 stations would need to suffice as direct stopping stations and the length of trains would be cause for concern. As I understand EWR have 4 car trains planned with capacity in stations for up to 8.

I'm pretty sure the charter business will make something of this as well. Lets not forget them. The site will have a Harry Potter world, what better place to see the real thing.

 

[bluenoxid]

A station on EWR supports access from Oxford, which I understand is one of the key destinations for tourists.

The location also supports a relatively swift Universal to Disneyland switch. Check out from Marne-La-Valle and be wandering around Universal for the evening feels realistic as long as your visa is sorted.

 

[Bald Rick]

If shuttles are unlikely, then the 2 stations would need to suffice as direct stopping stations and the length of trains would be cause for concern.

?

They will, of course, “suffice”. 12 car trains on Thameslink will do the heavy lifting.

Out of interest what is a “direct stopping station”? Or an indirect one?

 

[richieb1971]

Well perhaps if the government wakes up or hands the reigns back. Or maybe a change of government , but who knows.

?

They will, of course, “suffice”. 12 car trains on Thameslink will do the heavy lifting.

Out of interest what is a “direct stopping station”? Or an indirect one?

Depends where your boarding. If coming from the north and 810s don't stop at Wixams you will need to change at Kettering and Bedford which will be heaps of fun for northerners. You assume everyone is coming from the south although I admit most will come from the south.

It's very interesting how much will change due to this park. Especially Bedford Station and the diagrams it will support post park being built.

As I stated in another thread the 810s will be better suited than the 222s but will there be enough capacity to carry crap tons on Saturdays and Sundays for universal? Will the 3 train journey still be required, will EMR help out?

 

[Bald Rick]

You assume everyone is coming from the south although I admit most will come from the south.

I’m not assuming that at all.

What I am assuming is that 3tph of EWR services will be sufficient to accommodate the passengers that are arriving by train from origins north of Bedford and are changing at Bedford.

 

[richieb1971]

I’m not assuming that at all.

What I am assuming is that 3tph of EWR services will be sufficient to accommodate the passengers that are arriving by train from origins north of Bedford and are changing at Bedford.

What about those north of Kettering do you think they will need 3 trains?

 

[Bald Rick]

What about those north of Kettering do you think they will need 3 trains?

sorry I don‘t understand the question.

 

[richieb1971]

sorry I don‘t understand the question.

Currently if you board at Leicester you need to change at Kettering since inter city trains don't stop south of Kettering. The Corby stopper will take you to Bedford and then you need a Thames link or EWR train to the park.

Do you think diagrams will change to support easier access to the park from the north?

 

[Bald Rick]

Currently if you board at Leicester you need to change at Kettering since inter city trains don't stop south of Kettering. The Corby stopper will take you to Bedford and then you need a Thames link or EWR train to the park.

Do you think diagrams will change to support easier access to the park from the north?

Maybe. Maybe not. It’s a decade away and lots can happen.

Changing trains to get to a tourist attraction is hardly unheard of.

 

[Energy]

Currently if you board at Leicester you need to change at Kettering since inter city trains don't stop south of Kettering. The Corby stopper will take you to Bedford and then you need a Thames link or EWR train to the park.

Do you think diagrams will change to support easier access to the park from the north?

Service level to Wixams hasn't been said and the current indicated level of only Thameslink was from the pre-Universal plans. A limited EMR service from Sheffield or Nottingham (e.g 1tp2h) could be a good idea and I'd suggest filling in the feedback form on Universal's website. The UK government is likely to move mountains to help the park (they've already offered to pay for the transport improvements) so ensuring a connection to those further north wouldn't be out of the question.