EWR, Universal and Wixams

[Magdalia]

The BBC News website has an article about the Universal theme park here:

What do we know about Universal Studios' Bedfordshire plans?

The US movie giant's plans reveal its theme park would be split into four main "zones", if approved.

www.bbc.co.uk

Universal Destinations and Experiences has movie-related resorts in places like Hollywood in the United States, Osaka in Japan and Beijing in China. It currently has its sights on a new theme park in Bedfordshire. What do we know so far?

A few highlights from the article:

In its information pack, Universal says if its plans went forward it would "help facilitate" a number of upgrades including:

• The construction of Wixams railway station
• The delivery of a new station on the East West Rail line near the resort
• Dedicated, direct slip roads from the A421 to accommodate circa 85% of its road traffic
• An upgraded Manor Road, to tie in with new railway bridge being delivered by Network Rail to replace the Manor Road level crossing

"This project would become one of the largest single employers in Bedford, the surrounding areas, and indeed the UK," the firm says in its information pack.
"Evidence from our other theme parks suggests that for every job supported within the theme park, it can be expected that at least 1.5 further jobs would be supported across the economy, meaning a net additional 20,000 jobs would be supported by the project at its peak."
Universal says it wants to employ "local residents first" and believes 75% of its workforce would come from Bedfordshire and Milton Keynes.

Universal has started a 28-day period of "public engagement".
It says it wants to know what those living in the area think of the resort idea before it makes an application for planning permission.
"Collaboration and community engagement remain at the core of how we do business around the world," the firm says in its letter to residents.
"This public engagement represents an important milestone in our feasibility work; however, it will still be some time before any decisions are made on whether or not to proceed with this project."
Public exhibitions will be held on Saturday from 11:00 until 16:00 BST at Kimberley College in Stewartby and on Tuesday from 16:30 until 20:00 at Bedford College's Modern Methods of Construction building.

 

[richieb1971]

I just heard from someone who attended the consultation that wixams was shown having 4 platforms. I cannot confirm it personally. Apparently universal mean business and everyone was impressed.

 

[Energy]

I just heard from someone who attended the consultation that wixams was shown having 4 platforms. I cannot confirm it personally.

Good to hear, I'll look around for a recorded version of this.

Apparently universal mean business and everyone was impressed.

Universal so far has been very impressive, getting the locals on their side can make the project a lot easier for them. Sweet-talking the locals with a new station and whatnot is comparatively cheap compared to the rest of the project, not a problem though as everybody wins.

Worth looking at EuroDisney / Disneyland Paris. Its first few years struggled, partly due to Disney's relations with the French public being poor.

 

[pbin]

I just heard from someone who attended the consultation that wixams was shown having 4 platforms. I cannot confirm it personally. Apparently universal mean business and everyone was impressed.

A 4 platform Wixams station would make more sense, so I hope it’s true. According to an attendee’s account of the consultation today posted on another forum, EMR is “really up for this” as it goes against traditional peak flows. They also mentioned that a direct St. Pancras to Wixams service is being looked into without stops in Luton… not sure whether that’s the best idea if airport traffic is one of the things they’d want to capitalise on, too.

Another thing worth noting is that the land for the new station on the Varisty/EWR seems to be on Universal’s land (according to the images released in their PDF).

Either way I’m really interested to see where this goes as the project as a whole has widespread support and will reportedly open in 2030. I’m hoping to be at the consultation on Tuesday.

 

[Failed Unit]

I am sure EMR will adjust the service patterns according if they feel that they will get business out of it. Which could of course be at the expense of other stations on the route.

I suspect if the demand exists the Corby services will certainly stop there. But if it makes more commercial sense then I am sure Kettering could be replaced with Wixam’s.

One thing is for certain, EMR will not run through non stop if demand exists. They will find a way to serve it. Even if it is for a few hours per day to provide a service for day trippers. But I suspect a stop on the Corby - London will probably suffice.

 

[JonathanH]

I suspect if the demand exists the Corby services will certainly stop there. But if it makes more commercial sense then I am sure Kettering could be replaced with Wixam’s.

Kettering is an interchange between Nottingham and Corby services. Wixams can't perform that role.

 

[Failed Unit]

Kettering is an interchange between Nottingham and Corby services. Wixams can't perform that role.

I am not going to dispute that, but if there is more demand for Wixams then the interchange between the Nottingham and Corby services they will move the stop.As you know the railway isn’t ran for the convenience of passengers it is ran to make the most money for the stakeholders.

 

[Mike395]

I am not going to dispute that, but if there is more demand for Wixams then the interchange between the Nottingham and Corby services they will move the stop.As you know the railway isn’t ran for the convenience of passengers it is ran to make the most money for the stakeholders.

If they did that, a wider recast of service patterns on the MML would be needed as Wellingborough - Leicester via Wixams would not be seen as acceptable.

 

[Failed Unit]

If they did that, a wider recast of service patterns on the MML would be needed as Wellingborough - Leicester via Wixams would not be seen as acceptable.

When you look at the proposed ECML re-cast and how difficult it going to make some “local” journeys as a result I don’t think dft will care. Unless there is a large demand travelling between Leicester (and further north) and Wellingborough, Kettering, Corby and Bedford.

Unless these flows are significant revenue generators they won‘t care about the inconveniences of minority flows.

 

[Mike395]

When you look at the proposed ECML re-cast and how difficult it going to make some “local” journeys as a result I don’t think dft will care. Unless there is a large demand travelling between Leicester (and further north) and Wellingborough, Kettering, Corby and Bedford.

Unless these flows are significant revenue generators they won‘t care about the inconveniences of minority flows.

Bedford isn't so bad - doubling back via Wixams is probably going to be broadly equivalent as now with overall times.

Wellingborough/Kettering combined to Leicester and beyond is probably a large enough flow that cutting all direct services would be problematic. I can see a scenario in reality where we might get a compromise between the two - one Nottingham semifast an hour calls Wixams and the other Kettering.

 

[Failed Unit]

Bedford isn't so bad - doubling back via Wixams is probably going to be broadly equivalent as now with overall times.

Wellingborough/Kettering combined to Leicester and beyond is probably a large enough flow that cutting all direct services would be problematic. I can see a scenario in reality where we might get a compromise between the two - one Nottingham semifast an hour calls Wixams and the other Kettering.

I guess with the timescales we are talking about before this all kicks off we could have a recast MML timetable anyway. The 810s will be fully introduced by then, traffic flows change. Another round of speculation of a London - Leicester all stops service etc.

 

[dosxuk]

I guess with the timescales we are talking about before this all kicks off we could have a recast MML timetable anyway. The 810s will be fully introduced by then, traffic flows change. Another round of speculation of a London - Leicester all stops service etc.

Indeed - with the timescales being talked about, Leicester may also be fully wired, opening the option of a split Leicester / Corby service.

 

[AlastairFraser]

Indeed - with the timescales being talked about, Leicester may also be fully wired, opening the option of a split Leicester / Corby service.

Electrifying Corby to Leicester via Oakham and Syston could provide a slow stopper into London (price people onto it using Advances) and significantly improve connectivity in the East Midlands.

 

[Doctor Fegg]

Electrifying Corby to Leicester via Oakham and Syston could provide a slow stopper into London (price people onto it using Advances) and significantly improve connectivity in the East Midlands.

Given that Oakham has an hourly service (with some 2-hour gaps), and Harringworth Viaduct has one train per day in each direction, I think there are better candidates for electrification!

 

[cle]

If the most grandiose version of the Bedford EWR rebuild happened (with ten platforms or whatever it was) - that should become the changing point vs Kettering, in terms of between fast and slow calls.

I also don't think both Corby-s needs both Luton calls. I would say Town/Midland could be dropped overall, with Airport Parkway staying. It's become a railhead and new focal hub as well as an airport station - and the airport keeps growing, inc the connector.

Wixams-Luton Airport might be a well used flow, although it might equally be more direct as a bus/coach from the terminal itself.

Wixams might be accommodated contra-peak on certain services. And I would think all EWR/Marston (obv) services would call on that line.

 

[A0]

Electrifying Corby to Leicester via Oakham and Syston could provide a slow stopper into London (price people onto it using Advances) and significantly improve connectivity in the East Midlands.

Slow would not be the word. Glacial would be more accurate. A National Express coach would be quicker.

 

[A0]

If the most grandiose version of the Bedford EWR rebuild happened (with ten platforms or whatever it was) - that should become the changing point vs Kettering, in terms of between fast and slow calls.

I also don't think both Corby-s needs both Luton calls. I would say Town/Midland could be dropped overall, with Airport Parkway staying. It's become a railhead and new focal hub as well as an airport station - and the airport keeps growing, inc the connector.

Wixams-Luton Airport might be a well used flow, although it might equally be more direct as a bus/coach from the terminal itself.

Wixams might be accommodated contra-peak on certain services. And I would think all EWR/Marston (obv) services would call on that line.

Bit in bold - which would totally destroy the journey times between Wellingborough, Kettering or Corby and Leicester.

Either way as has been pointed out many, many times before the purpose of EWR is not to provide links from places on the Midland Mainline to places on EWR, not least because virtually all of those links already exist and are quicker than they would be via EWR.

 

[richieb1971]

8000 full time employees announced. That's a lot more than I was expecting.

 

[JonathanH]

8000 full time employees announced. That's a lot more than I was expecting.

Many on wages around the minimum wage I would expect so looking to live close to their workplace to minimise transport costs.

 

[A0]

Many on wages around the minimum wage I would expect so looking to live close to their workplace to minimise transport costs.

And most likely will be bussed into and out of the site. People need to be a bit realistic here - the park is likely to run two or three shifts a day depending on its opening hours, for those either on early or late turns, the train is unlikely to be a viable option. A better comparison would be the many warehouses where there are buses aimed around the shift changes. For most of Bedford a direct bus would be quicker (and cheaper) than heading into town in order to board a train at Bedford Midland.

For workers at least I'd also expect buses from Milton Keynes to be laid on serving two or three of the residential areas and somewhere like Kingston en route to the park.

 

[Bald Rick]

Many on wages around the minimum wage I would expect so looking to live close to their workplace to minimise transport costs.

And most will be on shift work.

 

[AlastairFraser]

Given that Oakham has an hourly service (with some 2-hour gaps), and Harringworth Viaduct has one train per day in each direction, I think there are better candidates for electrification!

Better candidates, sure, but it would be one of the less expensive ways to partially solve the specific problem of limited EMR capacity on the southern MML.

Slow would not be the word. Glacial would be more accurate. A National Express coach would be quicker.

You'd be surprised. I've done London to Leicester on a coach .
It took 2 hours just to Fosse Park on the outskirts, where I had to catch a bus into the centre from. (Leicester via Corby would be probably around 5 mins under 2 hours).

The slower WMR option on the WCML from Crewe to London is regularly busy and proves that people will choose the slower option if suitably priced. Good for EMR as a way to use up spare capacity off peak beyond Kettering too.

If the cost of electrification was an issue, perhaps the distance would be feasible with addition of batteries with 50 mile range to the 360s.

Many on wages around the minimum wage I would expect so looking to live close to their workplace to minimise transport costs.

Sounds good for encouraging regular commuting from Bedford/MK on the Marston Vale/EWR then.

 

[richieb1971]

Always the optimists on this forum. The only optimistic thing I've read on this subject is that rail footfall will be so low that current trains will cope. When some of the current trains are ram packed without the park.

That everyone will come by car and that current roads will suffice, even though the 421 is an exit/bypass to relieve Bedford of its already heavily congested roads in the area.

Now, most jobs will be minimum wage

Live locally or not, they still need to arrive, or live on the grounds.

The biggest concern from locals is strain of infrastructure in the area. I back that up 100 percent. We already live in a world where enlarging the black cat roundabout with traffic lights was deemed an upgrade that did nothing only to be upgraded again 10 years later. That glossing the high street with new pavement with 20mph single way traffic would increase footfall, when in fact more shops closed and drivers got angry.

Sometimes top people make wrong decisions. They stand by them like politicians do, but they are still disastrous decisions.

I live and breathe Bedford. Taking an approach that Bedford will cope with this park as is, is ridiculous.

When this park opens the world will be watching. News reports of its first 6 months worldwide don't do us any favours if people need to leave at 4am because of congestion getting to the park. This is the UK on the global stage. How this park sells to the world is up to the decisions made now.

Road capacity, rail capacity, rail strikes, innovative new ideas other parks haven't explored are all on the table here. If universal are putting big ideas and money into this, the infrastructure needs to match.

 

[Failed Unit]

But when you look at the rail traffic flows, going South, Even in the peak the 12 car trains from Bedford have should be fine as they fill up as they get closer to London. So passengers leaving at Wixams will be replaced by passengers joining further South to get into London. I have used Thameslink going North from St Albans many times conta peak. They would need to create some serious demand to trouble the Thameslink services here.

I know they need to maintain the trains occasionally but they could extend the Luton - Rainham service onto Bedford should they need more capacity.

I would be surprised if the Thameslink network couldn’t absorb the traffic. Likewise EMRs London - Corby service should.

Traffic on the MML towards the Midlands is hard to comment on, as is the traffic generated on the Oxford - Cambridge route.

 

[richieb1971]

Universal are asking for upgrades on a few things. Length of trains, 2 extra platforms at Wixams and I assume some commitment from EWR.

EMR will have diagram changes if stopping at Wixams.

This is in stark contrast to what people think on here with a "that will do" attitude. The park will operate and affect other rail and road users. It's a bit silly to think it will not. This is not center parcs.

As I said elsewhere Bedford is bitcoin hq of Europe now. A movie studio a stones throw away is being built next to universal as well. I don't know why Bedford is suddenly the go to place to be honest. But for some reason everything is turning up here.

 

[Failed Unit]

Universal are asking for upgrades on a few things. Length of trains, 2 extra platforms at Wixams and I assume some commitment from EWR.

Surely they will be asked to pay for such upgrades as well, in the same way that developers of housing estates are asked to contribute to infrastructure improvements. If they are paying I doubt we will see push back on the infrastructure projects.

 

[richieb1971]

A report came out saying the government has taken over consultations on the business side. Which I believe means locals have less of a say. Or it could be for reassurances and fast tracking of legalisation.

I have a feeling deals are going on and it could mean infrastructure is tax paid. But I'm only speculating here. I'm not familiar with the processes but I do know that no international parks have hit the UK due to bureaucracy

 

[cle]

Bit in bold - which would totally destroy the journey times between Wellingborough, Kettering or Corby and Leicester.

Either way as has been pointed out many, many times before the purpose of EWR is not to provide links from places on the Midland Mainline to places on EWR, not least because virtually all of those links already exist and are quicker than they would be via EWR.

Just because you state it, doesn't mean people will use it as you describe. And things will evolve. Plus, look at those Kings Cross to Waterloo tube things...people will take different routes.

Bedford becoming an interchange between MML Fast and Corbys doesn't ruin journey times at all (did you think I meant Wixams - I meant the bigger, EWR-ed up Bedford Midland) - as I would remove some from Kettering.

 

[Energy]

When this park opens the world will be watching. News reports of its first 6 months worldwide don't do us any favours if people need to leave at 4am because of congestion getting to the park. This is the UK on the global stage. How this park sells to the world is up to the decisions made now.

Road capacity, rail capacity, rail strikes, innovative new ideas other parks haven't explored are all on the table here. If universal are putting big ideas and money into this, the infrastructure needs to match.

Universal has mentioned that they know that all eyes will be on them. If traffic is a nightmare they will struggle to get repeat visitors.

The park is planning a later closing time of 8+pm to avoid rush hour. By contrast, Thorpe Park closes at 5 pm and dumps all the traffic right in the middle of rush hour.

Universal are asking for upgrades on a few things. Length of trains, 2 extra platforms at Wixams and I assume some commitment from EWR.
[...]
If universal are putting big ideas and money into this, the infrastructure needs to match.
[...]
I have a feeling deals are going on and it could mean infrastructure is tax paid.

Mark Harper, the Secretary of State for Transport, has said that the government is willing to pay for road improvements. Universal appears to be on the same page and seems to be willing to fund rail, active travel, and some road (e.g Manor Road) improvements.

• The A421 sliproads apparently are expected to be funded by the highways authority, who are willing. [source]
• Black Cat roundabout is due to be upgraded with a proper intersection already.
• EMR are apparently really up for it [source]. They already have enough 360s for 12 cars all day but they'd need to put the pressure on Siemens on getting more units out.
• 4 platform Wixams isn't a surprise but I'm struggling to find a source.

I am concerned about the A421, its all over/underbridges but only 2 lanes. I could see it needing 3 in sections, from Google Maps this does not look prohibitive.

As I said elsewhere Bedford is bitcoin hq of Europe now. A movie studio a stones throw away is being built next to universal as well. I don't know why Bedford is suddenly the go to place to be honest. But for some reason everything is turning up here.

Its connectivity is great. The plot is a good size, reasonably flat, and being former industrial land its development isn't particularly controversial (it was already due to be developed).

Universal will want a park close enough to London but close enough that it competes with London for tourists.

A report came out saying the government has taken over consultations on the business side. Which I believe means locals have less of a say. Or it could be for reassurances and fast tracking of legalisation.

Universal wants a Special Development Order from the Government. The government will want the support of the locals and the country, it is their goal to be re-elected.

I'm not familiar with the processes but I do know that no international parks have hit the UK due to bureaucracy

Previous plans have often been very unpopular. London Resort failed to talk to locals well and would have been built on greenfield land.

Universal seems to have learned, sending the corporate high-ups directly to talk to locals redeveloping former industrial land and returning some of it to wildlife.

Local concerns (which you'll know better than me!) appear to be more related to infrastructure than the park itself.

 

[Bald Rick]

always the optimists on this forum. The only optimistic thing I've read on this subject is that rail footfall will be so low that current trains will cope. When some of the current trains are ram packed without the park.

Which trains are ram packed approaching wixams, from which direction and at what time? and how does that compare to the expected flows to / from the park?

That everyone will come by car

Where has anyone said that, can you quote it please?